thorne Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 we have been still evolving go look at AVG Heights. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HAOLE Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 I am under no doubt its real, I just am not like many other out there that feal that the bible has to be correct to a T because If Ia ccept that then I must accept many mathmatical things to be so wrong its not funny. If we used bible math we would all be dead right now from nuclear blunders. You are so far "off" I dont even know were to start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HAOLE Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 we have been still evolving go look at AVG Heights. That is NOT evolution!!!!!!! We eat different now than we did 200 years ago. Did you ever stop to think that that is a US only thing. The average height charts are for the US not world wide. As nations are westernized that happens. Look at Japan they have gotten taller with the influx of western diets. Please go read the works of Dr. Price, Dr. Pottenger, and Dr. Lee. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thorne Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 really and the enviroment including food around us has not changed us. Please explain why we have a apidex. SEE Gizard. Also the math statement i made Is APT. PI does not = 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HAOLE Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 really and the enviroment including food around us has not changed us. Please explain why we have a apidex. SEE Gizard. Also the math statement i made Is APT. PI does not = 3 I have said it once I and I will say it again, your bible interpretation technique are not correct. You look at the bible with todays eyes not the time when it was written. Just think if the bible would have said in it you should not listen to "rock" music.... Just think of what the reader even 150 years ago would have thought. you need to read the bible in the context it was written. To the people 2-6K years ago 3 was close enough. As a matter of fact they did not have the equipment to take pi it the 20th decimal point. Even if the bible said it was 3.14 you would still say it was wrong because they did not say it was 3.14159xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Jones Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 Well .... If they were the second coming I don't think that they could build an institution to hold them if God wants them out. You are gullible too, just in the reverse. You and many others here have a religion, the head of the church is Satan and the main doctrine is evolution. The Lie of evolution is nothing more than Satans attempt to fool you. Your right, I'd much rather believe that a mythical being produced the origin of all life. Rather, he created man, and then woman from man. Then, mass incest occured for 1000's of years. Yeah, that sounds pretty pleasant too! Sounds like god is from the south.. the deep south. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thorne Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 Its frustrating that extreme faithful people do not feel thers a place for science in religion. It's that reason that Christianity has a smaller adaption by the scientific people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest FooFooMaru Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 Just for a moment remember 99.9% of all species on this planet have died, we are next. Sorry God has nothing to do with (our) fate, be it global warming, a gama ray burst (our solar system is full of netron stars) It is silly to think that anything on this planet is permenent. If we don't do our selfs in, the universe will. Your old collector car and fast EVO will also not out live us. So to believe in a "Christain" God is just silly Darwin was right evolution is and always will be what is going on with living creatures. It isn't about how long you live on earth. It's where you go and how long you live afterwards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Jones Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 http://www.cavalierdaily.com/.Archives/2000/11/14/aenicky.gif Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest FooFooMaru Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 Its frustrating that extreme faithful people do not feel thers a place for science in religion. It's that reason that Christianity has a smaller adaption by the scientific people. You need to get updated then. There is a place for science. It depends on what you're talking about. John Clayton came and talked to our church and at our local HS and he is a great guy that thought all was false until he actually Researched it to the bone. This is a small website about him and the dinos. But he talked a lot about how science and faith together. http://www.bible.ca/tracks/b-john-clayton-does-god-exist.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest FooFooMaru Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 http://www.cavalierdaily.com/.Archives/2000/11/14/aenicky.gif awww, I want to watch it now.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thorne Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 GOOD READ !!!!!!, But just wait rick will tear into it how its not biblicaly accurate and shit. I know because I'm a Theoistic Evolution believer. This matches up with me quite a bit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Hal Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 Got partly through this and got bored. All I have to say is, I'll stop believing when you can prove to me there is no God. I can't prove there is one, you can't prove there is not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thorne Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 Got partly through this and got bored. All I have to say is, I'll stop believing when you can prove to me there is no God. I can't prove there is one, you can't prove there is not. I agree. The sad part is one way to look at it upsets evangelicals. Is its a safer bet .... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HAOLE Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 You need to get updated then. There is a place for science. It depends on what you're talking about. John Clayton came and talked to our church and at our local HS and he is a great guy that thought all was false until he actually Researched it to the bone. This is a small website about him and the dinos. But he talked a lot about how science and faith together. http://www.bible.ca/tracks/b-john-clayton-does-god-exist.htm No I do not agree with him....... here is why.... Genesis 1:1 is an undated verse. No time element is given and no details of what the Earth looked like are included. It could have taken place in no time at all, or God may have used eons of time to accomplish his objectives. Genesis 1:1 is dated.... it says in the beginning. That means from the start before time was a factor. Genesis 1:2 covers what the earth looked like. It was without form and filled with darkness. John has worked on this concept for well over twenty years. As he has done so, he has modified it in order to make it fit whatever data happen to be in vogue at the time. So the guy flaps what ever way the latest "science points him" I would just stick with the bible read it for what it says... The book is NEVER wrong. The article is like the serpent in the garden, it cast doubt on God's word therefore opening the bible up to be read in what ever fashion suite you at the time. The bible says that people will do what is right in their own minds even though it is contrary to the Word. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V8 Beast Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 Let me break it down for you all the way I see it. Computers have a memory, a power source, parts that distribute the power, the ability to adapt and learn, and can reproduce themselves if programmed to.... Humans have a brain, use food as a power source, we have parts that distribute the power to other parts of our body, we have the ability to learn and adapt, and we reproduce. With advances in medicine we are very close to being able to swap out body parts as if a bad heart is like a wire with a short in it. If we can build/repair humans beings, why couldnt someone have made us? I have been able to see the future through occasional dreams ever since I was a little kid. When I finally talked to my mom about it she told me my grandmother did as well. To prove it to my wife I had her take note of a dream I had one night. 1 year later it happened and completely freaked her out. I can see both sides, but I do think that science can only explain so much. Some things just cant be proved... yet. Can someone tell me why I can see things that havnt happened yet? Are we in a glass jar on some kids counter? Were we a science experiment that earned some alien life form a promotion at work? No one knows so until then you can all have different views and beliefs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Steve Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 Let me break it down for you all the way I see it. Computers have a memory, a power source, parts that distribute the power, the ability to adapt and learn, and can reproduce themselves if programmed to.... Humans have a brain, use food as a power source, we have parts that distribute the power to other parts of our body, we have the ability to learn and adapt, and we reproduce. With advances in medicine we are very close to being able to swap out body parts as if a bad heart is like a wire with a short in it. If we can build/repair humans beings, why couldnt someone have made us? I have been able to see the future through occasional dreams ever since I was a little kid. When I finally talked to my mom about it she told me my grandmother did as well. To prove it to my wife I had her take note of a dream I had one night. 1 year later it happened and completely freaked her out. I can see both sides, but I do think that science can only explain so much. Some things just cant be proved... yet. Can someone tell me why I can see things that havnt happened yet? Are we in a glass jar on some kids counter? Were we a science experiment that earned some alien life form a promotion at work? No one knows so until then you can all have different views and beliefs. That is a family curse! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
copperhead Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 I can't prove there is one, you can't prove there is not. And that's why I am agnostic. That, and my complete lack of giving a shit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImUrOBGYN Posted October 1, 2007 Author Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 And that's why I am agnostic. That, and my complete lack of giving a shit. I was just about to say this. And Rick, I think I understand now. The reason so many put so much blind faith in religion and some books written by humans, is because you have to think like those people from a few thousand years ago? That's seems a bit silly. Well, let's try it anyway... Ok, it's a few thousand years ago. I don't understand hardly a thing around me, how it works, my world is a complete mystery. I condemn anything I do not understand. If I can't explain it, I need to make something up to explain it to others. Ooh, there are lights in the sky and they are destryong Sodom and Ghamorra (sp?). It must be chariots of fire with angels on it. No, it must be aliens attacking the cities. (You see, I was the guy standing across from the guy who wrote about the angels. But you see, from my pov, it was aliens. Now, I could do this for days. And not just alien/angel comparos. You see, I have read the Bible and studied it. Not just by myself, but with others. And not just part of it. Not many "Christians", etc. can even truly say that. (But see how many will anyway. ) I find it funny how, for lack of a better encompassing description, religious folk talk about faith and believing in something that cannot be proven and then in the same breath tell us how we are supposed to believe the written word and everything it says because it's... What? What is it? The Absolute End All Truth? How can you say that if it's faith based? Many have faith in science, but you shoot them down and it not being truth. So your faith is already "better" than ours? lol Are we supposed to just have 'faith' that it's completely correct? Then why not faith in something else that can't be proven and it be just as right. Fuck, I'm actually laughing out loud, right now. Double standards, lies, misdirection, hypocrisy... If I'm to have faith, then it's open to interpretation; interpretation of the writings of people from thousands of years ago who had no concrete way of explaining the events around them. If this is so, then my faith can be whatever I interpret it as and how can you or anyone else tell me otherwise? If you have no proof, you yourself do not know the truth and have no argument here. Let's just say that the bible wasn't created as a "Guide To Control the Human Population". Yet, there still remains a problem. It is a very cryptic book left completely open to interpretation. So again, how can you or anyone else tell me exactly what it's saying? I mean, in this line of thinking, aliens did exist as well as flying ships long before "The Written Word" was created. I'll explain this quickly. Interpretations of the ancient languages of quite a few discovered civilizations in both the western and eastern hemispheres. So, is someone going to tell me these interpretations are wrong? Please, I'm waiting. I'm waiting for all these questions to be answered. I truly believe religion is, get ready for it, part of our evolution as a species. I'll again, quickly try to explain. I think we needed (and may still need to a certain extent) religion to help us establish a moral guide, so to speak. As someone who believes in evolution and the literal proof of bones of other species of homo (you know what homo I mean ), we have developed in a very violent world. Having faith put us above the animals around us and gave us rules to follow to help curb that violence and it gave some of us direction and something to look forward to/something bigger, some kind of meaning. But as we continue to evolve as a people, we're learning these values and learning to implement them without the need of religion. Eventually, it'll be religion that will need to go as it will hamper our development if it is not already. Actually, it took about 2 seconds to think of a dozen different ways that it has. (I'm not even considering the fact there has been more wars and killings in the name of God than anything else.) And don't give me that, well, it's tainted by human touch but religion itself is good. Well, guess what. That can be said of everything. And religion itself has been touch and created by man. And man is not infallible. But wait! We are created in the image of God. So, is god just like us/we are just like god? If I learn to use all my brain, will I be a god? Will you have to worship me? My ex wife and I created a daughter. Are we gods already? If god knows everything, why didn't he know we were gonna fuck up in Eden? Or that Jesus would die on the cross? And was that really the Jews fault or the Romans? If he's so perfect and jealousy and envy, murder, etc are wrong, then why is he a jealous god? How could an omnipotent creature like that be jealous of anything? Man, again I could go on for days and days and days. Yes, I'm sure a couple of you could give me an answer to some of these questions. Hell, I could. I'm also sure, half of the answers would carry as much weight as air and be along the lines of "it's true because I believe it is". And I'm spent. Too much typing for something that won't matter anyway. lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest FooFooMaru Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 *quote from imurobgyn didn't want to quote the whole thing. So you believe religion is an "evolving tool" we must/possibly use to get past all of this crap going on? That once we say "hey...lol that's fake, wanna hold hands?!" then all wil be well? The only reason people are having wars is because of religion? The ONLY reason? There are more factors and religion may be a part of it but that doesn't put it to blame. We are made in the image of God, so we most likely get what we feel from him, but seeing how we aren't perfect, we don't hold ourselves quite like he does. I believe he knew everything that happened before it happened. Everything happens for a reason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImUrOBGYN Posted October 1, 2007 Author Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 *quote from imurobgyn didn't want to quote the whole thing. So you believe religion is an "evolving tool" we must/possibly use to get past all of this crap going on? That once we say "hey...lol that's fake, wanna hold hands?!" then all wil be well? The only reason people are having wars is because of religion? The ONLY reason? There are more factors and religion may be a part of it but that doesn't put it to blame. We are made in the image of God, so we most likely get what we feel from him, but seeing how we aren't perfect, we don't hold ourselves quite like he does. I believe he knew everything that happened before it happened. Everything happens for a reason. I'm saying it could be an evolving tool. Hell if I know. I'm just a human. And nowhere did I make such sweeping statements about the loss of religion or religion being the only thing we war over. You're worse than my gf, don't put words in my mouth. And thx for not quoting the whole thing. It really was a long, rambling thing of a post. lol It doesn't matter. None of this matters. None of us knows the truth. We only think we do. More than likely, nobody's going to make some life changing decision on their core beliefs after reading a thread on CR. Same goes for politics. That's why debates on politics and religion are so heated. Something that has such a huge affect on our lives and really, the majority of us truly don't know a damn thing. Like I said, none of this matters. So, everyone try to keep that in mind. Let the debate continue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HAOLE Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 I was just about to say this. And Rick, I think I understand now. The reason so many put so much blind faith in religion and some books written by humans, is because you have to think like those people from a few thousand years ago? That's seems a bit silly. Well, let's try it anyway... the bible was written by 43 authors, contains 66 books, over a period of 1800 years. The authors lived in different regions, spoke different languages, and most never met. I would challenge to people on this board to try to writ a story about any given subject with out conversing at all. I wonder how the two stories would look. I don't think they would mesh like the bible does. I truly believe religion is, get ready for it, part of our evolution as a species. I'll again, quickly try to explain. I think we needed (and may still need to a certain extent) religion to help us establish a moral guide, so to speak. As someone who believes in evolution and the literal proof of bones of other species of homo (you know what homo I mean ), we have developed in a very violent world. Having faith put us above the animals around us and gave us rules to follow to help curb that violence and it gave some of us direction and something to look forward to/something bigger, some kind of meaning. But as we continue to evolve as a people, we're learning these values and learning to implement them without the need of religion. Eventually, it'll be religion that will need to go as it will hamper our development if it is not already. Interesting thought. I would say if you are correct we are in a lot of trouble. The natural tendency for any thing over time is to degrade. Look at our society now, it is not getting better, we are losing the moral ground. Our standards in just the last 40 years continue to get worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thorne Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 That is a family curse! The problem with those type of feelings is you can obsess on them and people will think your mad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thorne Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 I was just about to say this. And Rick, I think I understand now. The reason so many put so much blind faith in religion and some books written by humans, is because you have to think like those people from a few thousand years ago? That's seems a bit silly. Well, let's try it anyway... Ok, it's a few thousand years ago. I don't understand hardly a thing around me, how it works, my world is a complete mystery. I condemn anything I do not understand. If I can't explain it, I need to make something up to explain it to others. Ooh, there are lights in the sky and they are destryong Sodom and Ghamorra (sp?). It must be chariots of fire with angels on it. No, it must be aliens attacking the cities. (You see, I was the guy standing across from the guy who wrote about the angels. But you see, from my pov, it was aliens. Now, I could do this for days. And not just alien/angel comparos. You see, I have read the Bible and studied it. Not just by myself, but with others. And not just part of it. Not many "Christians", etc. can even truly say that. (But see how many will anyway. ) I find it funny how, for lack of a better encompassing description, religious folk talk about faith and believing in something that cannot be proven and then in the same breath tell us how we are supposed to believe the written word and everything it says because it's... What? What is it? The Absolute End All Truth? How can you say that if it's faith based? Many have faith in science, but you shoot them down and it not being truth. So your faith is already "better" than ours? lol Are we supposed to just have 'faith' that it's completely correct? Then why not faith in something else that can't be proven and it be just as right. Fuck, I'm actually laughing out loud, right now. Double standards, lies, misdirection, hypocrisy... If I'm to have faith, then it's open to interpretation; interpretation of the writings of people from thousands of years ago who had no concrete way of explaining the events around them. If this is so, then my faith can be whatever I interpret it as and how can you or anyone else tell me otherwise? If you have no proof, you yourself do not know the truth and have no argument here. Let's just say that the bible wasn't created as a "Guide To Control the Human Population". Yet, there still remains a problem. It is a very cryptic book left completely open to interpretation. So again, how can you or anyone else tell me exactly what it's saying? I mean, in this line of thinking, aliens did exist as well as flying ships long before "The Written Word" was created. I'll explain this quickly. Interpretations of the ancient languages of quite a few discovered civilizations in both the western and eastern hemispheres. So, is someone going to tell me these interpretations are wrong? Please, I'm waiting. I'm waiting for all these questions to be answered. I truly believe religion is, get ready for it, part of our evolution as a species. I'll again, quickly try to explain. I think we needed (and may still need to a certain extent) religion to help us establish a moral guide, so to speak. As someone who believes in evolution and the literal proof of bones of other species of homo (you know what homo I mean ), we have developed in a very violent world. Having faith put us above the animals around us and gave us rules to follow to help curb that violence and it gave some of us direction and something to look forward to/something bigger, some kind of meaning. But as we continue to evolve as a people, we're learning these values and learning to implement them without the need of religion. Eventually, it'll be religion that will need to go as it will hamper our development if it is not already. Actually, it took about 2 seconds to think of a dozen different ways that it has. (I'm not even considering the fact there has been more wars and killings in the name of God than anything else.) And don't give me that, well, it's tainted by human touch but religion itself is good. Well, guess what. That can be said of everything. And religion itself has been touch and created by man. And man is not infallible. But wait! We are created in the image of God. So, is god just like us/we are just like god? If I learn to use all my brain, will I be a god? Will you have to worship me? My ex wife and I created a daughter. Are we gods already? If god knows everything, why didn't he know we were gonna fuck up in Eden? Or that Jesus would die on the cross? And was that really the Jews fault or the Romans? If he's so perfect and jealousy and envy, murder, etc are wrong, then why is he a jealous god? How could an omnipotent creature like that be jealous of anything? Man, again I could go on for days and days and days. Yes, I'm sure a couple of you could give me an answer to some of these questions. Hell, I could. I'm also sure, half of the answers would carry as much weight as air and be along the lines of "it's true because I believe it is". And I'm spent. Too much typing for something that won't matter anyway. lol You hit on things I say all the time, I think its close minded for soemone to say the bible is this and they know and will opress you if you don't believe exactly like they do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest FooFooMaru Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 I'm saying it could be an evolving tool. Hell if I know. I'm just a human. And nowhere did I make such sweeping statements about the loss of religion or religion being the only thing we war over. You're worse than my gf, don't put words in my mouth. And thx for not quoting the whole thing. It really was a long, rambling thing of a post. lol It doesn't matter. None of this matters. None of us knows the truth. We only think we do. More than likely, nobody's going to make some life changing decision on their core beliefs after reading a thread on CR. Same goes for politics. That's why debates on politics and religion are so heated. Something that has such a huge affect on our lives and really, the majority of us truly don't know a damn thing. Like I said, none of this matters. So, everyone try to keep that in mind. Let the debate continue. I don't think it's words being put in and I think you have it the other way around with your gf and you. ZING! that's fine. Just talking to see what you mean and such. I want/need to learn more IMO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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