caseyctsv Posted February 5, 2014 Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 Help me understand why many of you want diesels. I have read many times how you guys wish such and such car was available with a diesel. I am considering a Q7 with a TDI and after running the numbers, with the premium on diesel fuel (4.17 a gallon today) the numbers do not work out in the diesels favor. I was actually pretty excited to look at one, what am I missing? At this point the 3.0t makes a ton more sense. EPA MPG : Q7 TDI - 17/25 Q7 3.0t - 16/22 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyM3rC Posted February 5, 2014 Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 Those are pretty miserable economy improvements, but the resale on diesels is usually substantially better. Many older VW TDIs sell for more than double their gas counterparts in similar shape Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spankis Posted February 5, 2014 Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 That does not seem consistent with most gas/diesel model comparisons I've seen. Not sure what's different about the Q7. I'm inclined to write it off as a heavy vehicle, but that really doesn't make sense either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbospec29 Posted February 5, 2014 Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 Are those the epa rating or real world numbers? I am willing to bet real world would show at least a 5mpg gain across the board and the diesel will have the torque advantage for towing and such. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigOxley Posted February 5, 2014 Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 Towing, perceived reliability, and mileage. Fuelly show diesel Q7s 21-24 average while gas (touaregs included) gets 16-17 average. Diesel Touaregs are showing a better average, 24-25. Source: Fuelly.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Jones Posted February 5, 2014 Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 TDI's usually fair much better than rated while the gas counterparts fair much worse with the same usage. Real life tells a different story.... While test driving I found it very easy to get 28-30mpg on the freeway as 70mph in the Q7 TDI. As mentioned above: Resale value is through the roof, although that usually favors the original buyer. IE: You can buy a TDI Q7 and sell it for more than you owe in a few years easily. Not something you can do with most SUV's. Effortless towing as well... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbospec29 Posted February 5, 2014 Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 Because I dont care to do the research but would like to know. What is the price gap you are seeing between the 2 optioned the same? At what mileage do the 2 break even? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AudiOn19s Posted February 5, 2014 Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 I'm going back and forth on this decision currently. Towing is the big factor for me. Sadly some of the newer V6 models are capable of towing quite a bit of weight AND are really economical when not towing. Boring to drive I guess is the down side to that. We're heavily looking at '11+ Cayenne V6's right now...and looking at '11+ Cayenne Turbo's. Not considering Cayenne Diesel at all. Would consider X5 Diesel if I could find the right buy on one...I've bid on a couple at the sale recently and been dumb founded what they have gone for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LJ Posted February 5, 2014 Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 Because I dont care to do the research but would like to know. What is the price gap you are seeing between the 2 optioned the same? At what mileage do the 2 break even? This is the part many forget to factor in. With the price difference and the fuel costs difference it can take some folks 8-10 years to break even. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigOxley Posted February 5, 2014 Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 I know a guy in Buffalo NY that runs his F250 on bio-diesel. I'm not sure what it would take to convert a German SUV, but he's paid off his truck and the bio-diesel manufacturing kit with the fuel savings. His father and him produce the bio-diesel for $1.60/ish per gallon (including $0.50/gallon from the restaurants). He was getting the oil for free in the beginning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caseyctsv Posted February 5, 2014 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 Not a big difference in prices, but the TDIs are much harder to find given there are fewer of them. My wife and I are going to go drive a TDI and a 3.0t. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1fast5gp Posted February 5, 2014 Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 I know a guy in Buffalo NY that runs his F250 on bio-diesel. I'm not sure what it would take to convert a German SUV, but he's paid off his truck and the bio-diesel manufacturing kit with the fuel savings. His father and him produce the bio-diesel for $1.60/ish per gallon (including $0.50/gallon from the restaurants). He was getting the oil for free in the beginning. I don't think you have to do any conversion. Biodiesel are meant so that you can run them in diesel cars without conversion. And it is able to be mixed with petrodiesel. http://biodieseltutorial.utahbiodieselsupply.com/howitsmade/images/Making_Biodiesel.gif Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spankis Posted February 5, 2014 Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 Just to avoid confusion, I don't believe any post 2007 U.S.- sold diesel vehicle will not easily run on biodiesel, at least not with the emissions intact. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbospec29 Posted February 5, 2014 Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 This is the part many forget to factor in. With the price difference and the fuel costs difference it can take some folks 8-10 years to break even. I also meant fuel cost vs mileage. Not so much price gap up front although it is a factor. Example. 3.80 per gallon at 17mpg = 22 cents a mile 4.20 per gallon at 24 mpg = 18 cents a mile I would think the reason to go for the diesel would be for the extra towing and fuel cost savings. If the fuel savings is not there then the upfront cost is harder to swallow. I also remember a couple years back when 93 pump gas was more than diesel. You will have to do the math. I just wanted to know the numbers the OP was playing with and maybe we could figure out how good of a fuel advantage the diesel would need to win over the gas engine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caseyctsv Posted February 5, 2014 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 I listed the EPA mileage numbers above and noticed reg unleaded was 3.30 / gallon today while diesel was 4.17. I need to check to see if the 3.0t requires premium which would impact this analysis. For what it's worth the tow ratings are the same and power is relatively close so those would not be deciding factors. I think the "real world" versus EPA argument may be the piece I need to investigate. I was surprised to see the mileage numbers were so close. I am only looking at 2010+ as they rolled out a new 8-spd auto Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stretch Posted February 5, 2014 Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 Not a Q7, but my dad just picked up a 2013 Jetta Diesel and loves it. Looked at gas models but this thing is saving him a ton. Fun to drive too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurboNova Posted February 6, 2014 Report Share Posted February 6, 2014 Yeah not a fan of the difference between the q7 options... many other cars you look at its worth it though for the mileage...resale and dependability. Very interested in the future of diesel engines being offered from various manufactures. We currently have 3 diesel vehicles and within the next year or year and a half I hope to get one more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Got-Boost? Posted February 6, 2014 Report Share Posted February 6, 2014 . I was actually pretty excited to look at one, what am I missing? At this point the 3.0t makes a ton more sense. EPA MPG : Q7 TDI - 17/25 Q7 3.0t - 16/22 You are probably looking at an older Q7 that doesn't have the latest updates. The new TDi Q7 is rated at 19/28 and I've talked to owners that have averaged in the 30's on a long trip which is almost unheard of for an SUV of it's size. Even around town you should average mid-20's where the gas brother will be mid-teen's. It's a bigger difference than you think, not to mention towing and other benefits of diesel. It also depends on your driving habits and route. If you aren't driving a lot then cost difference may not be worth it. But as others have pointed out, resale is a bit different on the diesel versions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigOxley Posted February 6, 2014 Report Share Posted February 6, 2014 I'm guessing the similar towing has to do with the suspension, brakes, and other components. I would venture to say the diesel would feel like your not towing anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caseyctsv Posted February 6, 2014 Author Report Share Posted February 6, 2014 We are going to go look at a couple. I am afraid my wife will say the Q7 is too small. She thought the Acadia was too small and based on measurements, while it is larger on the outside it is smaller on the inside. I am trying to not have to get another suburban. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starkmaster03 Posted February 6, 2014 Report Share Posted February 6, 2014 Diesel prices are also quite different around different parts of town. When I worked of Sawmill, I never got diesel there because it was always higher. Today diesel was 3.95 on the east side and I filled up on Saturday at 3.65. There are normally places to get a better deal just depends if its out of your way and unlike gas the differences tend to be larger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gergwheel1647545492 Posted February 6, 2014 Report Share Posted February 6, 2014 I think the "real world" versus EPA argument may be the piece I need to investigate. I was surprised to see the mileage numbers were so close. I am only looking at 2010+ as they rolled out a new 8-spd auto http://www.fuelly.com/car/audi/q7 I used this site a ton last time i was in the market for a car that got good MPG. It's really good for getting real world data. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokey Posted February 7, 2014 Report Share Posted February 7, 2014 Also don't forget about UREA fluid required in many newer diesel SUVs. That's another $150 or so every 10-15k miles. Combine that with diesel being more expensive in Ohio than gas can make the gap closer even if you're running premium. I think the other thing you're seeing is that the 3.0T is more efficient than a V8 so they're closer in mileage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickey4271647545519 Posted February 7, 2014 Report Share Posted February 7, 2014 Also don't forget about UREA fluid required in many newer diesel SUVs. That's another $150 or so every 10-15k miles. Combine that with diesel being more expensive in Ohio than gas can make the gap closer even if you're running premium. I think the other thing you're seeing is that the 3.0T is more efficient than a V8 so they're closer in mileage. DEF isn't quite that expensive. Q7 holds around 6 gallons of DEF. Refilled every 10-15k miles depending on drive habit. At the good 'ole AZ it's $15 for 2.5 gallons. So most people shouldn't be spending anywhere near $150 on DEF every 10-15k. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Jones Posted February 7, 2014 Report Share Posted February 7, 2014 DEF isn't quite that expensive. Q7 holds around 6 gallons of DEF. Refilled every 10-15k miles depending on drive habit. At the good 'ole AZ it's $15 for 2.5 gallons. So most people shouldn't be spending anywhere near $150 on DEF every 10-15k. ^This. The DEF is not specific to Audi/VW and can be picked up just about anywhere cheaply. It's a very easy process to fill it as well that anybody can do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.