Jackson1647545504 Posted March 9, 2006 Report Share Posted March 9, 2006 Somewhat interesting ... http://www.cnn.com/2006/LAW/03/08/fatherhood.suit.ap/index.html The suit addresses the issue of male reproductive rights, contending that lack of such rights violates the U.S. Constitution's equal protection clause. The gist of the argument: If a pregnant woman can choose among abortion, adoption or raising a child, a man involved in an unintended pregnancy should have the choice of declining the financial responsibilities of fatherhood. The activists involved hope to spark discussion even if they lose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trouble Maker Posted March 9, 2006 Report Share Posted March 9, 2006 I think it’s irresponsible to even speak about not taking care of a child you fathered. ‘Unfortunately’ nature in a slight twist of irony has taken this choice right out of our hands, but modern day society has placed an ever increasing burden on males simply because they aren’t the ones that has to go through the physical trauma of childbirth. All without giving them much of a decisions as to what they would like to do (like maybe actually take care of the child). Although I think there should be a ‘way’ to make both parties (the mother and father) equally bear the responsibility of the child, it’s also as equally irresponsible as a society to have the system in place we have now. One that seems to punish more good fathers than it helps good mothers. I don’t think there is a simple answer to that question at this point. At any rate, here is a very interesting article pertaining to that. It’s a column from the Glenn Sacks website that chrismindless posted about the male birth control pill. Maybe a small step towards putting this decision equally on the woman and the mans shoulders. The system we currently have in place is very wrong and it won’t change overnight. It will take many little steps like this, but mostly changes to the legal system side, to make everything fair. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrismindless Posted March 9, 2006 Report Share Posted March 9, 2006 Thats great that this article has gotten out, I read about the suit a few weeks ago ... Good, its a point Ive been making for awhile. THe basic idealogy of it has nothing to do with responsibility or what a father should and shouldn't do. The very second you bring that into the debate, you miss the point. SO bare with me for just a few words and then Ill bring it back in context. Women have a choice, which is hailed by millions of people as a right to choice, as their right to choose, to have choice over their reproductive rights. Men dont have that option at all. The best we have are Condoms and those are not 100% effective. A woman can: keep the child, Abortion, or Adoption. A Man can: nothing. Has 0% say in ANY matter meaning if he is against abortion, his voice doesnt count. What I think: Men should be able to choose adoption or keep the baby. If the mother doesnt want to have it and chooses adoption, the father is first in line to get the child. If a woman chooses to keep the child and the father chooses adoption, than the mother is 100% liable for the child. <<-- no different than the reverse. You might think, well many men would opt out of their own children ... truth be told, the courts already do that for them. The courts already take our children away and place huge financial burdens on us and mental/spritual stress ... unjustly. This is no different. Also, a woman can choose to opt out at anytime ... why cant a man? Why can a woman kill her fetus but a father that doesnt want a part of it and wants adoption is such an evil creature? The truth is for every 1 baby available, there are 25 couples looking for a child. http://www.glennbeck.com Next, lets address responsibility. If, both men and women are given these choices, than the consequences shouldn't fall onto the state entirely. The responsiblity falls on the parents (or just parent). I personally grew up in a super poor family. I remember having only 3 outfits for school during middle school ... Im in college with a 3.31 (on my own bill), I bought my own STI, Ive been working since I was 14. My parents to this day are in their late 50's with no retirement setup. I am on my way to law school and Im doing it on my own with their support (not money, but in words and praise). I really dont want to hear how the lack of money makes kids bad ... I think its a lack of proper parenting and environment and culture. And anyone that has lived like me knows that hardships create character and make you stronger. Not the reverse. How many pampered kids do you know doing great things on their own? Not many. So I think this is a GOOD THING ... The burden of responsibility will fall on both parents ... not as it is now which is it falls on the father everytime without any checks on the mother. I think its a good thing but thats my opinion. If you can have, we should have it as well. (Wow, who would of thought Men would have to fight for their rights 20 years ago) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Science Abuse Posted March 9, 2006 Report Share Posted March 9, 2006 He made it, he has an obligation to it. If you dont think this is the case, you are not a man, you are a little boy and worthy of no respect what so ever. But, legaly speaking, there is a foothold for this. You can argue that what the woman can choose, the man should be able to choose as well. If he wants her to abort, and she doesn't, he still has to pay for the kid. Cant handle that? Should have pulled out, bitch. While fucking, theman has more control over conception then the woman. She dont know your done untill your done. If you knock her up, it's your own damned fault. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NTHER91 Posted March 9, 2006 Report Share Posted March 9, 2006 Devil's advocate What if a 18 yr old frail nerd is raped by a older or just stronger woman and she gets pregnant, is he responsible? What if a couple gets pregnant and the guy dosnt know about it but she goes and has a abortion, can he sue her? What if a guy finds out that "his" child isn't really "his" after all can he sue her for moneys spent on that child?(no he can't i firmly belive it would get laughed out of court). I completely agree that a guy should take care of his responsiblities, but when does he get equal rights? If you think this contry is run by men you are sadly mistaken!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrismindless Posted March 9, 2006 Report Share Posted March 9, 2006 The Benz Guy ... I cant agree. Your point of view makes sense if and only if you dont take into consideration that every case is different. ALso, the issue isnt that simple, unfortuately. Its not about getting out of responsibility, Benz. I stated that wasnt the point. THe point is to have equal and fair rights for both parties. If you think, that this would be just simply a guy getting away with sex and responsibilities, than define for me what you think adoption and abortion are. Because under your logic, they are the same thing, a woman getting out of having to raise and support a child. Which they are options for a woman and not the man, which they should be an option for him as well .. What about when she says she's on the pill ... you dont pull out because of the pill but if she lied to you, you are screwed and no it isnt your fault, it is the fault of the person that lied to you and under the current system, the innocent gets screwed. If the man could choose, women would be a lot more careful than they are. We all make mistakes, you cannot burn a person for making one. Those days should be over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trouble Maker Posted March 9, 2006 Report Share Posted March 9, 2006 If you are pulling out as the sole method of trying not to get a girl pregnant then you’re a fucking idiot to begin with. I can’t believe you morons using that as an example for an arguing point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Science Abuse Posted March 9, 2006 Report Share Posted March 9, 2006 Ahh "the pill" argument, absolutely unassailable, you're right on that one. I'm taking a harsh stance on this because it's actualy a very simple problem to avoid. You say it's not about getting out of responcebility. For you, perhaps not, but I garaun'damn'tee that's exactly what it will be used for. Glock doesn't design guns for holding up convenience stores, but they still get used for that. This isn't a bad "idea", but it's a damn dangerous bit of legislation and if it passes in it's current for it will be greatly abused, if not entirely. For what other reason would a man call apon that law, other then to get out of the responcebility of supporting the kid? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrismindless Posted March 9, 2006 Report Share Posted March 9, 2006 ^^^ correct, but at least the man will now have the same choice as the woman, and nobody gets down on a woman for her ability to adopt or abort against the father's wishes. It has to be equal or you take it away from the woman also ... thats all Im saying, honestly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Science Abuse Posted March 9, 2006 Report Share Posted March 9, 2006 ^^^ correct, but at least the man will now have the same choice as the woman, and nobody gets down on a woman for her ability to adopt or abort against the father's wishes. Then that is what needs to be adressed. There does need to be legislation to preserve the right of a father to be a father. But giving deadbeat dads a legal avenue is not the way to go about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McGraw Posted March 9, 2006 Report Share Posted March 9, 2006 I just want maternity leave ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trouble Maker Posted March 9, 2006 Report Share Posted March 9, 2006 I just want maternity leave ... Uhh, a lot of places do that. Not as much as for a woman, for obvious reasons, but they do. Also I’m assuming you meant paternity leave unless you want to have a somehow fully functional sex change and to birth a child at some point. If so, no one here wants to know about that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrismindless Posted March 9, 2006 Report Share Posted March 9, 2006 http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?p=12983692&posted=1#post12983692 same debate but a but more heated ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Science Abuse Posted March 10, 2006 Report Share Posted March 10, 2006 I just want maternity leave ... You get it, its called FMLA, the F is for Federal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.