IPS FTW!!! NOT...

[BlackMess]

I really did not want to post this but why not at this point. After seeing all you nut swingers talking up IPS and the completion of Erik’s rx7 I figured I would call them about ls1 swapping my rx7. Talked to Jeff initially over the phone and seemed like a nice legit guy. Keep in mind I did not own the rx7, but I was purchasing it specifically for this swap. After Jeff sent the original estimate in November 2008 and estimated the swap would take 4-6 weeks I pulled the trigger and bought the car.

His estimate was almost too good to be true and later on in this long story you will find out it was! The price he quoted me was cheaper then I could build the car for and due to time constraints I opted not to do it myself! Car did not run so I had it shipped directly to IPS.

Within 2 days of them receiving the car they already had the motor out. I was impressed on how quick they were diving into this project. Within the first week I had the rotary motor out of their shop and a complete ls1/4l60e pullout with wiring harness and computer at their doorstep.

Ran into the first problem which was a bent frame rail, so I think the project is toast. They inform me they know the best body man in the country so I spend days trying to find a front clip. Found one in California and had it shipped to their recommended body shop. Front clip was $1,000 and they said the body man would do it for $500. They also mentioned he sectioned another rx7 for a forum member on here so it would not be a problem.

Since the engine was out and the car was going to a body shop I told them to ask him to spray the engine bay for me which I feel is the right thing to do since the motor is out. He agreed to do it for $500. I give them $1,000 in cash. They still will not give me contact info of the body man for some odd reason.

3 months later my car returns back from the body shop frame front clipped sectioned in without a painted engine bay and the driver’s door won’t shut! I mention it to them but they say it was a bigger job then he expected. This shit frustrates me because I would have gone another couple hundred to have the bay painted.

During the 4 months it was at the body shop they talked me into head/cam swap while the engine was out. At this point I had given them $5500(parts) plus ($1,000) to have the frame fixed and bay painted. Mike insisted I give them the money for the parts because they were going to immediately start on the car! By this point in the project Jeff pushes me off onto mike.

At this point I come down with a truck and tell them I am taking my car out but they promise they will get started on it the following week. Initially they said they would make a “custom IPS subframe” because they already had the jig. Another reason why I chose to take my car there! After waiting 8 months for them to make this subframe I had to order the piece from Justin Samberg in California. Progress is still very minimal at this point. I also love looking through the bill and paying for broken parts that I have pictures of that were good when I delivered them!

By now I have lost all interest in the project so I quit the 4-5 phone calls per week. Ran into several other obstacles throughout the project but they ensured me they had done the swap before and it would not be a problem. This story could go on and on but this entire RX7 project with IPS has exhausted me.

As of now 9/25 the car still does not run. The vehicle does have a custom transmission bracket I paid them $500.00 to “fabricate” when they could have ordered one from Hinson for $130.00. Seems practical right?? It also has a $200.00 lengthened steering shaft that a month ago they told me the car did not need?? A $450.00 bracket that connects the Mazda shifter to the 4l60e.a $500.00 radiator that lists for around $300.00. And the list goes on and on.

I had to send the wiring harness to a guy in South Carolina because with their wiring modification which I paid them roughly $700.00 to do and the car won’t start. The man who fixed the harness thought they charged me so much because they had used about 100 quick splice connectors for a nice quality and durable connection and about 100ft of heat shrink. He found cracked wires because nobody at IPS owns a soldering iron and relies on cheap plastic crimp connectors! The picture of the wiring mess he sent me is amusing along with pictures of the split wires within the loom that IPS charged me $200.00 to “lengthen” these wires around my headers.

The vehicle still needs and exhaust, intake, and odds and ends. At this point I figure another 4-5 more months on this never ending RX7 project. I have been more then patient and fair with them. Every time they needed a part or money I was there. I drove the gas tank 4 hours to a guy in PA to be restored because there was not another usable one available and they said this was the last piece of the project. Lucky they dropped the labor rate from $70.00 down to $55.00 or I would have to part out the car in order to pay them!

I guess one positive is when I finally get the car back I wont need the a/c they were unable to put on because they lost the lines! This may seem like another IPS bashing thread but my current bill is around over TWO TIMES the cost of the original estimate not to mention it has been a year. I understand this isn’t a new Z06 corvette or something that gets much publicity but have some loyalty and respect to local customers. Jeff posts build threads of cars but nobody local…. Hmm.. I wonder why?

 

10/25/09

So not only am I broke but also extremely frustrated at this point. I rented a u-haul trailer and loaded up the truck to go get the rx7. Get there and they immediately question me about why I am taking the car. I explain to them that I am exhausted from the project and just want to square up with them and get the car out of there.

They think I am taking it to Gearheadz and insist that I let them finish the car! Jeff was about to cry when he had heard I was taking my car to Gearheadz! I explain that I have 0 dollars to finish the car and they said they will finish it for free! I thought I was hearing stuff so I asked again and they said they would wrap up the exhaust and intake, and tune for free! I am still skeptical because of how many times they have reneged on their word so I tell them I am still taking it! They promise I won’t owe them another dollar if I let them finish it, so stupid me agrees to let them finish the car and they promised it would be done in 2 weeks.

They said where else would I find somewhere willing to finish the car for free beside Gearheadz! I had brought a Crank Sensor plug with me and a pinout of the ecu so we go in the back and hook it up and amazingly the car comes to life! So after 1 year my $6.00 crank plug brings the car to life after these LSX specialists spend countless hours of my money troubleshooting and still had no luck firing my car!

The car needed injectors and an abs pump which I authorized them to order.

Fast-forward 4 weeks, yes 4 weeks 2 weeks over the deadline I get a call from Mike and they inform me that I owe them anther $2,600 for fabbing up the exhaust, intake, tune and putting the car back together and other odds and ends. After another 45 minute argument on the phone he claims I misunderstood him about finishing the car for free. I guess the guy I brought with me and the 4 techs in the back misunderstood the Yetzger Brothers about finishing my car for free! Any who the car is currently sitting at IPS because like I mentioned to them 4 weeks ago I did not have the funding to finish the project at this time. So now every penny I save goes into the “get the 7 out of the hands of these idiots fund.” I had no problem bringing the car back to them in a few months when I got some money saved up in order to finish the car, but what they did in suckering me in is a dirty thing for a business to do!

 

Now that all this has been brought to the attention is it just me or have I really been taken advantage of? I understand anytime custom fab work is done the estimate may change but they did Erik’s car before so they knew what they were getting into. I’m sure Jeff will get on there any say what a POS I brought him and how they “hooked” me up etc. but when it comes down to it I honestly feel like I got Screwed by IPS. I have nothing against the techs that work there or their quality of work, but have some respect and dignity towards a customer! I just don’t understand how a business can operate when they treat honest, patient, and cooperative customers like this!

So anyways by now its February. The car has been at IPS for 16 months and it is still not road worthy. I am heading down Thursday to get the car, all my parts and wash my hands of these unprofessional idiots who are trying to run a business and screwing unsuspecting customers.

I could go on and on how bad IPS screwed me. I could go on about how Mike’s brother was slow and wanted some money during the holidays so I had him paint the bumpers. We had agreed that they would fill the holes and wet sand and buff the bumpers. Come to find out that the holes weren’t filled and they weren’t wet sanded and buffed. How could there be so much confusion when it comes to a business.

The car has no brakes, Fuel pump relay jumpered with a paper clip and some heat shrink, Speedo does not work, oil pan clearance of 2 ¼ inches and exhaust clearance of about ¾ inch due to their master auto body tech sectioned my front clip in crooked! They had parked the car under a vehicle that leaked tranny fluid, oil, and gray RTV on my car which bubbled and etched the paint all over my car, grease stains on my leather seats because some intelligent individual put the old greasy driveshaft on the passenger seat! And that’s just scratching the surface.

The car is a complete cluster fuck. Is my rx7 a $125k ZR1?? No but have some respect for the average persons car. Erik named his car the red mess so therefore I’m naming mine “Black Mess” I will be the next few months fixing all of IPS’s screw ups on the car in order to make her road worthy! I am sure IPS will get on here and defend how the car is road worthy etc. but it comes down to the fact that I HAD to pick it up with a trailer!

Be men and admit your mistakes, how much bullshit can one person take? Once again I caution people to scope out the shop they are going to have working on their car very closely. 1st moral of this story- A businesses reputation doesn’t lie… 2nd moral- Take lube with you before you go to IPS because chances are you will get screwed!

 

2/4/2010

Well its d day and I just unloaded black mess from the trailer. It was an interesting experience picking up the car at IPS. I went down and squared up with them in an honest manner even though I did not agree with the bill.

It turned into the dirtiest unprofessional hour conversation I have ever had in my life. Both parties were in the wrong but Jeff as a business owner in the community showed his true colors arguing with me and a buddy about nothing that was going to be resolved. Making every excuse in the book and using some choice words with me and about my (Basketcase) car.

My last complaint with the shop is that I addressed the issue of a dented hood and scratched fender which occurred during the time at the shop. They said they didn’t feel the need to address the issue because I had never brought it up to them. They offered me $300.00 to fix the body work because that what it would cost them. What body shop in my local area is going to fix it for this rate? Were taking probably $1,000.00 worth of damages. Anyways I told Mike to keep the money and take all the employees out to dinner on me for all the hard work, time, and dedication to making my car into what it is sitting on jack stands in my garage, Thanks again IPS!

Edited February 5, 2010 by BlackMess

[V8 Beast]

Warning.. Sponsers that have nothing to do with this need to stay out of this thread. THIS IS THE ONLY WARNING

 

http://www.columbusracing.com/forums/showthread.php?t=66897

 

Thread bans will happen fast and often if this gets out of hand (which it will)

[BlackMess]

Teaser pic of the $700.00 IPS custom wiring modification. Can you imagine the rest of the vehicle?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v704/hiitsmejimmy/wiringnest.jpg

[TTQ B4U]

Maybe because I've sold software and impliment some pretty hefty systems, but IMO gigs like this need a clear statement of work with defined and agreed upon expectations and time lines.

 

I would never do what the two parties here agreed to without some clarity on expectations and delivery dates, and who's responsible for what and when all tied to the exchange of money.

 

Failure to plan is planning to fail. Especially in situations where yet a third party is involved to help complete the project.

 

I hope it all works out for all involved without getting too ugly here.

[V8 Beast]

Still waiting to hear IPS side of things. Remember there are 2 sides to every story.

 

Erik, (when you get back) and without going all IPS hate crazy..... did you have similar issues with your build or was the issue that took out the engine the first one you ran into? Just curious and your name was mentioned in the first post.

[BlackMess]

IPS hasn't posted yet because im sure Jeff ran back to the shop to get the several page rebuttal he has typed up. He contacted me last night wanting to know dates of when I order the subframe?? hmm wonder why?? This call turned into a 3 hour phone call about how IPS did nothing wrong and I could sense the fear of the truth unfolding on CR...

[wagner]

Warning.. Sponsers that have nothing to do with this need to stay out of this thread. THIS IS THE ONLY WARNING

 

http://www.columbusracing.com/forums/showthread.php?t=66897

 

Thread bans will happen fast and often if this gets out of hand (which it will)

 

I thought this just needed stated again and nutswingers/haters please keep out of this.

[BlackMess]

I paid $200.00 for these extended Crank Sensor Wires.. Not a bad deal... Right??

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v704/hiitsmejimmy/yuppp.jpg

[TurboTank]

Teaser pic of the $700.00 IPS custom wiring modification. Can you imagine the rest of the vehicle?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v704/hiitsmejimmy/wiringnest.jpg

 

just so this is clear. that picture is from the "harness guy". what u see is remnets of a trial and error to test out systems and circuits in the harness. the harness was a mess at that point. fyi for people not in the know. a properly crimped electrical connection is just as good or if not better than a soldered joint. keyword is proper. you have to have the right tools for the job and a 50$ set of snap-on crimpers do the job just fine. i know someone will argure with me about this but lemme tell you this ive been doing this kinda thing for longer than 99%of the people on this board have been driving. im original number 115 i think on this board. ive built countless swaps into cars beyond peoples imaginations. (even before working at ips). since i was involved in this build about 65% of the time i will post back my thoughts on the things i did to the car. as far as the bill goes i dont have anything to do with that.

 

Tank

[BlackMess]

After 3 months I brought a $6.00 crank plug down and a schematic of the ecu. The car fired on the first crank. 3 months to troubleshoot a no start condition? HP tuners wasn't getting a crank signal? Why not try bypassing the the 3 crank sensor wires and hope for a signal? I haven't done "countless" swaps but often times common sense goes a long way!

[BlackMess]

Tank,

Like ive told you peanut and jason. I have no problem with your skills or fab work. But as you know the build took longer then expected and frustrated me to death!

[TurboTank]

After 3 months I brought a $6.00 crank plug down and a schematic of the ecu. The car fired on the first crank. 3 months to troubleshoot a no start condition? HP tuners wasn't getting a crank signal? Why not try bypassing the the 3 crank sensor wires and hope for a signal? I haven't done "countless" swaps but often times common sense goes a long way!

 

do u really think i spent 3 months under there? lol how come u didnt say anything about the cam sensor wires that were pinched off(proably from the salvage company removing the engine) there in the back fyi by firewall. i didnt do the original crank sensor lengthening, the guy who installed the engine did. honisty i thought we were golden when i found the cam sensor wires(pinched off) and fixed them.

[AJ]

FWIW GM says no to solder connections because it makes a hard connection that can brake. they want crimp connections with heat shrink or heat shrink butt connectors.

 

but the POS scotchlock connections are a universal no no, it doesn't matter what your working on.

[TurboTank]

Tank,

Like ive told you peanut and jason. I have no problem with your skills or fab work. But as you know the build took longer then expected and frustrated me to death!

 

i think it took longer than needbe also. but that is out of my hands. eriks s. car started first key crank. aolt of problems we ran into were discused with you like the exhaust. and making a 6:1 to a 7:1 ratio shifter assembly work together. were a pain in the ass. and we got it to work. alot of people havent.

[BlackMess]

haha yea its a tight squeeze under there!.During the summer I saw the young "hourly" guy tugging on the wires to get them through the firewall! I shoulda broke both of his hands! Chances are they got mangled during his clean install. I bought the motor from a reputable F-body and corvette salvage yard that pull MANY of these motors daily but you never know!

[BlackMess]

I must say I give props to tank for fabbing up the "short" shifter install in the car. Like mentioned before I have no problem with your fab work!

[TurboTank]

FWIW GM says no to solder connections because it makes a hard connection that can brake. they want crimp connections with heat shrink or heat shrink butt connectors.

 

but the POS scotchlock connections are a universal no no, it doesn't matter what your working on.

 

agree.... thats why scotch locks were used for testing purposes only. they have been used in hard to reach areas for taping connections also. again you have to know how to use them. knowing is half the battle.

[BlackMess]

Tank,

I believe I have your orange handled matco screwdriver I found in the car. I will drop it in the mail to you sometime.

[TurboTank]

I must say I give props to tank for fabbing up the "short" shifter install in the car. Like mentioned before I have no problem with your fab work!

 

out of everything i personaly did to the car the shifter has to be the worst quality from me. a pain it was. i think as you find things under there u will see the little extra time taken to use the correct products for the job. like with the fuel system im very comfortable with it. maximum clearence on the header, c5 reg and correct gm style push on fittings. the only thing that could have been better would be the use of stepless clamps instead of worm gear clamps.

[TurboTank]

Tank,

I believe I have your orange handled matco screwdriver I found in the car. I will drop it in the mail to you sometime.

 

lol might be i wont know till i put tools away tomorrow. ok thats cool

[BlackMess]

Im not comfortable with the fuel system at all but I didnt put it together. I pad BIG money for the $49.00 c5 reg/filter mounted above the rear and could possibly blow a worm gear clamp off onto the hot exhaust which wouldnt make for a good combo. For the money the guys up front charged me you could have ran braided lines with AN fittings with a filter regulator up front. Which would have made for a MUCH cleaner and efficient install.

[TurboTank]

Im not comfortable with the fuel system at all but I didnt put it together. I pad BIG money for the $49.00 c5 reg/filter mounted above the rear and could possibly blow a worm gear clamp off onto the hot exhaust which wouldnt make for a good combo. For the money the guys up front charged me you could have ran braided lines with AN fittings with a filter regulator up front. Which would have made for a MUCH cleaner and efficient install.

 

for your build i would have to disagree. ive been doing it that way for years. there is no need for a fuel system like that untill your beyond the walbros limits. you will need rails, fittings, lines, reg and gauge. then your are spending time running a 800hp fuel system for a 500 hp max fuel pump. get my drift? all the engine bay lines even the vapor line is coverd in sillicone themo sleeve. again same process done on erik s. car.

[BlackMess]

4* Straight -6AN Swivel-Seal Fitting 361-800106 $6.99 $27.96

2 45° -6AN Swivel-Seal Fitting 361-804606 $16.99 $33.98

1 90° -6AN Swivel-Seal Fitting 361-809106 $16.99 $16.99

1 90° -6AN Low Profile Swivel-Seal Fitting 361-809006 $29.99 $29.99

1 AN Size: -06 (3/8''); 20' Foot Length 361-320006 $93.99 $93.99

1 AN Size: -06 (3/8''); 6' Foot Length 361-306006 $32.99 $32.99

1 In-Line Fuel Filter -6AN male 361-230106 $29.99 $29.99

1 A1000 -6 Injected Bypass Regulator 30 to 70 PSI 027-13109 $139.99 $139.00

1 Push-on EFI Fitting (for OEM hard lines), -6 to 3/8” 799-640850 $15.99 $15.99

1 Fuel Pressure Gauge 0-100psi (not installed) 027-15633 $29.99 $29.99

 

Cheaper then what I had in the 35 worm gear clamps, hoses and vette regulator!

[TurboTank]

4* Straight -6AN Swivel-Seal Fitting 361-800106 $6.99 $27.96

2 45° -6AN Swivel-Seal Fitting 361-804606 $16.99 $33.98

1 90° -6AN Swivel-Seal Fitting 361-809106 $16.99 $16.99

1 90° -6AN Low Profile Swivel-Seal Fitting 361-809006 $29.99 $29.99

1 AN Size: -06 (3/8''); 20' Foot Length 361-320006 $93.99 $93.99

1 AN Size: -06 (3/8''); 6' Foot Length 361-306006 $32.99 $32.99

1 In-Line Fuel Filter -6AN male 361-230106 $29.99 $29.99

1 A1000 -6 Injected Bypass Regulator 30 to 70 PSI 027-13109 $139.99 $139.00

1 Push-on EFI Fitting (for OEM hard lines), -6 to 3/8” 799-640850 $15.99 $15.99

1 Fuel Pressure Gauge 0-100psi (not installed) 027-15633 $29.99 $29.99

 

Cheaper then what I had in the 35 worm gear clamps, hoses and vette regulator!

 

that setup would have to be for looks. it has no need. espically if you dont need the extra fuel. did u say u wanted a balla fuel system?

[BlackMess]

I dont like looking at the car and it looking like a backyard hillbilly build with 35 worm gear clamps jerry rigged together when I paid BIG bucks for a "CUSTOM IPS FUEL SYSTEM"

 

You guys dont cut corners when working on vettes do you? But maybe I should have put vette badges on the car and it would have gotten special treatment like plastic fender liners to protect the paint! But why would you treat a 93 rx7 the same as a 2009 vette?