Crossle Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 Just thought I would post this up here since none of us at the shop have come across this until today and thought I would share the experience. Vehicle: 2004 VW Jetta GL 2.0L Automatic 66K miles Symptom: No Start Diagnostics: Turn the key to start, nothing happens. Dash lights bright. Battery tests OK Fuses in the starting system OK NO trouble codes in immobilizer/trans/engine Trans range switch reading correctly via VAGCOM Found no power in start position at Park/Neutral Position switch from the ignition switch. Relay has good 12V power from battery. Jumper the relay car turns over, no fire (ya I know there were about 8 wires here I just wanted a response from the starter) Went to ignition switch and found good 12V supply and good power out of switch in the start position to the PNP relay mentioned above. Techs are thinking "ok there is a break b/w the ign. switch and the PNP relay." You are correct, I then found a set of wires with a fusible link, a relay and a unknown box since I could only see the front if it and it was electrical taped to the dash way up high. We thought aftermarket alarm OR remote start, get ok from customer, rip it out repaired the wires car starts runs fine. We find out then that the customer just bought the car, we suggest maybe calling the car lot and asking them about covering the repair even though the extended warranty they sold her does not cover this issue. The car lot calls us upset because we ripped out a system designed to disable this vehicle remotely if the person has not made their payment on the car. Also known as a "payment assurance device". Mind you there was no tag/sticker/NOTHING that told us what it was, nor did the customer seem to know what it was or that it was installed in their vehicle. Here is a link to a company who makes these devices http://www.passtimeusa.com/ Here is a information link talking about the systems http://www.dealerbusinessjournal.com/articleview.php?id=579-18324 Kinda interesting, this is the first time we have seen this issue I suppose most people miss the payment then get the car reposessed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benner Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 That's crazy. Sounds kind of illegal to me too keep it in there if the car is paid off (especially without the owners knowledge) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ansonivan Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 Was going to say: "lol, so glad I don't work on VW's anymore" Thanks for the heads up, have not seen one of those yet. Ps. I'm a mechanic, I fix the things that techs fuck up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurboNova Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 That's pretty sweet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 614Streets Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 Seen it before on two cars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crossle Posted January 14, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 That's crazy. Sounds kind of illegal to me too keep it in there if the car is paid off (especially without the owners knowledge) Typically I believe most places have you sign a document stating that you know it's there and what it does. Ps. I'm a mechanic, I fix the things that techs fuck up. Yah heard that the other day from Scott the for the first time, it will be awhile to get out of the habit haha. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJ Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 seen it on a few cars too. its mainly those buy here pay here lots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patterson Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 They're for us bad credit types. They do disclose it in the loan papers, and remove it when it's paid off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crossle Posted January 14, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 They're for us bad credit types. They do disclose it in the loan papers, and remove it when it's paid off. See that's what we thought had to happen, so it's hard to say what happened on the customers end. Is the lot shady, or is the customer not telling us the whole story? We don't need to know for sure, but it sure raises some questions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImUrOBGYN Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 seen it on a few cars too. its mainly those buy here pay here lots. Yes. I've known about this for quite sometime. I've also worked with and dealt with quite a few used car lots, especially those who do their own in-house financing. Technically, that's not the ladies car anymore than your new car you make payments on is yours. It's the banks. And at an in-house fincance lot, it's the lots car until you finish paying it off. As far as the legality of it, I'm not sure what it'd be in Ohio. I would assume that it would have to be made known to the customer in writing, verbal, or something but who knows. Was this what was actually causing the issue in the car you were working on? And you 'fixed' it? How did they find out? Did the lady actually call them and ask about it or did you guys contact them? You didn't tell the end of the story very well. You left out pertinent information I need to make a definitive judgement on either the lady or the car lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crossle Posted January 14, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 She called the lot and asked if they had a remote for a remote start or aftermarket car alarm. They then told her that it had neither, but it did have the payment assurance device on the car. Idk how she reacted to it, but they called us and told us what it was and told us we shouldn't have taken it off because they activated it due to no payment. Although the owner claims that the payment was due next week sometime and that they were early. And yes, it fixed the problem, car starts fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Bruh Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 seen it on a few cars too. its mainly those buy here pay here lots. there's all kinds of these systems. Some you plug what looks like a sd card into a reader allows ignition to start. Others have like a key fob you have to wave around a sensor to allow it to start. customer should of had better credits/thread Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImUrOBGYN Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 She called the lot and asked if they had a remote for a remote start or aftermarket car alarm. They then told her that it had neither, but it did have the payment assurance device on the car. Idk how she reacted to it, but they called us and told us what it was and told us we shouldn't have taken it off because they activated it due to no payment. Although the owner claims that the payment was due next week sometime and that they were early. And yes, it fixed the problem, car starts fine. Thank you. Some closure. lol I can both complete and fill in the rest of the story, now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patterson Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 She called the lot and asked if they had a remote for a remote start or aftermarket car alarm. They then told her that it had neither, but it did have the payment assurance device on the car. Idk how she reacted to it, but they called us and told us what it was and told us we shouldn't have taken it off because they activated it due to no payment. Although the owner claims that the payment was due next week sometime and that they were early. And yes, it fixed the problem, car starts fine. Makes it easy for them to come get the car. there's all kinds of these systems. Some you plug what looks like a sd card into a reader allows ignition to start. Others have like a key fob you have to wave around a sensor to allow it to start. customer should of had better credits/thread Really? Obviously if the customer is a shady dumbass they deserve to have lousy credit, and what not. What happens when you get hit with a mountain of Medical bills, and the cherry on top is Identity theft? Idiotic comments like that are well idiotic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave1647545494 Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 never seen one of those thanks for the tip Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clifford Automotive Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 Lots have been using them for 10 years now. Its cool that you found it. Sounds to me like the customers going to try and skip on the payment now. They know they're in the cars. And like stated they are removed when the car is payed off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crossle Posted January 14, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 Lots have been using them for 10 years now. Its cool that you found it. Sounds to me like the customers going to try and skip on the payment now. They know they're in the cars. And like stated they are removed when the car is payed off. I'm not 100%, but I'm pretty sure we released the car to the dealership with the customers knowledge. I was in the front office when the dealership came to pay for it, but did not see who took it and it left the same day the dealership payed for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STarner Posted January 25, 2011 Report Share Posted January 25, 2011 i've herd of buy here pay here lots doing that for the people that miss payments! my buddy had one on his car his payment was 3 days late and what do you know the car wouldn't start... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBussman1647545507 Posted January 25, 2011 Report Share Posted January 25, 2011 I've installed hundreds of these things. it's a shame you have to splice into the original harness. i see them at my current job from time to time. Still have the factory bypass jumper too. They're are a few versions in the pastime series and some have GPS onboard too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjrsplat Posted January 25, 2011 Report Share Posted January 25, 2011 ^^ what he said. my buddy had one on his car, he missed a payment by 1 day, and you could see tow trucks scouting his area before they even disabled the car. needless to say, he got it straightened out. if it were me, id pull that damn thing off the second i bought the car.. run it on a dc plug in my garage or something just to mess with em. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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