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Attention other techs!


Crossle

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Just thought I would post this up here since none of us at the shop have come across this until today and thought I would share the experience.

 

Vehicle:

2004 VW Jetta GL 2.0L Automatic 66K miles

 

Symptom:

No Start

 

Diagnostics:

Turn the key to start, nothing happens. Dash lights bright.

Battery tests OK

Fuses in the starting system OK

NO trouble codes in immobilizer/trans/engine

Trans range switch reading correctly via VAGCOM

 

Found no power in start position at Park/Neutral Position switch from the ignition switch. Relay has good 12V power from battery. Jumper the relay car turns over, no fire (ya I know there were about 8 wires here I just wanted a response from the starter)

 

Went to ignition switch and found good 12V supply and good power out of switch in the start position to the PNP relay mentioned above.

 

Techs are thinking "ok there is a break b/w the ign. switch and the PNP relay." You are correct, I then found a set of wires with a fusible link, a relay and a unknown box since I could only see the front if it and it was electrical taped to the dash way up high.

 

We thought aftermarket alarm OR remote start, get ok from customer, rip it out repaired the wires car starts runs fine.

 

We find out then that the customer just bought the car, we suggest maybe calling the car lot and asking them about covering the repair even though the extended warranty they sold her does not cover this issue. The car lot calls us upset because we ripped out a system designed to disable this vehicle remotely if the person has not made their payment on the car. Also known as a "payment assurance device". Mind you there was no tag/sticker/NOTHING that told us what it was, nor did the customer seem to know what it was or that it was installed in their vehicle.

 

Here is a link to a company who makes these devices

http://www.passtimeusa.com/

 

Here is a information link talking about the systems

http://www.dealerbusinessjournal.com/articleview.php?id=579-18324

 

Kinda interesting, this is the first time we have seen this issue I suppose most people miss the payment then get the car reposessed.

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That's crazy. Sounds kind of illegal to me too keep it in there if the car is paid off (especially without the owners knowledge)

 

Typically I believe most places have you sign a document stating that you know it's there and what it does.

 

 

Ps. I'm a mechanic, I fix the things that techs fuck up.

 

Yah heard that the other day from Scott the for the first time, it will be awhile to get out of the habit haha.

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They're for us bad credit types. They do disclose it in the loan papers, and remove it when it's paid off.

 

See that's what we thought had to happen, so it's hard to say what happened on the customers end. Is the lot shady, or is the customer not telling us the whole story? We don't need to know for sure, but it sure raises some questions.

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seen it on a few cars too. its mainly those buy here pay here lots.

 

Yes. I've known about this for quite sometime. I've also worked with and dealt with quite a few used car lots, especially those who do their own in-house financing. Technically, that's not the ladies car anymore than your new car you make payments on is yours. It's the banks. And at an in-house fincance lot, it's the lots car until you finish paying it off. As far as the legality of it, I'm not sure what it'd be in Ohio.

 

I would assume that it would have to be made known to the customer in writing, verbal, or something but who knows. Was this what was actually causing the issue in the car you were working on? And you 'fixed' it? How did they find out? Did the lady actually call them and ask about it or did you guys contact them? You didn't tell the end of the story very well. :confused: You left out pertinent information I need to make a definitive judgement on either the lady or the car lot. :mad:

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She called the lot and asked if they had a remote for a remote start or aftermarket car alarm. They then told her that it had neither, but it did have the payment assurance device on the car. Idk how she reacted to it, but they called us and told us what it was and told us we shouldn't have taken it off because they activated it due to no payment. Although the owner claims that the payment was due next week sometime and that they were early.

 

And yes, it fixed the problem, car starts fine.

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seen it on a few cars too. its mainly those buy here pay here lots.

 

there's all kinds of these systems. Some you plug what looks like a sd card into a reader allows ignition to start. Others have like a key fob you have to wave around a sensor to allow it to start.

 

customer should of had better credits/thread

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She called the lot and asked if they had a remote for a remote start or aftermarket car alarm. They then told her that it had neither, but it did have the payment assurance device on the car. Idk how she reacted to it, but they called us and told us what it was and told us we shouldn't have taken it off because they activated it due to no payment. Although the owner claims that the payment was due next week sometime and that they were early.

 

And yes, it fixed the problem, car starts fine.

 

Thank you. Some closure. lol I can both complete and fill in the rest of the story, now.

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She called the lot and asked if they had a remote for a remote start or aftermarket car alarm. They then told her that it had neither, but it did have the payment assurance device on the car. Idk how she reacted to it, but they called us and told us what it was and told us we shouldn't have taken it off because they activated it due to no payment. Although the owner claims that the payment was due next week sometime and that they were early.

 

And yes, it fixed the problem, car starts fine.

 

 

Makes it easy for them to come get the car.

 

there's all kinds of these systems. Some you plug what looks like a sd card into a reader allows ignition to start. Others have like a key fob you have to wave around a sensor to allow it to start.

 

customer should of had better credits/thread

 

Really? Obviously if the customer is a shady dumbass they deserve to have lousy credit, and what not.

 

What happens when you get hit with a mountain of Medical bills, and the cherry on top is Identity theft? Idiotic comments like that are well idiotic.

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Lots have been using them for 10 years now.

 

Its cool that you found it. Sounds to me like the customers going to try and skip on the payment now. They know they're in the cars. And like stated they are removed when the car is payed off.

 

I'm not 100%, but I'm pretty sure we released the car to the dealership with the customers knowledge. I was in the front office when the dealership came to pay for it, but did not see who took it and it left the same day the dealership payed for it.

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  • 2 weeks later...
I've installed hundreds of these things. it's a shame you have to splice into the original harness. i see them at my current job from time to time. Still have the factory bypass jumper too. They're are a few versions in the pastime series and some have GPS onboard too.
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^^ what he said. my buddy had one on his car, he missed a payment by 1 day, and you could see tow trucks scouting his area before they even disabled the car. needless to say, he got it straightened out. if it were me, id pull that damn thing off the second i bought the car.. run it on a dc plug in my garage or something just to mess with em.
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