Slowbalt Posted February 5, 2011 Report Share Posted February 5, 2011 I was reading through another thread and stumbled upon a very interesting post by "Troublemaker". I just heard a really interesting This American Life (radio show on NPR which takes mundane things and looks at them from an interesting slant) called The Invention of Money. They talk to the Fed during part of it. This is separate from the government bailouts, but still a very interesting article. http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radi...ntion-of-money [/Quote] I have been interested in this topic for awhile as well and I am curious how others feel about this system. I was listening to Howard Stern yesterday and Kaycee Jordan was on and said she went to the bank to cash a check for 35,000 and all they could give her was 8000 and an IOU for the rest. I am not quite on the "Zeitgeist" bandwagon but I think the idea of a resourced based economy may be the way to go. What do you think about this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Cranium Posted February 5, 2011 Report Share Posted February 5, 2011 I don't know this is really out of the norm. When I bought my Impala I was only able to withdraw $2000 cash. I had to go to multiple branches to get the full amount. What they told me was if I wanted more than that I needed to give them 24 hours notice to make sure they had enough on hand. It was inconvenient, but it makes sense that banks are not keeping an insane amount of cash on hand. That just makes then a bigger target for a robbery. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rustlestiltskin Posted February 5, 2011 Report Share Posted February 5, 2011 vehicles: 2009 cobalt ss/tc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Spam Posted February 5, 2011 Report Share Posted February 5, 2011 So where the Fuck is the money then? If you have 100gz in the bank and you want to go buy a new car and try to take out 20, and they say nay. Then where the bell is that money? This is why we had a depression. And if they say we can get it for you in 24hrs, where are they getting it from? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slowbalt Posted February 5, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2011 I don't know this is really out of the norm. When I bought my Impala I was only able to withdraw $2000 cash. I had to go to multiple branches to get the full amount. What they told me was if I wanted more than that I needed to give them 24 hours notice to make sure they had enough on hand. It was inconvenient, but it makes sense that banks are not keeping an insane amount of cash on hand. That just makes then a bigger target for a robbery. I am not doubting that. The point about the bank not having enough money to pay cash was a smaller point of the grand scheme here. That is that money only has value because we believe it does. There is no inherent value in money. The great depression was partially triggered by a run on the bank and what is stopping that from happening now? A resource based economy seems more "real" and helpful I guess. I am just looking at gauging how people feel about this. Think of it like this, you want to buy a house so you go to the bank and get a loan. You put up some collateral for this loan (usually the house itself). The bank does NOT take the money it has and gives it to you, it creates the money and gives you money that did not exist before. As you pay back this "loan" you are paying back interest which further creates money that doesn't exist. There is not enough money to pay back all the outstanding debts owed and there never will be. Bankruptcy and inflation are products of this system. Let's say something happens and you can no longer pay the mortgage on the house. Since it is collateral on the loan, the bank takes the house even though it has not "lost" anything! This same idea is also how the US and other countries operate in foreign countries. We loan a government monies. They can't pay it back so we take their resources instead. @Lt. Aldo Raine Yes, that is my car. I'm sure there is a point there somewhere though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nurkvinny Posted February 5, 2011 Report Share Posted February 5, 2011 This gets into a decent amount of it: http://www.naturalnews.com/025243_banks_economy_national.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slowbalt Posted February 5, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2011 This gets into a decent amount of it: http://www.naturalnews.com/025243_banks_economy_national.html Thanks for putting this up as it is very straight forward with how things actually work behind the scenes. How do you feel about this system though? It works currently so is it beneficial to continue using it? Are the risks worth the benefits? Are the banks too powerful because of this? Any perceived problems with the system? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nurkvinny Posted February 5, 2011 Report Share Posted February 5, 2011 Thanks for putting this up as it is very straight forward with how things actually work behind the scenes. How do you feel about this system though? It works currently so is it beneficial to continue using it? Are the risks worth the benefits? Are the banks too powerful because of this? Any perceived problems with the system? I think in 100 years, we'll all be dead, and it won't matter. Out of all the things to worry about in this life - right or wrong - banking just isn't a topic I invest any time in. I just found the article informative. BTW, I like real, green cash so much that I was the single last person in my large company to do direct deposit. I liked knowing the money was in my human hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slowbalt Posted February 5, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2011 I somewhat feel that in our culture the banking system is very much like slavery. I say this because we are taught to value the "American Dream" to have a house, a car, kids, etc. In order to do these things most people need to take out loans. Healthcare is tied to the job you must work in order to make the payments so the people in general become less outspoken and more docile because their (and the rest of the family's) livelihood depend on that paycheck coming in. We are taught to value "owning" stuff and this keeps the economy afloat as things break or become old we buy new widgets to occupy ourselves and create a feeling of artificial happiness. Instead of being forced to work for the rich, white man, we are working for the rich white shareholders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nurkvinny Posted February 5, 2011 Report Share Posted February 5, 2011 http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_hMe0GeA_IhE/TLOwHnylzPI/AAAAAAAAAHw/mvks7unGQjg/s1600/please_stand_by.jpg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nurkvinny Posted February 5, 2011 Report Share Posted February 5, 2011 and... back to your regularly unscheduled thread. Sorry for the interruption. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slowbalt Posted February 5, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2011 That was interesting but to elaborate I am not trying to make this a "White man keeping the colored man down" or anything like that. Just want to discuss money, where it comes from, who benefits from this, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTQ B4U Posted February 5, 2011 Report Share Posted February 5, 2011 http://files.sharenator.com/20080918_jack_handey_parody_3_More_and_More_comics_or_9_if_your_counting-s606x515-92889-580.png Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Littleguy Posted February 5, 2011 Report Share Posted February 5, 2011 If the US were to go back to a "resource" based economy, although I think you probably mean a resource based currency (backed by gold, silver, or some other commodity), you would not have been able to get a loan to buy your car, and most people wouldn't be able to get home loans or other types of credit without very large cash down payments. As far as interest creating more money, this is completely true. In fact Albert Einstein said, "The most powerful force in the universe is compound interest." I think people who want to go back to the gold standard and completely get rid of government debt have their hearts in the right place, but are completely unrealistic if we want to live the kind of lives we do today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slowbalt Posted February 5, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2011 If the US were to go back to a "resource" based economy, although I think you probably mean a resource based currency (backed by gold, silver, or some other commodity), you would not have been able to get a loan to buy your car, and most people wouldn't be able to get home loans or other types of credit without very large cash down payments. No, I was actually referring to a resource based economy. It would create a world very much different from the current US for sure. I am not referring to money backed by something but using the "something" in and of itself. It has been argued that money and now credit is simply the evolution of our trading system in that it is more convenient than carrying around bushels of corn and whatnot. My concern is that anything that has value because it represents something else of value is easily manipulated for the betterment of those that have control over this system. We managed to get by for quite some time before this system and I am just trying to get perspectives on how people view the current system and potentially what could feasibly replace it, if this is even wanted in the first place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Littleguy Posted February 5, 2011 Report Share Posted February 5, 2011 Oh, actual resources, wow. I don't think that is remotely realistic, beneficial, or good in any way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slowbalt Posted February 5, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2011 I am not saying this is the best or the only way but why are you against this idea? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forrest Gump 9 Posted February 5, 2011 Report Share Posted February 5, 2011 Well, if you worry about money in the bank then don't use the bank. Do what my wife and lot of people so, spend your money and accumulate "resource". Problem solved!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Littleguy Posted February 5, 2011 Report Share Posted February 5, 2011 I am not saying this is the best or the only way but why are you against this idea? Because you cannot stop whatever you put value in by being manipulated by people with more power than you. The capitalist money/credit based system that we have now is what is allowing you and I to live better lives than anybody has ever lived in human history. Take a serious look at life in the past, and do it without the rose colored glasses. Until recently basic life necessities have been very difficult to obtain. If what you are upset about is some people having lots of money than you should just go out and make some yourself. This will require intelligence and hard work, and will not happen over night. I can't believe you are serious about what you are asking though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slowbalt Posted February 5, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2011 Because you cannot stop whatever you put value in by being manipulated by people with more power than you. The capitalist money/credit based system that we have now is what is allowing you and I to live better lives than anybody has ever lived in human history. Take a serious look at life in the past, and do it without the rose colored glasses. Until recently basic life necessities have been very difficult to obtain. If what you are upset about is some people having lots of money than you should just go out and make some yourself. This will require intelligence and hard work, and will not happen over night. I can't believe you are serious about what you are asking though. I think this is somewhat subjective. People in power now have control over money. Look at how much people make on wall st. This require no hard work and little intelligence. As far as life in the past, sure there were items that we didn't have that benefit our life but it wasn't so bad. People where happier in general, had control of their lives, had clean water to drink, had non tainted food to eat, etc. I have no problem with acquiring money, I am just curious how people feel about the current system. You seem to view it as a "lesser evil" if I am understanding you correctly. You understand money has no real value and that this could crash at any time due to this but it is the best we have so why change it? Is this correct or am I out of the ballpark here? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Littleguy Posted February 5, 2011 Report Share Posted February 5, 2011 As far as life in the past, sure there were items that we didn't have that benefit our life but it wasn't so bad. People where happier in general, had control of their lives, had clean water to drink, had non tainted food to eat, etc. Seriously!?!?!?!? Of all the ignorance in this thread, this has to be the top of the cake. If this is really what you think, then you need to learn some history. Medical technology, didn't really exist a hundred years ago. In large cities water was filthy and contaminated with feces, rotting animals, etc...Meat was a luxury food, and was not eaten on a daily basis. People used techniques like blood letting to cure disease because they had no idea at all what caused them, or how to get rid of them. Come on man, I really can't believe you are an actual person who has these thoughts. What do you want to pay your electricity bill and car payment by putting hundreds of pounds of corn in the mail to pay them? I really hope you are joking, it makes me feel stupider just being in this conversation with you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Littleguy Posted February 5, 2011 Report Share Posted February 5, 2011 Look at how much people make on wall st. This require no hard work and little intelligence. Then you should be able to do it quite easily. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slowbalt Posted February 5, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2011 Seriously!?!?!?!? Of all the ignorance in this thread, this has to be the top of the cake. If this is really what you think, then you need to learn some history. I'm not sure why you are taking this personally but I am trying to do my own research about different perspectives of money. No offense to you or anything. Medical technology, didn't really exist a hundred years ago. In large cities water was filthy and contaminated with feces, rotting animals, etc...Meat was a luxury food, and was not eaten on a daily basis. People used techniques like blood letting to cure disease because they had no idea at all what caused them, or how to get rid of them. Come on man, I really can't believe you are an actual person who has these thoughts. These are all your thoughts, not mine. These are all things that have happened but the key word is technology here. We currently have it and it has always been advancing and it will probably continue to do so. None of the things you mention need to depend on the monetary system and were created by technology. There are changes that would need to be made to lifestyle and culture over time to accommodate things, I would presume. What do you want to pay your electricity bill and car payment by putting hundreds of pounds of corn in the mail to pay them? I really hope you are joking, it makes me feel stupider just being in this conversation with you. Actually last week I traded home made sausage for home made beer. Not everyone needs corn, silly. I just used that as an example. Why do we need power companies anyways? You base your reason against something based on a hypothetical in the first place. Just interested in finding out how people feel about the monetary system and why it is beneficial( or isn't). No need for anyone to take anything personally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Littleguy Posted February 5, 2011 Report Share Posted February 5, 2011 You seem to view it as a "lesser evil" if I am understanding you correctly. You understand money has no real value and that this could crash at any time due to this but it is the best we have so why change it? Is this correct or am I out of the ballpark here? Money in and of itself has never had any value, even when we were on the gold standard. The value of money is now, and has always been the fact that it is readily excepted as a means of trade. Money is the only way to move past a basic agrarian economy, and even in an agrarian economy it is needed to have any kind of prosperity. Money is not a "lesser evil" it is necessary for our way of life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Littleguy Posted February 5, 2011 Report Share Posted February 5, 2011 I'm not sure why you are taking this personally but I am trying to do my own research about different perspectives of money. No offense to you or anything. I'm not taking it personally, and I don't mean to offend you personally either, but I can no longer be a part of a conversation that is not based on reality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.