An Automotive "Whodunit"

[Draco-REX]

I'm often impressed by the variety of minds that CR brings to the table. So I thought I'd present this Mystery to the CR brain trust and see what happens.

 

The scene:

the car started breaking up above 6K...regap plugs to 22 same problem new plugs gapped @24 same problem but now happening as low as 5400 finally take the fuel pump out and the entire float bowl area had fine felt like debris...

 

sump picture

http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff146/robispec/IMAG0511_zpsdbddbd78.jpg

 

the offending part

http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff146/robispec/IMAG0514_zpsa34c9944.jpg

 

The Accused:

I was lucky as I have many friends in the tc community they hit the problem FIRST TRY.. seems their intank filter does the same on their e-85 boosted cars too... I'm ASSUMING regular gasoline with ocasional e-85 uses will prevent this ...No Dangit I wont go there... ALL alcohols are SOLVENTS too...and they work particularly well on adhesives....like the kind glueing the felt material to the filter pleats...

 

The Defense:

For the sake of argument I went and cut my factory filter housing up. I have 4k+ only E85 Miles basically. I have no signs of any degredation to the filter. Now it is true that over time the paper gasket will now allow heavy enough flow for the E85. I haven't run into that scenario yet. It can't be a sitting issue either because mine sat the entire winter here. I wasn't able to put many miles on it.

http://i1128.photobucket.com/albums/m489/Donaldsummerton/IMG_20130528_180553_489_zpsae1f1868.jpg

http://i1128.photobucket.com/albums/m489/Donaldsummerton/IMG_20130528_180600_515_zpsa6b14a28.jpg

 

Summary:

E85 stands accused of destroying a fuel filter and clogging a fuel system. On one hand we have a partially dissolved filter from a car that is tracked heavily running E85. And on the other hand, another filter that was sitting in E85 for months with no appreciable degradation.

 

Is the Accused guilty? Or were there mitigating circumstances? Perhaps an accomplice?

 

What say you CR?

[Gergwheel1647545492]

I blame the fact that you are running e85 on a stock fuel system that is not meant to hold up to the drying out that the alchol will do to the entire system....

[macpyro2]

This

[Green Bastard]

I'm assuming the car's fuel system is not set up from factory to be able to run e-85, and these guys are running e-85 without any changes to the fuel system (at least that's what I'm gathering). I don't know why they are complaining about it. It seems to me like they should have expected problems.

 

After re-reading the original question, I would say e-85 would likely be to blame. The e-85 probably wouldn't break down a filter so much with it just sitting most of the time. I would think the damage would come from a combination of the e-85 and the fuel actually being pulled through the filter at the same time. I'm thinking there wouldn't be much (if any) erosion to a filter that was sitting more than it was working. I think there would still be degradation of the filter, it just depends on how often you drive the car that relates to how fast it is going to break down. This is just my opinion though, take it for what it is.

Edited May 29, 2013 by Green Bastard

[Draco-REX]

And yet a second car with E85 shows no signs of any issues. This on top of a number of other cars running E85 without issue either.

[Tripleskate]

And yet a second car with E85 shows no signs of any issues. This on top of a number of other cars running E85 without issue either.

It's only a matter of time. I saw this on FB and said the same thing, running E85 in a car not designed/modified for it WILL have issues in the long run.

[SloSVTruck]

Hmmm ive read alot about this kind of issue also.... i recently switched to e85 in my lightning. Now at first i switched my filter to a ford taurus flex fuel filter...... it worked but installing/removing it was a pain in the ass.

 

After doing some part # checking the regular taurus and the flex taurus have the same part#s. I recently removed the filter and cut it open to check it out and it was fine..... and looked like any other filter with the paper inside. Also switched to a lincoln navigator filter this time..... its bigger and what alot of guys run in these trucks(biggers better right?)

 

Now my truck isnt a daily driver really but it may see 10k miles a year if lucky and i think im just going to change the fuel filter around every 3k or every oil change just to be safe.

[Draco-REX]

Considering how many people are running E85 on non-E85 rated cars, I'm surprised I haven't seen more of this, if it's purely E85 at fault.

 

I'm thinking the top filter might have been defective from the factory to begin with, and the E85 hastened its demise.

 

The good news is that this was discovered just as shops were working on a fuel starvation issue. So hopefully the solutions will include E85 hardening as well.

[DKilbourne]

The info that I have gathered from others running E-85 is that the paper filters are doomed since the E-85 likes to draw in moisture. That moisture, over time, gets into the paper filters and "bloats" them so that the fuel flow is now lower through the filter. It sounds reasonable, but it was hit or miss for these guys. I just broke down and bought a stainless mesh filter, so that I wouldn't have to worry about the paper possibly being an issue.