Texas high school shooting

[Geeesammy]

More laws will prevent mass shootings.

 

Look at how effective laws are against heroin.

 

Look at how effective laws are against murder

 

Look at how effective laws are against rape.

 

Look at how effective laws are against fraud.

 

Look at how effective gun free zone signs are.

 

I mean the proof is clearly in the pudding guys.

[o0n8]

 

Why have laws when you can just have The Purge everyday?

[RedRocket1647545505]

 

Why have laws when you can just have The Purge everyday?

 

Let's get this party started.

[coltboostin]

Not for nothing, but fingerprint scanners are garbage.

of a whole bunch of gun safes sucking, with fingerprint scanners towards the end. You can lift prints with scotch tape and super glue and load the results into photoshop to do whatever you want with, including making casts. Certainly within the realm of possibility for a bored teenager with access to youtube.

 

1) The synthetic he used was opaque. The reader could easily read through it- he is using HIS finger for the "test"- its most likely reading HIS finger LOL. He proved this himself at 32:30 LOL. This is bunk, and the 3000 views in 5 years is proof of it.

 

2) You need the print, and the code, to get into this safe.

 

If my kid can do all that without me noticing I failed as a parent ... right??? Lolz

 

 

Yes, 100%. I honestly don't know, but are you a parent?

 

You're either a helicopter parent who never leaves the house and never lets teenagers out of your sight, or kids can pull this off. I don't think leaving the house for a couple of hours while your teenager is home alone is a parenting fail.

 

I honestly don't know, but are you a parent?

 

 

Its not about being next to your kid 24/7. Its about making sure they have value in themselves, value in life, respect authority and always respect their parents. You know, the basics. When I was 16 I woudl not have attempted some counter inlet espionage James bond bullfuck plan to break into a bio metric security gun box for fear that I would get the had of god to the back of my ass- AND I WOULD DISAPPOINT MY PARENTS. This isnt staying out past curfew, this isnt mouthing off to mom in an argument, this isnt cutting class, This isn't having your first beer at your buddies house party, this is trying to gain access to a weapon that's sole purpose is to end life. There is no higher "no fly zone" in any household.

 

So if your kids think of doing this at 16, then yes, they simply didn't respect you. So yes, as a parent, you failed.

 

 

Its pretty shocking to me that this seems to be a novel concept.

[Supplicium]

 

Its pretty shocking to me that this seems to be a novel concept.

 

its tough for libtards to grasp

[greg1647545532]

I honestly don't know, but are you a parent?

 

I have 3 wonderful kids and 0 delusions that they are the way they are solely because of my parenting skills. I'm lucky that they were born 100% happy and healthy, with no physical or mental issues (yet). I have friends with challenging kids, and it can't be the parenting because it's only 1 out of 3 or 1 out of 4. Some kids are easier than others, and once we factor in mental illness, all bets on parenting are off.

 

After all, I'm told that all school shooters are ipso facto mentally ill. Can attentive parenting cure mental illness?

 

Of course not. And it's ridiculous to expect a 100% success rate on parents even identifying mental illness before it's too late, given the subtle cues of certain illnesses and the fact that many of them don't manifest themselves until the kids are teenagers anyway.

 

So yes, I'm a parent, but I'd like to think I'm a humble one. Can I say with 100% confidence that none of my kids will never shoot someone? I don't think so. Can I say with 100% confidence that they won't shoot someone with a gun that I keep in the house? Absolutely.

[AngryBMW]

I have 3 wonderful kids and 0 delusions that they are the way they are solely because of my parenting skills. I'm lucky that they were born 100% happy and healthy, with no physical or mental issues (yet). I have friends with challenging kids, and it can't be the parenting because it's only 1 out of 3 or 1 out of 4. Some kids are easier than others, and once we factor in mental illness, all bets on parenting are off.

 

After all, I'm told that all school shooters are ipso facto mentally ill. Can attentive parenting cure mental illness?

 

Of course not. And it's ridiculous to expect a 100% success rate on parents even identifying mental illness before it's too late, given the subtle cues of certain illnesses and the fact that many of them don't manifest themselves until the kids are teenagers anyway.

 

So yes, I'm a parent, but I'd like to think I'm a humble one. Can I say with 100% confidence that none of my kids will never shoot someone? I don't think so. Can I say with 100% confidence that they won't shoot someone with a gun that I keep in the house? Absolutely.

 

Serious question because it's hard to tell with your posts...Are you a supporter of the banning/confiscation of personal firearms in the US? Is that your solution here?

-Marc

[greg1647545532]

Serious question because it's hard to tell with your posts...Are you a supporter of the banning/confiscation of personal firearms in the US? Is that your solution here?

-Marc

 

No, I would not support that.

[Geeto67]

No, I would not support that.

 

It never ceases to surprise me how few people see that there is a middle ground between total absence of restriction and an absolute ban.

 

That being said, this thread is a raging dumpster fire of stupidity. I have to give you credit greg, I read this and immediately saw I didn't have the patience to deal with this much ignorance, I don't know how you do it.

[Orion]

It never ceases to surprise me how few people see that there is a middle ground between total absence of restriction and an absolute ban.

 

That being said, this thread is a raging dumpster fire of stupidity. I have to give you credit greg, I read this and immediately saw I didn't have the patience to deal with this much ignorance, I don't know how you do it.

 

:thumbup:

[AngryBMW]

No, I would not support that.

 

Ok...so another serious question. I scanned the thread and may have missed it, but what is your solution to school shootings?

 

It never ceases to surprise me how few people see that there is a middle ground between total absence of restriction and an absolute ban.

 

That being said, this thread is a raging dumpster fire of stupidity. I have to give you credit greg, I read this and immediately saw I didn't have the patience to deal with this much ignorance, I don't know how you do it.

 

If you don't have the patience to deal with this thread, then why post your .02 and add fuel to the said dumpster fire?

 

Are you seriously trying to say that there are no restrictions on purchasing a gun in the US? Guess having a legal age to purchase, requiring background check, etc would have prevented this one? Oh, wait, the kid was a minor and STOLE the guns he used, right? So what would have prevented THIS shooting...or any other? Just going to blanket respond with 'more gun regulations'? Or, do you have something specific?

-Marc

[greg1647545532]

Ok...so another serious question. I scanned the thread and may have missed it, but what is your solution to school shootings?

 

What a silly question. I don't proclaim to have a "solution" to school shootings.

 

I do, however, think that fewer guns in circulation would mean fewer abused guns, which would mean fewer dead children. What, if anything, gun owners could do on their own to make this idyllic reality possible is an exercise I'll leave up to you.

[AngryBMW]

What a silly question. I don't proclaim to have a "solution" to school shootings.

 

I do, however, think that fewer guns in circulation would mean fewer abused guns, which would mean fewer dead children. What, if anything, gun owners could do on their own to make this idyllic reality possible is an exercise I'll leave up to you.

 

I don't think it is a silly question at all. I was being sincere. Reading this thread, you have so many replies (mostly smartass ones) without much content of what you would propose to stop them, I had to ask.

 

I see your point of hoping less guns in circulation would equal less dead children. I just don't know if I can personally agree with it. I personally cannot blame the gun...I blame the individual that wants to commit the crime.

-Marc

[greg1647545532]

I don't think it is a silly question at all. I was being sincere.

 

You sincerely thought a 38 year old software developer had a solution to school shootings? I'm flattered at your opinion of me.

[Geeto67]

If you don't have the patience to deal with this thread, then why post your .02 and add fuel to the said dumpster fire?

 

Because CR. Duh. I mean that's pretty par for the course of this place.

 

 

Are you seriously trying to say that there are no restrictions on purchasing a gun in the US?

 

Shit, I am getting sucked in....ok...

 

No, but there certainly are people advocating for that position....cough...NRA...cough. There are also people advocating for a total ban and it's an equally extreme position. Most, but not all, of people who talk about things in the context of a ban are usually falling to the other extreme of the spectrum which to me is an ineffectual position.

 

Any meaningful improvement (not solution, just improvement, there is no 100% solution) is going to involve work in all areas, including gun control. Anybody advocating that you can make things meaningfully better by improving only one area genuinely isn't interested in making progress in this area. This is a risk management problem and there are ways to manage the risk better without an outright ban, but it is going to require some movement in the gun control space.

 

anybody who is saying "if you give an inch it will lead to a ban" or a "ban" isn't the solution" isn't having a serious conversation. yes most people agree a ban isn't the path, so move along and let's focus on what might be the right the path and be open to more moderate gun control.

 

Guess having a legal age to purchase, requiring background check, etc would have prevented this one? Oh, wait, the kid was a minor and STOLE the guns he used, right? So what would have prevented THIS shooting...or any other? Just going to blanket respond with 'more gun regulations'? Or, do you have something specific?

-Marc

 

 

I don't presume to know what would have prevented this one or not, or whether this is an outlier situation or something that fits a pattern. I don't presume to know these things because nobody is researching it because the funding is blocked. I'm an old broken record on this but it's those same extremest types that have frustrated that. I have said it before, and I'll say it again - remove the dickey amendment, get some real meaningful research in this area going, analyze the data, and make small adjustments to the existing framework with supplemental legislative support to maximize the efforts to manage this risk.

[greg1647545532]

I see your point of hoping less guns in circulation would equal less dead children. I just don't know if I can personally agree with it. I personally cannot blame the gun...I blame the individual that wants to commit the crime.

-Marc

 

Anyway, I can certainly see your point of hoping we can solve... all mental health issues? Bullying? Bad parenting? That just seems like a huge ask, and something that the rest of the world probably didn't have to do in order to "solve" school shootings.

[RedRocket1647545505]

open to more moderate gun control.

 

OK. I'm open. What's your plan?

 

 

 

I don't presume to know what would have prevented this one or not, or whether this is an outlier situation or something that fits a pattern. I don't presume to know these things because nobody is researching it because the funding is blocked. I'm an old broken record on this but it's those same extremest types that have frustrated that. I have said it before, and I'll say it again - remove the dickey amendment, get some real meaningful research in this area going, analyze the data, and make small adjustments to the existing framework with supplemental legislative support to maximize the efforts to manage this risk.

 

Again with this Dickey Amendment stuff?

[RedRocket1647545505]

Anyway, I can certainly see your point of hoping we can solve... all mental health issues? Bullying? Bad parenting? That just seems like a huge ask, and something that the rest of the world probably didn't have to do in order to "solve" school shootings.

 

You were in the Air Force, correct? So I'm assuming you're a well-traveled individual. Do people in other countries act like people in the US?

[coltboostin]

After all, I'm told that all school shooters are ipso facto mentally ill. Can attentive parenting cure mental illness?

 

PS. Is my gun safe actually safe, or not? LOL

 

Educators are trained professionals, and are TRAINED to ID this shit. Some go to school longer than doctors and all require continuing education.

 

I am not a professional educator. I volunteer at my son's school pretty regularly. I can tell in 2 minutes which kids are a little off.

 

My son is 4.

 

When I was in High school, you can tell within 2 minutes which kids where a little off. In a week you know which kids where into weird shit. In 2 weeks you heard about the kid that bragged about trying to set a cat of fire.

 

Its not rocket science. We know who these kids are. No one just wants to step up and put a label on it.

 

At all stages of life people have a general understanding of what and who is normal. There is nothing wrong with being abnormal, however in the past the abnormal ones where Identified and handled pretty quickly. Now since we are society of fucking snowflakes, we have to treat everyone "equally". Identifying the red flags for kids that have this potential would be very easy with proper profiling. ALL of them are writing on social media, diaries, and have previous incidences that can be tracked. NONE of them come as a surprise.

 

 

I do, however, think that fewer guns in circulation would mean fewer abused guns, which would mean fewer dead children

 

All the guns used in this shooting were legal, and on no ones radar for "gun control". A simple pistol and small shot gun. Are you suggesting that all pistons should be turned in?

[greg1647545532]

You were in the Air Force, correct? So I'm assuming you're a well-traveled individual. Do people in other countries act like people in the US?

 

I don't understand the question. People in this thread are proposing that school shootings are caused by mental illness, bullying, and/or bad parenting. Are you suggesting that there's another element involved? Something about the nature of the way Americans act? Or are you suggesting that there something unique to the way Americans act that causes mental illness, bullying, or bad parenting?

 

In other words, I can say, "Sure, people are people wherever you go," or I can say, "Of course not, every country has a unique culture," but what are you getting at? What cultural difference causes Americans to shoot up schools?

[coltboostin]

its tough for libtards to grasp

 

 

Funny thing is I would be considered a liberal I would assume. I voted for Obama. I think Trump is a Mom n' Dad Motorsports fucking moron who would be a failure if it was not for the millions in start up he received from family. I am absolutely embarrassed as an American he is our commander in chief (problem is Hilary would have been just as bad). I support abortion, I grew up poor and on welfare. I absolutely think gun control needs to be tighter. I think people need to pass physical (proof of ability), written, and mental exam become being given a LICENSE to own a firearm..... (the problem with this being that all of the "grandfathered" gun owners would never give up the guns and most would not bother to test)

 

 

But my brain WORKS lol. Its mind boggling to not see that fixing this starts at home, and trickle down to early Identification of problem kids in the education system and simple social media tracking.

[greg1647545532]

PS. Is my gun safe actually safe, or not? LOL

 

It's a deterrent, if you think it's anything more than that you're fooling yourself.

 

Its not rocket science. We know who these kids are. No one just wants to step up and put a label on it.

 

No one? You make it sound so simple, why isn't anyone trying it? Maybe in a red state where conservatives can do what they want? Like Texas, maybe.

 

All the guns used in this shooting were legal, and on no ones radar for "gun control". A simple pistol and small shot gun. Are you suggesting that all pistons should be turned in?

 

For fucks sake, what is it with you people? Go read upthread where I already answered this question.

 

eta: Also, no, I hate rotaries.

 

(jokes and jokes and jokes)

[greg1647545532]

But my brain WORKS lol. Its mind boggling to not see that fixing this starts at home, and trickle down to early Identification of problem kids in the education system and simple social media tracking.

 

Is that what other countries do better than us?

[Geeto67]

OK. I'm open. What's your plan?

 

Step 1: Research and collect data

Step 2: Analyze data and draft legislation accordingly

Step 3: profit?

 

Notice how I didn't say draft gun control legislation accordingly but generally "legislation", why? because part of the analysis will also reveal what are red herrings and better served through legislation or gov't programs in other areas. Some will be gun laws, some will be physical security laws, some will address other health concerns.

 

Again with this Dickey Amendment stuff?

 

Yup. It's still there then it is still frustrating meaningful research. At this point gun related deaths are least researched health epidemic with the most amount of deaths. Consider it step 0.5.

Edited May 22, 2018 by Geeto67

[RedRocket1647545505]

What cultural difference causes Americans to shoot up schools?

 

I wish I knew.

 

I guess I'm just trying to make the point that Americans are culturally different than other countries in many different ways, not just guns. So what is it about our culture that causes people to want to do this, more so than many other developed nations? Why are our people going down this path towards mass violence when others are not? Are the guns making them evil, or were they molded into this evil thing throughout their life and then chose a gun as their tool of choice? And if it's the latter, what is it that's molding them this way?

 

And I realize this isn't a single answer solution.