Health Care Passes... We are all screwed.O

[chevysoldier]

I think people should be able to kick their representatives square in the junk/snatch when they fail to listen to their constituents.

The people did want this, the polls (there are polls?) don't reflect those that didn't want it because it wasn't liberal enough.

[BMMW]

Its unfortunate that liars, cheats and thieves continue to mold us

[r1crusher]

Regardless, it's still something I think should be implemented.

[chevysoldier]

Regardless, it's still something I think should be implemented.

Your avatar is hot btw.

[r1crusher]

LOL! Spanks!

[Cheech]

I think people should be able to kick their representatives square in the junk/snatch when they fail to listen to their constituents.

and what happens when 2 of their constituents have polar opposite viewpoints?

[chevysoldier]

and what happens when 2 of their constituents have polar opposite viewpoints?

One constituent gets to hit the other?

[Disclaimer]

Roshambo for it.

[Casper]

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5gOfZ-GqupWhK1jO7SwYD4-G5bUWQD9EMG00O1

It's effecting big business this badly, you know it's going to destroy the little guys. Thanks Obama!

[Disclaimer]

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5gOfZ-GqupWhK1jO7SwYD4-G5bUWQD9EMG00O1

It's effecting big business this badly, you know it's going to destroy the little guys. Thanks Obama!

The costs to put new cell phone towers badly affects AT&T's profit too. If they could get those towers constructed for nothing it would be better for them. Evil private contractors, you're destroying AT&T by charging them to do stuff.

You see at the bottom of that link you posted? "AT&T shares climbed 7 cents to $26.22 in afternoon trading." Life goes on...

[RVTPilot]

The costs to put new cell phone towers badly affects AT&T's profit too. If they could get those towers constructed for nothing it would be better for them. Evil private contractors, you're destroying AT&T by charging them to do stuff.

You see at the bottom of that link you posted? "AT&T shares climbed 7 cents to $26.22 in afternoon trading." Life goes on...

The cell tower reference is confined to the telecom industry. These charges/fees/taxes are crossing industry boundaries. That will have an effect on a much larger scale.

[Casper]

The costs to put new cell phone towers badly affects AT&T's profit too. If they could get those towers constructed for nothing it would be better for them. Evil private contractors, you're destroying AT&T by charging them to do stuff.

You see at the bottom of that link you posted? "AT&T shares climbed 7 cents to $26.22 in afternoon trading." Life goes on...

[Disclaimer]

I'll concede that it may've not been the best example.

But, there are 'costs of doing business' in every industry. This is just another one of them.

The article posted didn't say AT&T was hurting or strapped. Just that

Companies say the health care overhaul will make a subsidy that companies receive for retiree drug coverage taxable in 2011

So, they're being taxed on a subsidy (aka free money- hence the NON-cash charge), they're already receiving. Would it be any different if they just said they were lowing the benefit amount?

[jbot]

i thought one of the pluses of this new legislation was that those who had insurance wouldn't be affected?

sounds like those who have insurance will be affected. am i wrong-0?

[RVTPilot]

True, there are costs of doing business, but regardless of what your company's earnings are, a sudden billion dollar hit is a lot. Enough to make make organizations have to re-do their business model. In this economy, that's going to be very tough on some organizations.

[Disclaimer]

See how they reported the amount - $1B.... yea, anytime I see an amount, I go find the percentage (and vice versa)

AT&T financials Q4 2009: http://www.att.com/Investor/Growth_Profile/download/master_Q4_09.pdf

Page 4 is a financial summary. Big picture here. They pulled in $123B in 2009, Expenses were $101B. So, this hits their bottom line just shy of 1% in the grand scheme of additional expenses. I think they're gonna be OK and it's not affecting 'big business this badly'. It won't be Armageddon @ AT&T.

The title of the article reads a little differently when you put the percentage in: "AT&T will take on < 1% additional non-cash charge for health care"

Edited March 26, 2010 by JRMMiii
Clarification on what I meant by < 1%

[dmagicglock]

fwiw that cost of 1 billion is in the first quarter alone, so maybe its more of the 3-4% of annual earnings. but lets say the average AT&T employee makes 50k a year... at 1 billion dollars even, thats what 20,000 jobs they could supply right there?

[Disclaimer]

20,000 jobs to do what? You want AT&T to turn into the gov't and just pay people to dig ditches?

OTOH, if they take away ALL the benefits above salary they offer to their current employees, they could save a bunch of money doing that too.

[dmagicglock]

20,000 jobs to do what? You want AT&T to turn into the gov't and just pay people to dig ditches?

OTOH, if they take away ALL the benefits above salary they offer to their current employees, they could save a bunch of money doing that too.

you're missing the point, its bullshit legislation like this that handicaps the private industry from being able to provide jobs. Is it a wonder why the government is the only sector adding jobs? 16k IRS jobs?

I should know better than to use logic and reason with you, you can't nail jello to a tree.

[jbot]

if i found out my expenses were projected to suddenly increase by 1%, i'd shit bigger brix than if i saw james earl jones in my toilet. cause in reality (in this given example), my net is taking a hit of 4.5%

i have no love for AT&T, and i like key things about this legislation (not how it was jammed in without the lube of the constitution, but nonetheless), but don't try to play down the impact this will have on the economy. this is just one company with a healthy net income. what about a struggling medium sized business, just barely getting by due to the shit economy? how about a small business that used to do automotive work? you think they'll be pleased it was "just 1%"?

[Disclaimer]

you're missing the point, its bullshit legislation like this that handicaps the private industry from being able to provide jobs.

How so? Find me where, statistically, this is true. A lot of people pay a lot of face time complaining that "We would do 'x', but we're stuck having to deal with 'y'", yet I have very little information to show that it's anything more than an excuse. If they REALLY needed positions filled and people hired, they'd do it. Where there's money to be made and opportunities to be had, they'll do it - including hiring people. Because if they don't... their competition will.

Is it a wonder why the government is the only sector adding jobs? 16k IRS jobs?

Jobs are jobs. I suppose you won't find any conservatives taking those jobs, right? All the people who rail against the gov't and bureaucracy.. I won't find a single one in those positions? People putting their money where their mouth is? Unless their values can be bought and sold....

I should know better than to use logic and reason with you, you can't nail jello to a tree.

I'm sorry you've haven't mastered that yet. It's alright, everyone has some marketable skill.

[Disclaimer]

...what about a struggling medium sized business, just barely getting by due to the shit economy? how about a small business that used to do automotive work? you think they'll be pleased it was "just 1%"?

Free market right? Everyone plays by the same rules on the same landscape. If these small/medium-sized business can't make it work, then capitalism will *insert Russian accent* crush them and they'll be replaced by other small/med business that will. No?

[jbot]

yeah, except in a real free market, the gov doesn't tamper with the economy one way or the other by fisting the anus that makes up a large portion of expenses called healthcare.

but i guess what you're saying would make sense if it made sense. but it doesn't, comrade.

heh heh. i just wanted to say "comrade" at the end of a petulant retort. i would never suggest you're a socialist or communist, even if you say so about my ideas.

[Disclaimer]

If I had more time, I could formulate a better argument. I shouldn't have taken it in that direction upon retrospect. I will return later, better.

[shittygsxr]

If I had more time, I could formulate a better argument. I shouldn't have taken it in that direction upon retrospect. I will return later, better.

The guy that wont part with some of his hard earned money for a proper motorcycle jacket is cool with paying taxes for other peoples health care? Gimme a fucking break.