Mikejr879 Posted February 19, 2012 Report Share Posted February 19, 2012 Cabin fever is setting in here, so I got my hands on Sonny Barger's Guide to Motorcycling. It was a bit of a surprise to me when I read that one of the Hells Angels founding members dislikes Harley Davidson! He currently rides a Victory Vision. So I did some digging and Victory is indeed, from the technical standpoint superior! And Polaris bought the Indian Motorcycle brand back in April, they are planning on to increase the production significantly. Its currently at 25 chiefs a year.Harley finally needs to step up their game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoblick Posted February 19, 2012 Report Share Posted February 19, 2012 ill throw my input into the mix.its about style.not saying victorys arent good looking, but the typical people who buy harleys want that old school retro looking bike, looks and feels heavy and has "character"this "character" i speak of would be the unsettling vibration, harsh riding, loud, and heavy as hell.victory bikes are superior in performance, they have better suspension (who doesnt have better suspension than harley), usually make more power, and usually are lighter.but they look to "futuristic" to most.i have ridden victory's version of the street glide, very nice bike, better handling, better road manners, quieter, no weird engine noise, more balanced, and in my opinion more reliable.but i do prefer the look of my old street glide over they victory.victory builds very nice bikes, but they wont win over the typical harley guy. never.most those guys wont take a second glance at another bike.i think victory needs to create a bike that DOESNT have that damn long tank. they but it on everything, and it just makes the lineup look very similar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jblosser Posted February 19, 2012 Report Share Posted February 19, 2012 Sonny Barger's Guide?Lemme guess:Chapter 1 - Find a bike to stealChapter 2 - Deal drugsChapter 3 - Treat women like shitChapter 4 - Violence solves everything, even if not requiredetc...If it has to be one of those two, and not knowing what you want to do with it, I'd say get the Harley. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tpoppa Posted February 19, 2012 Report Share Posted February 19, 2012 HD is a tshirt company that also happens to sell motorcycles. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyler524 Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 HD is a tshirt company that also happens to sell motorcycles.I would be curious to see the revenue/profit from their bikes vs apparel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pokey Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 If I were to ever go the cruiser/touring route......I would write a check for that Victory Cross Country in a heartbeat!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magley64 Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 (edited) Harley no longer sells motorcycles, what they sell is emotion and image...If pretending to be a badass from the 60's that looks like a pirate is your game, buy a harley. If you want a performance machine that requires very little maintenence, buy one of the big 4's 600 or 1000 offeringsIf you want a performance machine that is comfortable all day, get a hypersportIf you want a machine that is comfortable for 2, but still has the ability to thrill you in the twisties, get a sport tourer, or a dual sport.if you want something that is directed 100% at comfort, but still has some guts for going, get a goldwing or a connie...I can't imagine a single scenario where a harley is the best option...ever... they sell apparel, jewelery, and their most expensive jewelery is their butt jewelery. Edited February 20, 2012 by magley64 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simplysix Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 I would be curious to see the revenue/profit from their bikes vs apparel.I remember reading somewhere there profit is about 50% from bikes, and 50% from other merchandise (tshirts, hats, jackets etc) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pokey Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 (edited) Harley no longer sells motorcycles, what they sell is emotion and image...If pretending to be a badass from the 60's that looks like a pirate is your game, buy a harley. If you want a performance machine that requires very little maintenence, buy one of the big 4's 600 or 1000 offeringsIf you want a performance machine that is comfortable all day, get a hypersportIf you want a machine that is comfortable for 2, but still has the ability to thrill you in the twisties, get a sport tourer, or a dual sport.if you want something that is directed 100% at comfort, but still has some guts for going, get a goldwing or a connie...I can't imagine a single scenario where a harley is the best option...ever... they sell apparel, jewlery, and their most expensive jewlery is their butt jewlery.Surely you are not referring to the C14 as the 100% comfortable "connie"? If so.......I happen to know first hand how comfy they can be made, however their performance and handling is amazing!!! Harleys are fine bikes, I have enjoyed every single one I have riden although not for me. They are considered the American motorcycle, and not everyone that owns one is a poser wannabe. Edited February 20, 2012 by Pokey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conn-e-rot Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 If I was buying it would be victory Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magley64 Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 They are considered the American motorcycle, and not everyone that owns one is a poser wannabe."they" are full of shit... "they" have copied designs from everyone... "they" only survived because uncle sam imposed hefty tarrifs on superior machines from overseas..."they" do not represent america, they represent the worst of america, underachieving, content with mediocrity, and declining. "They" refuse to evolve with changing times, and will become extinct in short order.We need a REAL american motorcycle company. GM, Ford, Chrysler, all were grossly mismanaged, and begged for their lives once... now they seem to be on the right track. (even though there were casualties in the process)As for the "not everyone that rides them is a poser" well sure, some real motorcycle enthusiasts are extremely pre-occupied with that "look", and that's what they buy, so be it... but I see no good reason to buy a brand new replica of a bike that was built 40 years ago, why not buy the real thing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pokey Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 They have copied from nobody, they choose not to build or change too far beyond their expertise because that is what the buyers want. In actuality everyone else has copied off them when it comes to that market niche. They have no problem exceeding the EPA and European emissions "many others still struggle", they probably have one of the best if not the best fuel injection systems in the business. Their paint and attention to detail is almost unrivaled, and their bikes are EXTREMELY reliable compared to any OEM out there. You can actually still work on the bikes, upgrade and bling out to the max, and never have to worry about finding a dealer when you travel. Say what you want about some of the poser and fake owners "plenty of punk ass squids out there too", but to say the bikes are junk or outdated is simply not true. At least they put out bikes that people actually want, Honda tends to put out bikes that NOBODY wants. I am not brand myopic by any means, I love all motorcycles for what they are. I am more of an ADV or sport touring kind of guy, but I have enjoyed every HOG I have ridden......they were allot of fun! Choose what you ride and ride what you choose, its that simple. Do I get tired of all the Harley clothing and bullshit marketing? You bet your ass I do, but that is ultimatley their choice to look like an asshat. Harley is a pure marketing genius, that is a fact for sure! They sell a lifestyle and an image better than anybody, and they make damn good motorcycles IMHO too. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monstrosity Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 I love the Victory Vegas 8 ball at the same time the HD Nightrod I have much lust for. Funny thing is about the Nightrod most of the HD guys I know dont like the Nightrod/Vrod. They will make snide comments and claim its not a true HD since its so modern compared to the rest of the lineup . Whatever, evolution is good! I like both companies and those are the top 2 from each that I would want! It would more than likely boil down to what I could get the better deal on... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tpoppa Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 I would be curious to see the revenue/profit from their bikes vs apparel.HD makes far more from apparel & licensing then from motorcycle sales. The apparel is 95% produced outside of 'merica . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyler524 Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 Their paint and attention to detail is almost unrivaled, I do have to agree with the paint comment as I have personally worked on and designed equipment for their painting department. Their requirements and money that they spend on their painting systems is quite crazy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadyone Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 Victory. Better in every way over a Harley. Plus your not payin for a name. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magley64 Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 They have copied from nobodyBullshit, they started out copying indian, engine design, suspension, all copied from indian... then when they introduced the sportster, it was SUCH an obvious british muscle bike knockoff that they even copied the kick starter (on the opposite side as the rest of their bikes)And they haven't come up with a new design since...Unless you count the amf engine (the first engine that they ever made that could reliably crack 20,000 miles without a complete rebuild)Or the vrod, which is a porche design...Harley is a fucking joke in the world motorcycle community. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMHGUY Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 i like the victory cross country myself... and will add one to my garage as soon as I can.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drew95gt Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 Harley is a fucking joke in the world motorcycle community.Only in countries that don't like cruisers. They just make a niche product, the niche just happens to be huge in this country. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoblick Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 at the dealer expo this weekend i was talking to akrapovic, and they stepped into the harley ring. for what reason? They said 70% of new registered bikes last year were Harleys.thats crazy!i will agree that there paint is by far one of the best in the industry.i think the designs are spot on for that rugged bad ass lookthe image is there, the lifestyle is there.i disagree that they are reliable. all the bearings in the motor are taiwan, and most other components are china and mexico. out of every bike i have ever owned i was more concerned about not making it back on the harley on a trip. is there dealer support everywhere? yeah! will they bend you over for service? double yeah! out of all the bikes i have owned my Street glide was one of the most eye appealing bikes, and got the most attention, but it was not the most fun to ride.there motor and suspension is very very outdated.especially suspension. and the chassis.. dont get me started. who mounts a big unbalanced motor to the swing arm of a bike by rubber mounts? and then they wonder why its so sloppy.you can ride the wheels off a harley if you want to be throwing around a 800lb beast all day that is loose as a $2 dollar whore. it will make you work for sure.i just got tired of that, i wanted something more nimble, and had a chassis and suspension that actually worked well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alienpi Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 I've been eyeing the Motus. Maybe in a few years there'll be a few on the used market. :-)http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FhaRdPJI3sUhttp://www.motusmotorcycles.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C-bus Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 Other than the Hammer S, I haven't really found a Victory that appeals to me. Where they really try to compete with Harley is with resale. Victory owners also feel that the secondary market should pay for bling and tassels. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conn-e-rot Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 i like the victory cross country myself... and will add one to my garage as soon as I can.. I agree Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pokey Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 Bullshit, they started out copying indian, engine design, suspension, all copied from indian... then when they introduced the sportster, it was SUCH an obvious british muscle bike knockoff that they even copied the kick starter (on the opposite side as the rest of their bikes)And they haven't come up with a new design since...Unless you count the amf engine (the first engine that they ever made that could reliably crack 20,000 miles without a complete rebuild)Or the vrod, which is a porche design...Harley is a fucking joke in the world motorcycle community.Obvious hater of Harley. You could hate on Honda a bit too for stop making the Blackbird, which was one of their best of all time. New VFR is a joke, and still no new ST or major upgrades/redesign for the Goldwing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pokey Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 Yeah I am following Motus with interest......was that Mid Ohio? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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