Wasn't speaking to CLE so not sure if that was what you are referring to, if so, that wasn't what I was replying to. Was replying to the Mike Brown topic and was thinking you were referring to the guy in NYC. As for the CLE stuff, haven't looked into it any further than seeing that the toy gun looks exactly like a 1911, and being that, that is a fact, I would have killed the kid, or anyone with it too. If I am a cop and I get a call to something like that, I am going home at night, I am not going to second guess myself and die. I played with guns all my life, I was never allowed to take them from my house or a friends house, in cars, parks, whatever. Exactly for this reason. Parenting, it goes a long way, probably would have been helpful in the CLE and the Brown case both..... Edit; Also for the record, if you are in a high speed chase from the cops and continue to flee, then yeah, they got what they deserved. Edit 2: now reading the report, and yes, if in fact they did kill people and escalated to the point they had to kill someone, that's an issue. And yes, I remember that car chase with the 2 people. They did not need to be shot to death, but simply stopping might have been a good idea? I mean that's what you're taught to do. Sorry they had to die, but I would have been totally fine with being ruffed up(a lot).