J.W.

You're right, Europe is doing MUCH better

Medical shouldn't be an industry, it should be a service.

Services don't have mandates.

The only reason you guys are arguing about this is because large corporations have put millions of dollars into advertising to make this seem like a bad idea.

The big companies (especially the pharmaceutical companies) have already figured out how to maintain their profits. They have been working on it since this idea was first introduced.

The arbitrary scale of "quality" is going to be the real problem here. If X percentage of patients have to have blood pressure in Y range, the doctors are going to push the quickest (but not necessarily best) fix... "here take this pill." Lifestyle changes are the real fix for these problems but if a young MD, still owing from med school, has a salary that is dependent on the government's definition of "quality" then the care will surely not be in the patient's best interest. Why suggest diet and exercise if that won't maintain your salary for the next year? Keep in mind, this is only my complaint about one of these points and certainly not my biggest complaint. It's just one of the easiest to single out. It's also the way that big pharma has already seen that they will maintain their grip on the entire process. The plan changes some procedure but it "fixes" little if anything.

Yep. Figured that was coming. Thanks' date=' guys. :fuckingassholes:[/quote']

beat me to it. HSA's will be the first thing to go from private companies

Thanks, I'll be here all week. Try the veal, it's delicious

I believe I'm covered, I dump 5% of my income into a HSA every paycheck... in a couple years there should be enough in there to pay for my lasik...woot!

Get ready to start dumping more. WOOT!

“This will make it much more difficult for high deductible plans to meet the minimum actuarial value standard of 60 percent,” says Ramthun. “If they can’t, these plans will either not be available, or these plans will have to raise their values by covering additional benefit expenses. This in turns means the premiums will have to be increased to cover the additional expenses, meaning HSA plans will not be as affordable as they are today.”

They tested for the synthetic drugs (bath salts) they know of. The quote in my previous post was taken straight from your link.

I always wear a seatbelt in the truck and a helmet on the bike. Honestly, I have been known to wear the helmet in the truck, but that's another story.

I still don't want the government telling me I MUST wear them. You don't want to wear something that will save your life.. so be it, let Darwin sort them out.

They actually just don't know

"There are many of these synthetic drugs that we currently don't have the methodology to test on, and that is not the fault of the toxicology lab. The challenge today for the toxicology lab is to stay on top of these new chemicals and develop methodologies for them, but it's very difficult and very expensive." Goldberger said. "There is no one test or combination of tests that can detect every possible substance out there."

I understand, I just wanted to clarify where I was going with the "history lesson" comment.

actually if you make below the poverty line, you CAN get government (cash) assistance and use it to pay for your automobile insurance...

You can get SOME assistance. Not full.

if you admire the poor for all of the free stuff they get, you can do it, too...

Now you're just being a troll so I won't bother

no, a car is a luxury you don't have to buy (as you keep stating)

you don't have to pay income tax if you stop earning an income...

But I would still have to pay car insurance if I own a car. The government is not going to pick up the tab just because I'm poor.

Not similar at all.

no fucking way should anyone be forced to buy a gun.

My comment about the "snarky history lesson" was directed at this. The second Militia Act of 1792 required all men between certain ages to possess a musket and to report to militia duty periodically. So there is technically a precedent, but also a repeal.

Public police agencies and the National Guard were the solutions to this.

true...kudos to you

you're also not required to earn more than the poverty level... in which case the government provides you with health coverage.

So, if I stop working and earn less than what is considered the "poverty level" will Obama buy me a car too?

(I demand the public has to pay my vehicle insurance too)

Different. You're not required to own a car.

Why does no one else understand this?

You cannot equate the two.

Thought experiment time...

Nice try with a snarky history lesson.

Two words: National Guard.

Also, If I own the required gun, do I get to stop paying taxes to support the police?

no, its more fun watching you run back and forth defending this stupidity like a plate spinner at the circus.

haha!

you can't call something a tax, and expect republicans to vote for it...

Nixon introduced what is now known as "Obamacare" in 1974. It was a turd then and it is a turd now. I wouldn't vote for it no matter what it's called.

Interestingly, I'm not even a Republican.

Me: That looks a lot like a tax.

Obama: No no no. I promise, it is not a tax.

Supreme court: It's a tax.

Obama: Hooray, I win!

Me: I wonder who just lost

My summary of the decision: Chief Justice Roberts wrote, “makes going without insurance just another thing the Government taxes, like buying gasoline or earning income. And if the mandate is in effect just a tax hike on certain taxpayers who do not have health insurance, it may be within Congress’s constitutional power to tax.”

BUT, President Obama said,

http://youtu.be/5_-qh9XDbgE

Forget the face-eating bath salt addicts, there is creepier stuff going on: Nodding Disease

I doubt there is anything necessarily "shady" about it but you have the only problem already singled out: Anyone wanting to pay for 1/2 of a bike using paypal obviously does not have the money for the bike and is about to over-extend themselves. Two months down the road when that payment is looming, who knows what excuses might pop up.

Full disclosure, we have bought a bike (years ago) on ebay using paypal because the seller insisted. Of course we turned around and payed of the credit card immediately and there were no problems with the sale at all. But I could see an issue with someone that has bitten off more than they can chew. .02

The great circle of the Internet. When God (err, kawi) calls a troll home, another one emerges in short order to take their place, ensuring a near-constant supply of lulz and entertainment for the rest of us.

... and then, Simba becomes King. The end

I never cease to be amazed at the lengths to which some people will go to avoid accepting the truth and to villify those trying to enlighten them.

You mean vilify?

Also, apparently you have 'enlightened' mixed up with 'propaganda'.

HAHA, this was one of the first viral comedy skits from Bigdogeatchild.com out of Chicago. Good stuff.

Don't forget Jones Big ASS Truck Rental & Storage dot COM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N0gb9v4LI4o

Oh wow, this thread is still alive? Burn it! Burn it with fire!!!

Seriously though, Casper, can you edit the OP so that all the links go to noh8campaign.com or something? At least then, this thread will have some redeeming value.