sol740

I couldn't disagree with you more, and am actually, offended one would assume a lack of faith would equate to more anxiety. Would you kindly point me in the direction of the research (scientific, non-faithbased) that supports your claim ? I would argue the contary that atheists lead as satisfactory lives, if not more satisfactory than their superstitious counterparts. Before you answer please stop to think about all the hatred, pain, oppression, and war religion is directly responsible for.

Theres so many of these inconsistencies its not worth starting a list, it'll go on forever.

LOL, the sad thing is that wasn't even the worst of it. My mother confided in another church-mother regarding my questions. That person than took it upon herself to spread a rumor around the whole church, that I was, and im not even fucking kidding, worshipping Satan. This didn't affect my choice as an adolescent to leave the church, it just felt like salt in the wound.

^^ eugenics ftw !

Gotta love the blatantly ignorant. Poor kids, hopefully one of them is smart enough to break free of the, no-doubt, severe brain-washing they've received. Unfortunately its likely that will not the case.

So an all powerful god that can rain down fire and sulfur, split the red sea, raise the dead and a whole other host of rediculous, magical claims ... couldn't figure out a way to explain dinosaurs in a way later generations would comprehend. The more likely answer is that the dinosaurs were long, long, long dead and buried before the first inkling of an idea ot the Jewish God existed.

David Wong = Genius. The MonkeySpere changed my life.

No I cannot explain dinosaurs beyond what knowledge we have within the fossil record. Paleontology is also not my area of expertise by any means, however it is fair to say that the idea of "New World" creationism should pretty much be a closed book. The world is older than 6000 years. The bible actually does mention man walking with large beasts(I believe in Ezekial), that you could sort of confuse with dinosaurs if you tried. However the Bible talks about a whole lot of mythical creatures such as dragons, and three headed monsters and all kinds of other nonsense, so I take it with a grain of salt. (check David, and of course Revelations) Taking the nature of the Biblical God into question though, would sort of disqualify him from the argument all together. Seeing as how he would of had to have created these creatures just like he did everything else. So why not more mentions ? We get to hear about Lions and Lambs, and goats, and all other sort of animal. Wouldn't these massive beasts get more mention. Also wouldn't the other cultures that existed at the same time, have mentioned these giant beasts in detail in their own historical scripts (the bible isn't the only only ancient text we have).

I will do your homework, however you must read "The God Delusion" by Richard Dawkins. In it is discussed the origins of christianity and the bible as a whole, and how you can only trace those origins back so far before the leads fall apart. I have yet to find anyone who can make an argument to dispute this, while showing non-speculative "evidence" for their points. Do you have a copy ? We can trade. EDIT: ... Uh-Oh ... not looking too good ... I'll still read it, but sounds like more of the same standard Christian "pat on the back" reading ... http://www.bidstrup.com/apologetics.htm

My alarm to notify me of the break-in. My guns to notify them of their mistake.

I would agree if the stated being was not toted as being omnipotent, and infallible. Otherwise we'd be getting into the before stated string theory, and extra-dimensional clusterfuck that would be multiple versions of god, or a single god ruling all possible dimensions. This would not be an issue if the bible itself made any reference to such things, which it of course, does not. As has most of the entire bible.

Therein lies one of the most frustrating issues regarding christians, particularly the ones that biblethump the hardest. Its all in the interpretation. Do you believe in the godhead trinity ? Or is that polytheistic ? In my opinion it definitely qualifies as polytheistic, but proponents will argue up and down that the godhead is a single god, just three separate parts (which makes absolutely no sense at all). What is he ? Voltron ? Also many denominations will argue what parts of the bible are literal, and what is metaphorical. Some, all, or a little. Than you can move into whether or not the Old Testament was cancelled out by the New Testament. Plus a host of countless other arguments that are open to human interpretation, therefore they are and will always be flawed. Which leads to the single biggest, and most ignored problem with religious texts. They were written by men. People defend the bible by saying "god inspired the writings", which is simply stupid, seeing as how the bible is a thousand or so page collection of how mankind constantly fucks up.

The towel trick ?

I agree religion is a powerful form of control, but that's not nessesarily how it began. Its been argued back and forth how it all started, and why. (some say it was an evolutionary misfire) I think its a byproduct of being self-aware. We know that we are going to die, and nothing can prevent this. However if there was a way to "live on", after this life, that would naturally be attractive to most anyone. So someone made something up and passed it along, pacifying the herd and providing reward, or punishment for specific acts. Gods played the role of protector, punisher, and even life itself, or all of the above. Now seeing the power of religion, those who would look to better their own selfish positions would use religion as tool. Theres that old saying, '... the foolish believe in religion , the wise question religion, and the powerful use religion ...'. Pretty much spot on in my opinion.

That also baffled me. When I was fifteen, I asked my pastor a similar question. He basically told me the devil was making me think these things. I was disrought for weeks. I talked to my family, specifically to my brothers (both now pastors), and they answered what they could. I was afraid the devil was using me. I did what my pastor told me to do, pray, and ask god for help restoring my faith. I prayed, and pleaded for answers, or direction. Later my pastor told me the answer to my prayers was simple. Stop asking questions. The little voice asking these questions was the devil (or one of his workers). I renounced my faith the very next day.

I've tried of bevy high-promise, low-deliver "simulators" in my past. I've always been left burned and unsatisfied. Srsly though, do want.

lol

I also believe that, I just don't believe in a god. I appreciate your view, I agree that that's what faith is for. I just disagree with the idea of "faith" being a good thing. Radical muslims have faith that killing infidels (us) will get them into heaven. Radical christians have "faith" that blowing up an abortion clinic is ok because gods "working through them". These examples are obviously the extreme cases, but it is a natural by-product of having beliefs that cannot substaniated by anything but faith. Faith is also almost entirely based on what part of the world you happened to be born in.

^ That's exactly right. (if you believe in an omnipotent god)

Yum.

oh ... and snoball ... (trails off)

I hate having to explain this, because I feel like I do it every month.(thanks thorne) OK, lets start. You have a choice between two things. We'll make this extra tasty (by which I mean oversimplified) and say a "wrong" and a "right". Now lets toss in a magical force that already knows what you're going to choose regardless of the circumstances contained therein said "choice". This being knows that little johnny is a bad, bad, boy, so he is going to choose the "wrong" thing. Everyone still with me ? Good. Now lets complicate the matter by adding in the fact that not only does this "force" control our little johnny, but every other lifeform from human to amoeba. Not only does his choice dictate the flow of space and time for johnny, but for potentially everything on the planet. Ripple effect. Getting pretty hairy now huh ? Well that's not it. Not only do johnny's choices have such monumental affect on the planet, but so do everyone elses. So now we are getting into extra-dimensional theory. Which is fine and all considering this being is all powerful. That definitely sounds within the realm of "all powerful", but we forget that before christians had to make up answers for science, the bible was interpreted as pretty much literal fact(contradictions and all). In the bible (as we discussed) it talks of god being in the future. Now. Right now as in now ... now. So if he is there waiting for us, being with us, already was with us (whatever), than he already knows what you're going to do regardless of the choice. So if he already knows ... than ... YOU DON'T HAVE A CHOICE. Because its already done.

^ nowhere in the bible does "string theory" come up. That's revisionist christianity for ya though, No, if "god" already knows what you're going to do than "that's that". In the bible it does talk of god being in the past, present, and future though, hinting further at him already knowing what you're going to do.

Its a simple matter of probability. "Miracles" happen not because some of us are gods special little guys, but because mathematically, they had to happen to someone. Of course there are probabilities so low we can almost call them "impossible", such as a magical space unicorn that orbits Saturn and rides the rings, while dictating the course and events of all of humanity. Probability low, but that's basically the idea of most religious deities, so I should start a cult. Also "free will" can't exist if some omnipotent being already knows what you're going to do, if you could defy his will he wouldn't be omnipotent would he ? Thus if you cannot deviate from "his" design, than you have no "choice". I forsee this thread going nowhere.

WTF ?!?! I have to say this actually saddens me a little. They'll be back ... right ?