Ducati 899

[thedak]

[TwiztedRabbit]

this is Entertaining.. please go on..

Edited August 22, 2013 by TwiztedRabbit

[zx3vfr]

First of all, if you ride the 848 EVO, you'd notice a fairly significant thing that is opposite to what you're saying about a dry clutch. Also as seen on every model we produce now.

As for similar HP, again not sure you're on the same planet. 80 vs 60 is a big difference and considering parallel vs v-twin you will have more torque in the Duc.

I'd be really careful acting like you know the Ducati line and have experience in riding them. It's awesome you have a 650r, but don't slam something you don't know much about.

650, is 72-74. 650r is 60

I never claimed to know the line. Ive ridden 4, for a limited distance ya they're neat bikes but ill take a jap bike over a Ducati any day.

Edited August 22, 2013 by zx3vfr

[zx3vfr]

Are you mildly retarded?

Im really really hope you took that post seriously

[OSUYZFR1]

I'll give my two cents on my experience with the Pani. I love the looks of the thing and it does have nice power. Been riding one as a street bike for the last month or so. I don't really like it as a 'street' bike. I'm sure it would be awesome on the track but here are my gripes. The seat is a brick, the exhaust roasts you not just sitting in traffic but even at highway speeds, my foot has slipped off the pegs multiple times, stock it's obnoxiously loud. I haven't been able to get the stock suspension setup to where I have any confidence in it, maybe I'm just used to my pig of an R1 but its way more stable leaned over. Maybe replacing the steering damper would solve that as I've gotten wobbles while leaned over which is definitely not confidence inspiring.

[Moto-Brian]

650, is 72-74. 650r is 60

I never claimed to know the line. Ive ridden 4, for a limited distance ya they're neat bikes but ill take a jap bike over a Ducati any day.

 

 

OK...  I was going to be nice...  BUT...

 

The 696 isn't a 650.  Second, it is 80 hp vs 60 on the 650r.  That's a big difference and the torque is lower on the 650 also.  Even if we use your "74" hp figure as each bike can be different and I am sure you'll follow up with dyno figures.  But in case I am surprised that you don't (I won't be...), 14 hp is a big jump...

 

Now, on to the fact that you've ridden 4 and didn't pick up on my comments, if you in fact rode an 848 EVO, the thing you apparently didn't pick up on was the fact that it doesn't have a dry clutch.  So, with the fact that you say they all had them and related that to your "experience", I'd say you're a young kid with a strong opinion and trying to make yourself look cool that you rode some bikes you read about in a magazine.  Pretty cool...

 

Again, let the adults control the conversation and I think you'll be OK...

 

Poppa - I agree.  It would be cool to have some of the old school bikes back.  But, just like the Sport Classic that failed terribly at retail in say, 2007, the bike is now selling at original retail some 6 years later USED.  But, if we build those again, they won't sell.  People want them, but not enough to justify sales.  It unfortunately is a demand issue relating to sales and growth.  Ducati needs to grow yet maintain their soul and supply what customers want.

[Moto-Brian]

I'll give my two cents on my experience with the Pani. I love the looks of the thing and it does have nice power. Been riding one as a street bike for the last month or so. I don't really like it as a 'street' bike. I'm sure it would be awesome on the track but here are my gripes. The seat is a brick, the exhaust roasts you not just sitting in traffic but even at highway speeds, my foot has slipped off the pegs multiple times, stock it's obnoxiously loud. I haven't been able to get the stock suspension setup to where I have any confidence in it, maybe I'm just used to my pig of an R1 but its way more stable leaned over. Maybe replacing the steering damper would solve that as I've gotten wobbles while leaned over which is definitely not confidence inspiring.

 

I didn't know you had one!  Get with me on some chassis numbers and what model you have.  The bike has amazing feedback.  Is agile to the point that it almost oversteers.  Not a single wobble from mine at speed and I think you can attest that I can get mine up to speed pretty good.

 

We found some really solid chassis changes this past Monday.  They are brilliant and even Carr was impressed as he hadn't tried them yet.  

 

I've not yet experienced a real issue on heat on street rides.  But, all Ducs are pretty hot so, it may be that I am used to it.  My Diavel roasts me a bit also...  I dunno.  

 

The footpegs is a new one and I can see where you are coming from.  They are not the best stock pegs out there...

[OSUYZFR1]

I didn't know you had one!  Get with me on some chassis numbers and what model you have.  The bike has amazing feedback.  Is agile to the point that it almost oversteers.  Not a single wobble from mine at speed and I think you can attest that I can get mine up to speed pretty good.

 

We found some really solid chassis changes this past Monday.  They are brilliant and even Carr was impressed as he hadn't tried them yet.  

 

I've not yet experienced a real issue on heat on street rides.  But, all Ducs are pretty hot so, it may be that I am used to it.  My Diavel roasts me a bit also...  I dunno.  

 

The footpegs is a new one and I can see where you are coming from.  They are not the best stock pegs out there...

Well it's not mine but I have it for the next couple years. I'm storing it for a buddy. Its a standard. The peg thing happens when I try to get setup for a corner as I slide off and lean forward my foot slips off. I'm like wtf. Yeah I was going to ask you about suspension. It seems too harsh at defaults for the street. I tried softening it up and now it wallows around. I'm sure it just needs dialed in. I think the steering damper needs changed also.

[Tpoppa]

 

The 696 isn't a 650.  Second, it is 80 hp vs 60 on the 650r.  That's a big difference and the torque is lower on the 650 also.  Even if we use your "74" hp figure as each bike can be different and I am sure you'll follow up with dyno figures.  But in case I am surprised that you don't (I won't be...), 14 hp is a big jump...

 

[Revelstoker]

Yawn. I was sadly hoping for more or well, actually less. No need to sell the KTM for a baby Pani. Now a 690r or 1190ADV just got moved up on the want list.

 

All attention now focused on Honda in anticipation the new V4 Aprilla killer will be released this year.

[Tpoppa]

As for similar HP, again not sure you're on the same planet. 80 vs 60 is a big difference and considering parallel vs v-twin you will have more torque in the Duc.

 

 

How do you define similar?

 

[turnone]

Pegs do suck on the pani. I swapped them at the dealer recently for $100. Now much better. Sure it sucks that the stock ones are so slippery. Also the seat does suck. But my issue was the slickness. I swapped to the comfort seat and it is much better. Only a couple hundred bucks. Should have had a better seat stock but for upgrade, not to shabby. Sure the bike is loud. I like it and saves me from buying $3K exhaust mostly for sound as 5-7 HP probably not gonna make a lot of difference. Mine is hot as hell. They do have a kit they will install for free. I have the kit but choose not to install. Probably will put on the exhaust cover but not the cylinder cover as it hides the sweet look magnesium heads. My bike literally burnt my leg through leathers on the 2 hour ride home from the dealer last year. The trick is to keep your leg out as soon as you start your ride. Don't let the heat saturate your gear. Suspension is on the firm side but super stable at lean and I love it.

Comes with a 2 year warranty standard. Mine had a starter failure just a few weeks after purchase. Many had this from what I understand. Mine also, like many others had wiring harness issue causing the right turn signal to fail when hot. Did I mention it gets hot? But fixed under warranty. My dealer has gone above and beyond. Usually dealing with issues as soon as I arrive there. They do extras for no charge, like rear brake fluid change once for me. Another was swapping clutch fluid due to clutch not working great. Parts installed free. Always cleaning the bike when serviced. Try to find that at the local Honda dealer. They always charged me for install and rarely was the bike cleaned. Ducati isn't perfect but they seem to care more, or make me feel like they do. I have a base model with abs. Best brakes I have ever ridden by far. Traction control is seamless and works perfectly. Overall it is overkill for the street. I have more fun on my RS125 two stroke for the twisties. And the scooter for around town.

Oh, and I love it. Can't wait to track it.

First Ducati purchase and don't regret it.

Edited August 22, 2013 by turnone

[Moto-Brian]

Tpoppa.  I can Google and find a dyno sheet showing 70 plus at the rear wheel on the M696.  I can also find a dyno sheet showing 61 on the 650r.  

 

Also, look at the graphs on the same dyno they are using (hopefully the same day).  The torque curve starts a lot earlier on the V twin.  The HP is also stronger sooner and lower in the revs.

 

Nobody rides at below 5k.  Well, hopefully they don't...

 

My numbers were based on info I gathered from looking online on the 650R and I know what we have in the M696...  The V vs. the parallel is no question going to pull harder sooner.  I know your graphs are saying there is minimal difference, but in looking where they hit, you'd be better off on the M696.  

 

You have made a great point, though that they are very close.  Closer than I knew.  But, like I said, the numbers you can find on Google align a little better.  You can make anything align with the argument you wish to push.

 

My bottom line is that the kid isn't really educated on Ducati and yet has a very negative opinion.  It's very much a bummer.  The whole not knowing the 848 EVO having a wet clutch was the dead giveaway...

 

But, great posts on the graphs.  I stand corrected.

[Tpoppa]

Tpoppa.  I can Google and find a dyno sheet showing 70 plus at the rear wheel on the M696.  I can also find a dyno sheet showing 61 on the 650r.  

 

 

So can I.  I thought same dyno on the same day was much more reliable information for the sake of comparing the 2.

 

I have a similar displacement v-twin.  At those power levels, I find the linear power delivery more useful than the dyno numbers...

Edited August 22, 2013 by Tpoppa

[bambam]

Nobody rides at below 5k.  Well, hopefully they don't...

 

 

 

:-(

 

No choice... I've been riding a fair bit with a BMW group lately.

Edited August 22, 2013 by bambam

[2talltim]

Who's the new guy↑↑↑↑..lol.. how you been Bill

sent via GS3

[bambam]

He he ... Hi Tim, I cannot stay away from this board even though I've relocated to Washington state. The drama here is irresistible - even a seemingly harmless subject like this.

Pauly has my old supersport now, so Isabella continues to scare the Amish at every opportunity, consequently I still feel a tangible connection with you yokels.

As for the new Ducati, I'd take one if you're offering, but I ain't giving up my Multistrada.

[zx3vfr]

OK...  I was going to be nice...  BUT...

 

The 696 isn't a 650.  Second, it is 80 hp vs 60 on the 650r.  That's a big difference and the torque is lower on the 650 also.  Even if we use your "74" hp figure as each bike can be different and I am sure you'll follow up with dyno figures.  But in case I am surprised that you don't (I won't be...), 14 hp is a big jump...

 

Now, on to the fact that you've ridden 4 and didn't pick up on my comments, if you in fact rode an 848 EVO, the thing you apparently didn't pick up on was the fact that it doesn't have a dry clutch.  So, with the fact that you say they all had them and related that to your "experience", I'd say you're a young kid with a strong opinion and trying to make yourself look cool that you rode some bikes you read about in a magazine.  Pretty cool...

 

Again, let the adults control the conversation and I think you'll be OK...

 

Poppa - I agree.  It would be cool to have some of the old school bikes back.  But, just like the Sport Classic that failed terribly at retail in say, 2007, the bike is now selling at original retail some 6 years later USED.  But, if we build those again, they won't sell.  People want them, but not enough to justify sales.  It unfortunately is a demand issue relating to sales and growth.  Ducati needs to grow yet maintain their soul and supply what customers want.

650 =! 650r

[Hoblick]

I find it so funny how Brian is o so in love with Ducati now that he works for them.  if we all could remember back when he worked for KTM he spouted all out about how KTM was the pinnacle of motorcycles and everything they produced was top notch best out blah blah blah.

 

so its funny hearing him tell people stuff when his opinion is obviously biased.

 

id say how much i love whatever brand i work for especially when i get alot of free and discounted shit!

[zx3vfr]

Tpoppa.  I can Google and find a dyno sheet showing 70 plus at the rear wheel on the M696.  I can also find a dyno sheet showing 61 on the 650r.  

 

Also, look at the graphs on the same dyno they are using (hopefully the same day).  The torque curve starts a lot earlier on the V twin.  The HP is also stronger sooner and lower in the revs.

 

Nobody rides at below 5k.  Well, hopefully they don't...

 

My numbers were based on info I gathered from looking online on the 650R and I know what we have in the M696...  The V vs. the parallel is no question going to pull harder sooner.  I know your graphs are saying there is minimal difference, but in looking where they hit, you'd be better off on the M696.  

 

You have made a great point, though that they are very close.  Closer than I knew.  But, like I said, the numbers you can find on Google align a little better.  You can make anything align with the argument you wish to push.

 

My bottom line is that the kid isn't really educated on Ducati and yet has a very negative opinion.  It's very much a bummer.  The whole not knowing the 848 EVO having a wet clutch was the dead giveaway...

 

But, great posts on the graphs.  I stand corrected.

oh boy, now you are really butt hurt that a reliable source doesnt back up your bullshit

[Moto-Brian]

I find it so funny how Brian is o so in love with Ducati now that he works for them.  if we all could remember back when he worked for KTM he spouted all out about how KTM was the pinnacle of motorcycles and everything they produced was top notch best out blah blah blah.

 

so its funny hearing him tell people stuff when his opinion is obviously biased.

 

id say how much i love whatever brand i work for especially when i get alot of free and discounted shit!

 

 

Where did I say the KTM was better than the Ducati?  The RC8R was about equal footing to the 1098/1198 which it was.  The RC8R handles better than the 1098/1198 in my opinion.  I am saying or have stated that the Multi was probably the best bike I've ridden and is based on an overall.  I've also only stated my opinion on the 1199 and only stated truth like I feel it is better than the RC8R.  The power is more, it handles minimally as well if not slightly better than the RC8R.  As for MX/Off Road - I will stand on the thoughts that they are at the pinnacle right now.  The sales prove it and the quality and performance of their off road machines indicate that my opinion then and now is warranted and could be seen as accurate.

 

Sorry I get to ride so many different bikes and can actually form an opinion.  You've got to ride how many RC8Rs?  How many 1199s?  How many 1098/1198s?  And I am not talking to the end of the street.  I'm talking proper riding on the street or in my case, both street and track.  

 

My position is that I got an opportunity to leave KTM for Ducati.  I chose to for several reasons, but the top reason was that I felt Ducati is the pinnacle of street bikes in the sporting category.  I've been a Ducati fan sine I garduated from high school.  Posters on the wall of the 888, 851, etc.  Doug Polen wheelie with thumb up blown up on my wall and framed.  I'm not a band wagon fan, dude.  I've been a fan from about 1987...  Not just since October when I came on board.

 

I'll let the kid that cannot even tell the difference between the dry clutch and wet clutch on an 848 EVO dictate opinion on here.  Not sure where I've been biased and stated anything that isn't proper.  Have you ridden an M696 and a 650r?  The Monster pulls at lower RPMs.  I stated that Tpoppa had proper info and that I stood corrected.  People fucking missed that apparently...  What I can tell you is that if you rode the M696 and the 650r, you'd probably prefer the M696.

[Moto-Brian]

oh boy, now you are really butt hurt that a reliable source doesnt back up your bullshit

 

 

This from the guy that cannot tell the difference in wet and dry clutches...  Again, if you understand the graph, the torque comes on sooner with the V.  The power also.  The feel from that is that the Monster is stronger.  Which it is even on the graph.  But, the difference in TOTAL PEAK NUMBERS isn't going to be felt.  You won't feel 2 hp or 2 ft/tq.  But, you will feel the difference when they hit and come on.  Like the 1199 vs. a GSXR1000, BMW 1000RR, etc.  The 1199 has it's torque come early and HP starts sooner.  However, they gain legs in the 8-9k range and start pulling away.  Meaning, you can feel the difference in the areas where the bike is stronger and not so much.  I also had the numbers on the M696 and had a vague knowledge off the top of my head on the 650r.  I was not close on the difference, but was in terms of when it hit and seat of the pants feel.  If that makes sense.

 

Just get some seat time, man.  Maybe then you won't be so angry towards the brand and be so slanderous to the owners of the brand.  That's all I am getting at.  Seat time and opinion go hand in hand.  Ducatis are not going to win everyone over, but I have found in the short time with the company and time with KTM that people tend to get an opinion based on the fact they either cannot afford the brand or have an opinion based on OLD scenarios read on the internet or from people they know.  Today is different than in 1989 for example. 

 

I'm done.  Everyone can argue on the bike posted in the start of the thread.  I will sit back and watch what is said and enjoy it.  You all are on your own unless it gets personal...  Then I'll bite.

[Moto-Brian]

So can I.  I thought same dyno on the same day was much more reliable information for the sake of comparing the 2.

 

I have a similar displacement v-twin.  At those power levels, I find the linear power delivery more useful than the dyno numbers...

 

 

You are correct.  The same dyno and same time is preferred and why I commented on being corrected and inaccurate in my comments.  The M696 does have 80 hp.  It's whether the dyno numbers are accurate or not.  Each will be different.  But it would register the same difference in the 650r.  I agree that dyno numbers tend to be useless until one rides a bike.  Again, good job getting that info.

[jbot]

I'll save everyone a lot of time. you're all fucking welcome.

best street tire: q3

best race DOT: Pirelli supercorsa SC2

best oil: Rotella T6

best gun manufacturer: FN Herstal

best lube: spit

best scooter: zuma 125

best all-around bike: FZ1

best gang bang: sasha grey

best middleweight race bike evar: triumph 675R

best leathers: dainese

[madcat6183]

I'll save everyone a lot of time. you're all fucking welcome.

best street tire: q3

best race DOT: Pirelli supercorsa SC2

best oil: Rotella T6

best gun manufacturer: FN Herstal

best lube: spit

best scooter: zuma 125

best all-around bike: FZ1

best gang bang: sasha grey

best middleweight race bike evar: triumph 675R

best leathers: dainese

What about best Asian Bukakhe scene?  I mean that's all anyone cares about.  Well that and the best gay MotoSeries butt sex episode, I am thinking it was last year after Cox got asspacked and we all ended up at the bar, then drank more after that at the track?  That was a doozy.