CVT transmissions?

[max power]

Looking at some Subarus for the wife and I see that the auto option is CVT on the new models.

What year did that start?

Anything good or bad to say by those living with CVT?

[Gixxus Christ!]

We have a 2015 legacy and an 07 nissan sentra, both with cvt. They take a little getting used to because they don't really shift, but they allow you to get great mileage especially if you can keep your foot out of it.

The legacy also has a 'manual' mode if you slide the stick to the left from drive. It allows you to shift using paddles on the steering wheel and it does approximate an auto-stick. It's also very useful for steep hill descent as I found out this morning heading into work.

The technology is pretty well established, cvt (or reeves drive) has been used on industrial equipment, snow mobiles, quads and scooters for decades. The main failure point is the belt, and in the case of the subie I'm pretty sure they use the same cvt for the flat 6 as they do for the 4, so the 4 cyl will have a hell of a time breaking the belt designed to handle the aditional power the 6 makes. They can be a bit more noisy than a stick or auto but the one in the legacy isn't bad at all...the nissan whizzes a lot tho.

Hope this helped, if you're local to akron - canton you're welcome to take mine for a spin.

[gsxkat1100]

My personal opinion is:

Manual > CVT > Automatic

 Completely agree.

 

 

Now to find my next truck.......

[3.504]

Subaru started a full cvt lineup in 13ish. They're more recent.

Nissan went cvt damn near 10 years ago.

Honda is on their way.

CVT technology has come a long way. They're actually great transmissions as long as you don't load them too heavily. The Nissan v6's had to be de-tuned due to a high torque output was smoking the transmissions. They resolved that issue some years back and have had much success since. So successful that other brands (see dodge) throw the Nissan unit in their cars.

Don't be afraid of the CVT unless you plan on towning. Even if the car has a tow rating (like most subaru's have a 2000lbs rating) I wouldn't test it.

The other weird part about the CVT's is servicing them. The fluid can be outrageous. Like $75/qt. some brands call for "lifetime" fluid, but I simply don't believe in that. Remember, car manufacturers only have to design parts to last as long as the warrenty. After that...

[max power]

Thanks guys. I want a manual, but the wife is quite resistant.

I hate cvt quads for the belt, maintenance and power drain the cvt setup causes.

Would never own an ATV with that setup so I was curious what you guys with living with that trans in a car tought about it. Not real sure I want one, but a lot of the subbies seem to have it.

[Gixxus Christ!]

I wish my legacy had the 6...the 4 is still damn good tho, 175 hp 175 tq. Dat turbo 6 doe....

[Gump]

They're solid, Shawn. Far more dependable than the regular automatics. Service costs are a bit more, but not incredibly outrageous.

Lyns' next Subaru will be CVT, since I can't talk her into a manual. The compromise is we will get the flat-six.

You sure u can get a 6 with the CVT?

[Gixxus Christ!]

Ah...you are correct sir. Seems subaru doesn't offer anything but the cvt in the newer legacies....and you gotta pay a shit ton to get the 6 cyl...

[shadyone]

The only bad part that ive heard of the CVT is that if it goes out that you basically replace the transmission as opposed to rebuilding it and they are quite pricey. Hence why you dont want to pull weight with them.. 

[jporter12]

I'm glad to hear that at least Subaru has them working well.  I've not seen very many manufacturers doing well with them.

[Gixxus Christ!]

Nissan has cars out there with 150k+ miles still running fine. My sentra has 102k and it gets me around just fine.. only issue I've noticed is if you happen to be braking at the same time it drops out of overdrive you can feel a little hitch.

[zx3vfr]

They didn't have many issues on the Fords I worked with. The manufactures sure are secretive as fuck with it though.

If you did a fluid change, you put the fluid in a special bottle and sent it back to ford.

If you got authorization to replace the transmission a Ford rep would show up watch you take it out and lock it in a crate and send the key for the crate back to secret lab headquaters. Now this was 10 years ago, and they sure have come a long way.

[BadTrainDriver]

We have a 2015 legacy and an 07 nissan sentra, both with cvt. They take a little getting used to because they don't really shift, but they allow you to get great mileage especially if you can keep your foot out of it.

The legacy also has a 'manual' mode if you slide the stick to the left from drive. It allows you to shift using paddles on the steering wheel and it does approximate an auto-stick. It's also very useful for steep hill descent as I found out this morning heading into work.

The technology is pretty well established, cvt (or reeves drive) has been used on industrial equipment, snow mobiles, quads and scooters for decades. The main failure point is the belt, and in the case of the subie I'm pretty sure they use the same cvt for the flat 6 as they do for the 4, so the 4 cyl will have a hell of a time breaking the belt designed to handle the aditional power the 6 makes. They can be a bit more noisy than a stick or auto but the one in the legacy isn't bad at all...the nissan whizzes a lot tho.

Hope this helped, if you're local to akron - canton you're welcome to take mine for a spin.

 

Just to clear up a few things:

#1. The "belt" in a Suabru CVT is a very heavy mesh chain. I have never heard of any breaking. Here is a google picture search for reference.

https://www.google.com/search?q=subaru+cvt+belt&client=firefox-a&hs=EBR&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&channel=sb&tbm=isch&imgil=qLAPEXkUo6p8HM%253A%253BHyMJSj4pRKxt7M%253Bhttp%25253A%25252F%25252Fwww.rimrocksubaru.com%25252Fsubaru-lineartronic-continuously-variable-transmission-billings-montana.htm&source=iu&pf=m&fir=qLAPEXkUo6p8HM%253A%252CHyMJSj4pRKxt7M%252C_&usg=__B_TT9_OmhoVYyu_TL-Vlw3fOId0%3D&biw=1920&bih=943&ved=0CFQQyjc&ei=FZFsVIXDGomAygTjmoLQCQ#facrc=_&imgdii=_&imgrc=qLAPEXkUo6p8HM%253A%3BHyMJSj4pRKxt7M%3Bhttps%253A%252F%252Fs3.amazonaws.com%252F3gengagement.dealers%252Frimrock-subaru%252Fcustom-pages%252Fengineering%252Frimrock_subaru-cvt-header.jpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.rimrocksubaru.com%252Fsubaru-lineartronic-continuously-variable-transmission-billings-montana.htm%3B600%3B300

 

#2. NA four cylinder Subaru uses a Lineartronic CVT. Turbo four cylinder(WRX and Forester), and the 3.6 six cylinder uses a High Torque CVT. The main difference between the two is actually the strength of the chain.

[BadTrainDriver]

Subaru started a full cvt lineup in 13ish. They're more recent.

Nissan went cvt damn near 10 years ago.

Honda is on their way.

CVT technology has come a long way. They're actually great transmissions as long as you don't load them too heavily. The Nissan v6's had to be de-tuned due to a high torque output was smoking the transmissions. They resolved that issue some years back and have had much success since. So successful that other brands (see dodge) throw the Nissan unit in their cars.

Don't be afraid of the CVT unless you plan on towning. Even if the car has a tow rating (like most subaru's have a 2000lbs rating) I wouldn't test it.

The other weird part about the CVT's is servicing them. The fluid can be outrageous. Like $75/qt. some brands call for "lifetime" fluid, but I simply don't believe in that. Remember, car manufacturers only have to design parts to last as long as the warrenty. After that...

 

Subaru CVT C-30 is $12 per quart.

[Gixxus Christ!]

Just to clear up a few things:

#1. The "belt" in a Suabru CVT is a very heavy mesh chain. I have never heard of any breaking. Here is a google picture search for reference.

https://www.google.com/search?q=subaru+cvt+belt&client=firefox-a&hs=EBR&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&channel=sb&tbm=isch&imgil=qLAPEXkUo6p8HM%253A%253BHyMJSj4pRKxt7M%253Bhttp%25253A%25252F%25252Fwww.rimrocksubaru.com%25252Fsubaru-lineartronic-continuously-variable-transmission-billings-montana.htm&source=iu&pf=m&fir=qLAPEXkUo6p8HM%253A%252CHyMJSj4pRKxt7M%252C_&usg=__B_TT9_OmhoVYyu_TL-Vlw3fOId0%3D&biw=1920&bih=943&ved=0CFQQyjc&ei=FZFsVIXDGomAygTjmoLQCQ#facrc=_&imgdii=_&imgrc=qLAPEXkUo6p8HM%253A%3BHyMJSj4pRKxt7M%3Bhttps%253A%252F%252Fs3.amazonaws.com%252F3gengagement.dealers%252Frimrock-subaru%252Fcustom-pages%252Fengineering%252Frimrock_subaru-cvt-header.jpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.rimrocksubaru.com%252Fsubaru-lineartronic-continuously-variable-transmission-billings-montana.htm%3B600%3B300

#2. NA four cylinder Subaru uses a Lineartronic CVT. Turbo four cylinder(WRX and Forester), and the 3.6 six cylinder uses a High Torque CVT. The main difference between the two is actually the strength of the chain.

#1 The belt failures I've read about are from boosting and tuning the 2.5 sentra with cvt...I haven't heard of any subie belt ffailures.

#2 huh... didn't catch that.

[BadTrainDriver]

Speaking of the six cylinder(specifically the Legacy), two ways that I'm not a fan of the CVT is it really doesn't allow the full engine power to be put to the wheels from a dead stop, and the front biased AWD system.

 

I own a 2013 3.6R, and while not a "fast" car by definition...it does get up and go pretty quick. 0-60 times in the low six seconds, tested on multiple occasions.

The new 3.6 with a CVT is a full second slower(tested by magazines), and I can confirm from my own test drives...it doesn't have nearly the "jump" off the line.

 

Also, I'm not a fan of the front biased AWD system that the CVT uses. Again, going back to my 2013 3.6R with the 5EAT, my system is a 45:55 VTD(Variable Torque Distribution). On curvy roads, pushing the car, it really shines. There is no typical FWD "plow". The Subaru CVT is a 60:40 split of the same system. While I've not personally had the opportunity to drive one spirited through curves, I have read reports where it doesn't feel as "sporty".

 

 
 

[Gixxus Christ!]

Well you're also not going to get the full power to the wheels with a conventional automatic, torque is lost in the converter, pump, clutches etc.. maybe the cvt has more initial inertia to overcome with the big pullies...or maybe they tuned the cvt more for economy for EPA reasons...or maybe the motor was detuned...too bad they didn't release one with a standard to check against an older model with a standard to rule out motor tuning/emissions garbage.

[jporter12]

They didn't have many issues on the Fords I worked with. The manufactures sure are secretive as fuck with it though.

If you did a fluid change, you put the fluid in a special bottle and sent it back to ford.

If you got authorization to replace the transmission a Ford rep would show up watch you take it out and lock it in a crate and send the key for the crate back to secret lab headquaters. Now this was 10 years ago, and they sure have come a long way.

 

Interesting.  I had one apart out of and Edge about 8 years ago (I'm guessing) and had no parts available, other than the valve body/TCM.  Didn't find anything worn and replacing the VB/TCM did no good.  Ended up putting in a new unit from Ford.  This is back when I worked at in independent shop.

[zx3vfr]

I haven

Interesting.  I had one apart out of and Edge about 8 years ago (I'm guessing) and had no parts available, other than the valve body/TCM.  Didn't find anything worn and replacing the VB/TCM did no good.  Ended up putting in a new unit from Ford.  This is back when I worked at in independent shop.

I only did a few. I ended up quitting that dealer and going to an independent shop not long after ford started using them. So I didn't see one after that until I started at the bmw dealer in 2009 and I would only see them in the occasional used car when we were slow but didn't work on any.

But I've been out of the field for 4 years now so I don't keep up with it too much.

[BadTrainDriver]

Well you're also not going to get the full power to the wheels with a conventional automatic, torque is lost in the converter, pump, clutches etc.. maybe the cvt has more initial inertia to overcome with the big pullies...or maybe they tuned the cvt more for economy for EPA reasons...or maybe the motor was detuned...too bad they didn't release one with a standard to check against an older model with a standard to rule out motor tuning/emissions garbage.

 

Absolutely true, but in the Subaru world, the 5EAT was as highly regarded as the six speed standard transmission in the STi(not to be confused with the six speed transmission that now comes in the WRX). The 5EAT was the turbo 400 from Japan. It's 500 whp stout, and has almost a zero problem record for many, many years. It was a sad day, and there were many tears of ATF fluid shed when everyone heard it was gone.

[Gump]

Just to clear up a few things:

#1. The "belt" in a Suabru CVT is a very heavy mesh chain. I have never heard of any breaking. Here is a google picture search for reference.

https://www.google.com/search?q=subaru+cvt+belt&client=firefox-a&hs=EBR&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&channel=sb&tbm=isch&imgil=qLAPEXkUo6p8HM%253A%253BHyMJSj4pRKxt7M%253Bhttp%25253A%25252F%25252Fwww.rimrocksubaru.com%25252Fsubaru-lineartronic-continuously-variable-transmission-billings-montana.htm&source=iu&pf=m&fir=qLAPEXkUo6p8HM%253A%252CHyMJSj4pRKxt7M%252C_&usg=__B_TT9_OmhoVYyu_TL-Vlw3fOId0%3D&biw=1920&bih=943&ved=0CFQQyjc&ei=FZFsVIXDGomAygTjmoLQCQ#facrc=_&imgdii=_&imgrc=qLAPEXkUo6p8HM%253A%3BHyMJSj4pRKxt7M%3Bhttps%253A%252F%252Fs3.amazonaws.com%252F3gengagement.dealers%252Frimrock-subaru%252Fcustom-pages%252Fengineering%252Frimrock_subaru-cvt-header.jpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.rimrocksubaru.com%252Fsubaru-lineartronic-continuously-variable-transmission-billings-montana.htm%3B600%3B300

#2. NA four cylinder Subaru uses a Lineartronic CVT. Turbo four cylinder(WRX and Forester), and the 3.6 six cylinder uses a High Torque CVT. The main difference between the two is actually the strength of the chain.

Hooray for facts!

[BadTrainDriver]

Hooray for facts!

 

Seriously, I'm not trying to brag or boast, but there's not much I don't know about a Subaru, model years 1993-present.

I own #8 and #9 now, and I've had almost all varieties except for the Outback and Tribeca.

If you've got a question, fire away.

[Gump]

Seriously, I'm not trying to brag or boast, but there's not much I don't know about a Subaru, model years 1993-present.

I own #8 and #9 now, and I've had almost all varieties except for the Outback and Tribeca.

If you've got a question, fire away.

Why does the traction control suck?

I drove into a large snowdrift getting my mail last night knowing Id have to turn that crap off to get out of the drift. I don't need an answer, I'm just complaining. Can't believe they waist the time and money on that garbage or anti-lock brakes for that matter. Definitely matters what year your born I think.

Edited November 19, 2014 by Gump

[zx3vfr]

Why does the traction control suck?

I drove into a large snowdrift getting my mail last night knowing Id have to turn that crap off to get out of the drift. I don't need an answer, I'm just complaining. Can't believe they waist the time and money on that garbage or anti-lock brakes for that matter. Definitely matters what year your born I think.

Honestly. You are probably using it wrong. Not nit picking or critizing but with traction control and stability control you have to relearn how to drive. When tires are in good shape and systems are functioning correctly you point the steering wheel where you want to go and let the vehicle do the rest. No more steering into the turn. You have to drop that mind set. Point and shoot and don't manipulate the throttle, the vehicle will do that for you

[BadTrainDriver]

Why does the traction control suck?

I drove into a large snowdrift getting my mail last night knowing Id have to turn that crap off to get out of the drift. I don't need an answer, I'm just complaining. Can't believe they waist the time and money on that garbage or anti-lock brakes for that matter. Definitely matters what year your born I think.

 

I'm not sure what specific model Subaru you have, but in "limited traction" situations such as snow and ice, it is actually specified to turn traction control off.

My car, with VDC, has the ability to turn off traction control, while still maintaining the other features, ESC, ABS, etc.

 

Personally, I'm a fan of ABS on all conditions. The early Subaru ABS was very over sensitive, and there is an easy mod to disable it. Today's Subarus are much improved. You may think you're better, but in all actuality, you're not.