Guest Crankshaft Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 <font color ="midnightblue"> Mowgli...where were you three weeks ago man? Could've used the support. smile.gif Seriously though, Ricochet said it best, "It's just as easy to buy". And it is. But, per my expressed views in the last topic, I don't think the government should endorse by legallizing something immoral like pot. I think that's the point that we'll disagree on, but nonetheless... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Harris92 Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 Ok, Im going to chime in here. I think there is some misunderstanding when it comes to marijuana. It does not make you any dumber than alcohol and it effects people differently, just like alcohol does (for example, some people get very belligerant and stupid when they drink, some do not and choose to use it responsibly). Generalizing marijuana smokers does not work, because people are different and it affects people differently. If you dont choose to believe it thats fine, but there are several successful marijuana smokers in our society. Not everyone chooses to go to scream it from the top of a mountain. I currently have two jobs and go to school full time, and everything is working out for me. My girlfriend, school, family and friends all come first, this is just something I do to relax, after a hard day of work or studying. Whats the big deal? Am I hurting someone? I dont rag on people for their life choices. I do drink from time to time, and I dont think there is anything wrong with that, as long as you pay attention to how often you are drinking. I have a lot of alcoholics in my family, and this is my alternative, and it is better than constantly drinking. I know that I dont have the risk of becoming a "potoholic" if I smoke marijuana because it does not have physically addictive side effects to it like alcohol can. Whats the big deal? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Pomade Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 Originally posted by Dr. Z06: *cue Cypress Hill music* I want to get high, sooooo high Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orion Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 I know that I dont have the risk of becoming a "potoholic" if I smoke marijuana because it does not have physically addictive side effects to it like alcohol can.you just lost every shred of credibility you thought you had. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Harris92 Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 In what sense, you feel that it does have physically addictive side effects? Explain Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devils Advocate Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 Disclaimer: Sorry for the typos, this is my longest post ever. It's long, but I'd say that it's worth reading. Mowgli, for saying that you want everyone on this board to do well, you're being a pretty big jackass. I say that with love. You need to stop taking cheap shots at whatever stereotype you've got imbedded in that pot-free brain of yours. I doubt there is a person on here who smokes a bag a day, and I havent seen anyone in this thread state that they know someone who was important as the king of the world (yeah, I got the sarcasm, but it's still a pretty shitty way of getting your point across). What you need to get through your head is that in the end it has nothing to do with marijuana when you talk about anyone being successful or unsuccessful that smokes the stuff. If you have the drive, the intelligence, and the balls to become successful, then you will whether or not you smoke bud or not. Potheads are people that let marijuana totally take over every aspect of their life, such as relationships, work, school, hobbies, etc. I'm sure that there are thousands of people out there who smoke every day that aren't potheads, because they get their shit taken care of every day and don't let smoking affect their lives too much. Now, on that note, you, the "Potheads" that we'e discussing, and myself, probably all have different ideas of what we call "successful". To some, being successful is having a family to love, a solid, reliable job, and enough money to take your family out to eat once a week or every two weeks. To you, being Successful might be making 80k+, driving a very nice car, several motorcycles (One of which, the 750, I should definitely steal/borrow for an extended period of time ) and living in a nice house somewhere with a decent bit of property and a beautiful wife. (I want you to know that I'm making generalized statements here, and not trying to attack you or anything.) What sucks about arguments like these is that everyone opinion differs based on their backgrounds, social experiences, life experiences, etc, So that it's extremely hard to find a common ground. Of course nobody is going to make someone else who has grown up in a totally different environment with a totally different set of moral values understand their position to the point of concession, that's just not human nature. You believe what you believe, and I believe what I believe. As far as not posting job offers on CR anymore, why? Because a few people smoke pot? I think it's very close-minded of you to think that someobody would not be able to do a job correctly/as well as someone else because they occasionally indulge in Marijuana. If I was qualified to answer any of the job offers that you've posted, I would jump at them in a heartbeat and prove to you that just because someone smokes pot doesn't mean that they are any less capable of completing difficult tasks. It's rediculous that Alchoholics get hired all the time for high-paying, highly secure jobs, and that people who occasionally smoke pot are rejected based solely on the fact that our government has almost no way to control the growth and distribution of marijuana, so it's illegal. You can't outlaw one thing while turning a blind eye to another, just because it makes the government a hell of alot of money. I seriously think that you guys should look at some figures dealing with alchohol and tobacco related deaths over the past ten years, and then look at the number of deatsh related to marijuana. You'd be surprised at just how icnredible the difference is. However, I doubt that you'd really believe any of the reports or take them at face value, because you'll probably just make the excuse that "well, if MJ were legalized, then more people would die from it", which is pretty ridiculous, considering more people smoke down here in Athens than drink. Another point that I'd like to bring up is the fact that alchohol makes people Angry, Violent, and Horny, whilst Marijuana makes people relaxed, happy, and hungry. Which would you rather have at a work-related social function; someone who gets too drunk off of the punch, says something innapropriate to a female coworker, and gets in a fight with someone from another department that they dont like, or someone who seems quiet, relaxed, and happy? Something like 70 percent of rapists in Ohio last year were under the influence of alchohol last year, and I would be willing to bet money that less than five percent were under the influence of Marijuana. Achohol has been proven to influence and lead to violent and sexual crimes, while Marijuana certainly hasn't. So, why is Marijuana still illegal, while You can buy 40 oz. of 9% alchohol in nearly every major gas station in the country for under a dollar? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mowgli1647545497 Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 Originally posted by pgsrt-4: To Mowgli I think its pretty apparent that you really don't know much about MJ, as a smoker I know that I can do anything that I can do sober I can do high because I've done it. I acctually prefer to study in my so called "altered state of mind" and have found that I can memorize things much easier and understand things better like that. For example I had to memorize a presentation in spanish for a midterm I had the mext morning, I was studying not high and was having a real hard time remembering what I was supposed to say after about an hour I had three sentences memorized completely, then I went out and lit up a fattie and bam came back in studied and in 30 min I had finished the rest of the sentences and had no doubt in my mind what they were, so thanks to the supposed, makes everyone a lazy bum "drug" I got to bed early and memorized my shit and I also got to work a little on my calculus too. Next morning woke up saying my spanish and I can still say it so I don't understand much about what you are talking about, but I can pretty much say it is inaccurate. I guess in a few years I'll have to get back on here after I get through med school and tell you, you were wrong, until then tongue.gif You're implying - thru this anecdote of you de-stressing and thus being able to study and sleep - that buzzed or no your capacity is equivalent. Thats not true. Anytime you want to get blasted and then see if you can keep up with me riding a bike, driving a car, playing raquetball or some other fast handeye thing, or doing calculus or reciting latin, you're on. (actually we won't do anything dangerous like the fast riding or driving) You won't do half as well as you do while you are sober, so we'll do it twice, once sober and once stoned - and I will record it and show you the next day. What you think you can do buzzed and what you can do buzzed are two different things. Even smart people rationalize. 151 - what I'm saying is that addictions curtail lives and potential. Addictions. I'm not talking about the occasional toke (you're all assuming I've never smoked too- I find that funny). I'm talking about addiction. I find that MJ smokers rationalize their addiction more than even alcoholics. Maybe more than cigarette smokers. Took longer than I thought it would for the "personal definition of success" thing to get raised. I was waiting on that. My defn of success is the defn I hold myself too and nobody else. My defn of reliability and capability is something I hold my self and everyone I work with to. And it shows up real quick when someone can't deliver. For whatever reason. So all the social MJers are molding me into their anti-ganja posterboy to take potshots at (no pun intended), thats fine. I'm not trying to take away your precious substance. Far from it - I'm trying to say- thru colorful writing style: don't fuk up you're own life, but it is yours to fuk up, and I won't stop you and neither should the state. Orion - No thats not it. You're overestimating the requirements for the jobs. I'll just say this - the second to last guy I placed is making 72/hr. The last guy I placed is now making 0. And its relevent to this topic. I didn't fire him. Take it from there. [ 12. May 2005, 01:18 PM: Message edited by: Mowgli ] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devils Advocate Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 Originally posted by Folkvang: <font color ="midnightblue"> Mowgli...where were you three weeks ago man? Could've used the support. smile.gif Seriously though, Ricochet said it best, "It's just as easy to buy". And it is. But, per my expressed views in the last topic, I don't think the government should endorse by legallizing something immoral like pot. I think that's the point that we'll disagree on, but nonetheless...Morality should have absolutely nothing to do with it, since every single person in this great country of ours has different moral values. That's really the whole fucking reason those people with the funny hats and buckles on their shoes made the trip over here in the first place, remember? The last time we tried to ban something for "moral reasons", it required a constitutional amendment some ten or so years later when the government realized that prohibiting things based upon the people in power's moral values was unconstitutional. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devils Advocate Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 Originally posted by Mowgli: Anytime you want to get blasted and then see if you can keep up with me riding a bike, driving a car, playing raquetball or some other fast handeye thing, or doing calculus or reciting latin, you're on. You won't do half as well as you would while you are sober, so we'll do it twice, and I will record it and show you the next day. What you think you can do buzzed and what you can do buzzed are two different things. Even smart people rationalize.No one can argue with this statement, as it's totally true... Unless Mowgli is REALLY uncoordinated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orion Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 graemlins/doh.gif dammit, months ago we had this discussion, and i posted several links to ama articles and fact sheets having to do with the addictive nature of marijuana. i really dont feel like going back and searching for the damn things just because you happened not to care about it back then. back then i was talking to john tilly and kyle rigsby. as much as folksvang wished mowgli was around last week, i was doing fine by myself months ago. if ever there was a discussion older than time roundabouts cr, its this nonsense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orion Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 Originally posted by Harris93: In what sense, you feel that it does have physically addictive side effects? Explain I acctually prefer to study in my so called "altered state of mind" and have found that I can memorize things much easier and understand things better like that. For example I had to memorize a presentation in spanish for a midterm I had the mext morning, I was studying not high and was having a real hard time remembering what I was supposed to say after about an hour I had three sentences memorized completely, then I went out and lit up a fattie and bam came back in studied and in 30 min I had finished the rest of the sentences and had no doubt in my mind what they were, so thanks to the supposed, makes everyone a lazy bum "drug" I got to bed early and memorized my shit and I also got to work a little on my calculus too. Next morning woke up saying my spanish and I can still say it so I don't understand much about what you are talking about, but I can pretty much say it is inaccurate. I guess in a few years I'll have to get back on here after I get through med school and tell you, you were wrong, until thentheres your answer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orion Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 jon, up until today, you were on my "smart kids" list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devils Advocate Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 How am I no longer on that list, not that it really matters to me? I posted an intelligent, eloquent response about my opinion. Sorry if you disagree with me, not much I can do about that. Side note, 72/hr? Sign me up, seriously. I'd quit smoking period for that kind of money. Is it programming, or what? I'm worried that my degree in Plant Biology isn't going to leave me a whole lot of options once I'm through with college (and I certainly don't consider growing and selling marijuana an option, so don't make any god damned jokes about plant biology, I hear it enough already), so I'm kindof looking for other options. You told me once before that I need a certification in C#, but how long does that take/are there any websites that would have basic info for me that you could recommend? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Pomade Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 Just to interject, what Ryan described is technically referred to as state-dependent learning. If your so inclined, consider the following experiment that was conducted using, you guessed it, pot smoking. Some ordinary folks were gathered together, and they were split into two groups. Group A learned a list of words. Group B learned the same list of words, only they got high (i.e., became intoxicated) on cannabis prior to learning the list. Then everybody went home. Everyone was brought back in a few days later. When they came back, they were again divided into two groups. One group of people were asked to recall the list of words they had memorized a few days earlier. The other group were asked to recall that same list, only, beforehand, they were instructed to get high on cannabis. Here are the results, some of which were surprising: - the people who were able to recall the list most accurately were those people who (1) didn't get high the first time when they learned the list and (2) weren't made to get high when they came back and recalled what they learned. In other words, the subjects who fared best were those who were neither high when they learned the list nor high when they recalled the list. - the people who fared the worst were the people who either (1) got high when they learned the list, but didn't get high when they came back to recall the list or (2) didn't get high when they learned the list, but did get high when they came back to recall the list. These people demonstrated the worst memory recall. - the people who fell in the middle, that is, they didn't have the best recall and they didn't have the worst recall, were the people who (1) got high and then learned the list of words and then (2) were the ones who got high when they came back to recall the list. State-dependent learning explains the results. Research demonstrates that our recall for things is maximized when our internal state is similar to the state that existed at the time we learned the particular information. So, if you're going to get high and learn something, then research suggests that you'll recall that information best if you again get high. Of course, research also clearly indicates that you'll remember things best if you don't get high at all, though that fact is often lost in the glamour of the other results. CLIFFS: Ryan is a pothead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 420GSXR1000 Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 to all: thanks for all the input...and sorry for a slight repeat of volk's topic, but it got to me with the attitude, and im new here so i just read it the other day.....shit, the newbie (me)started a topic and its on fire!!!!!! really, just look at the avatar to 151: very very well put. also explains why this topic will never die....and...c+ is easy and if you need sum software for "training" purposes, pm me and we can talk, however i feel its a shitty lang.........assembler is much more compact FOLK: smoker = immorality?????? hmmmmm what religion r u? just curious.... oh....yea....lets get high and ride wheeeeeeelies!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob1647545496 Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 it will never be legalized Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orion Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 How am I no longer on that list, not that it really matters to me? I posted an intelligent, eloquent response about my opinion. Sorry if you disagree with me, not much I can do about that. if it doesnt matter, whyd you ask? if theres nothing you can do about me disagreeing with you, why apologize? the only reason this topic continues to come up is because the damn potheads smoke too much weed, and forget that we just got done talking about this!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berto Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 i'll probably get fucked up for this but i agree with mowgli, not as much as being succesful but i notice in the engineering department there are not many people that smoke pot. some of it might do with the substance it self but i think alot of it has to do with the lifestyle. if you want to smoke you might put up other things. Hell i drink sometimes but i know how to control it. i reallly don't know what i'm trying to say, i'll post later. i've never smoked in my life thats whats funny about my avatar, is i said lets smoke a doobie while totally wasted on alcohol. [ 12. May 2005, 05:15 PM: Message edited by: RX7dood ] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devils Advocate Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 Berto is sekzy... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trouble Maker Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 Originally posted by Mowgli: Even smart people rationalize. 151 - what I'm saying is that addictions curtail lives and potential. Addictions. I'm not talking about the occasional toke (you're all assuming I've never smoked too- I find that funny). I'm talking about addiction.Like you rationalizing why one addictive thing can be legal and another addictive thing not. Laws should be put in place to protect people from other people, not from themselves. If someone wants to become a pothead and waste their lives away, so be it. It should not be illegal. If someone wants get high and go drive a car, operate heavy machinery at work, design a bridge, those all put other innocent people at risk. It should be illegal. There are some drugs that I think everyone can agree are just all around bad for society. Pot is not one of them. Should we outlaw everything that could be addictive? Caffeine, cigarettes, and alcohol all have obviously addictive characteristics and have no positive side effects. Some people simply like indulging in these things from time to time. Some people do abuse these things. They are all gone. I'm taking all of your cars away too since some people can be, and lots of people on here probably are, addicted to their cars/working on them. How about we just kill off everyone that has and addictive personality so that we as a society don't have to deal with people like that. That's what's 'wrong' with society and the 'representative' way our government is ran. Everyone wants to put laws in place governing morals when everyone’s set of morals is different. It just happens to be which ever side is in the majority (or has the bigger voice) gets their way and now their morals are enforced by the law. Sure sounds like a great way to mix 'church and state'. Different sets of morals are what this country was founded on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devils Advocate Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 I posted what Jesse said above, but obviously nobody read it, since it was so long. Thanks for making a pretty solid cliff's notes version, Jess. graemlins/thumb.gif Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devils Advocate Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 Also, Mowgli, how do you define "addiction?" Judging by "society's" definition, as in can't get through a day without it or they become extremely touchy, disoriented, etc, then I doubt I've met more than two or three people addicted to pot in my life... and I go to OU. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trouble Maker Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 Originally posted by 151: I posted what Jesse said above, but obviously nobody read it, since it was so long. Thanks for making a pretty solid cliff's notes version, Jess. graemlins/thumb.gif Haha, I obviously didn't read it either or I wouldn't have basically reposted it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drunkendubber Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 Originally posted by Orion: the only reason this topic continues to come up is because the damn potheads smoke too much weed, and forget that we just got done talking about this!!!!!last time this was brought up, it was done by a nonsmoker im sure you nonsmoking ass can remember that far back tongue.gif If you're addicted to anything its a bad thing. and vang, i thought it was only immoral because it was illegal Mowgli "Anytime you want to get blasted and then see if you can keep up with me riding a bike, driving a car, playing raquetball or some other fast handeye thing, or doing calculus or reciting latin, you're on." I challenge you to ping pong and soccer we can play 2 games, 1 sober then one with me F-ed up. All in the name of science, of course Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mowgli1647545497 Posted May 12, 2005 Report Share Posted May 12, 2005 Originally posted by Trouble Maker: Like you rationalizing why one addictive thing can be legal and another addictive thing not. I'm doing no such thing. I'm not even saying it should be illegal. Originally posted by Trouble Maker: Haha, I obviously didn't read it either or I wouldn't have basically reposted it. Like you obviously didn't read mine. You need to go back and read my posts again there, champ. You missed all the points - so you're projecting your imaginary adversary onto me. Here's my cliff's notes: What I'm saying is I don't care if its legal or not. Its your life, not my life, not the state's life either. It will hork your life up if you become a pothead, but I won't stop you or even really give a shit. And these posts are as far as I'll go to help you avoid it too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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