Kevin R. Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 Does this make no damn sense to anyone else either? http://money.cnn.com/2008/05/08/news/economy/frank_omnibus_housing_bill_vote/index.htm?postversion=2008050818 While 1.4 million loans are likely to be eligible for such a program, the Congressional Budget Office estimates such a measure would end up insuring 500,000 borrowers. The CBO estimates the FHA expansion program would cost taxpayers $1.7 billion. So, to help others from losing their house because they took out mortgages they shouldn't have, MY taxes go up!? Take from the rich (or people who didn't fuck up a mortgage) and give to the needy? Hopefully that shit gets vetoed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wnaplay1647545503 Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 I heard on stern today that bush will veto anything like this if it hits his desk. I dont want to pay for others mistakes either. I dont want to say fuck'em but theres programs already in place to help you correct the problem, not just make it go away. Of course this takes work and well...................... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JuicedH22 Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 the problem is, if we dont help them, we ge fucked just as hard anyways via further declining economy.... its a lose-lose situation we are in because the banks gave money to brokedicks who shouldnt have been given the loan.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caseyctsv Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 For the record I agree with you guys - however, to be devil's advocate: If you own a home already and people in your neighborhood start walking from their homes due to lack of equity, the value of your home decreases as the supply of homes increases. So you are paying for it one way or another. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tractor Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 Very true, but that is a short term problem. I still say let them rot. Evan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wnaplay1647545503 Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 the problem is, if we dont help them, we ge fucked just as hard anyways via further declining economy.... its a lose-lose situation we are in because the banks gave money to brokedicks who shouldnt have been given the loan.... I had a weird feeling when I went to go look at new houses and I was approved for a $800,000 house on a single income. I looked at the guy like he was out of his fucking mind. I knew then that if I was going to be approved for that kind of loan then they were just handing out smaller loans to whomever could make their mark. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin R. Posted May 9, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 For the record I agree with you guys - however, to be devil's advocate: If you own a home already and people in your neighborhood start walking from their homes due to lack of equity, the value of your home decreases as the supply of homes increases. So you are paying for it one way or another. Right. This is coming from someone who doesn't own a home. I am not going to pay for your mistake or lying on your mortgage application that you make enough to purchase a home you blatantly cannot. I do not think the mortgage "crisis" is a leading factor of the failing economy and throwing money at people to fix their problems is not going to solve much but may cover it up for some time. I do see your point; however, as this is effecting people nationwide. Two of the cities that didn't seem to be effected (Charlotte & ?) are now seeing decline in housing market values due to this. I guess I would just go beat my neighbors ass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wnaplay1647545503 Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 Heres something else that pissed me off that kinda follows these lines. I was pissed that taxpayer dollars were spent to put up all these concrete walls around 270 and allowed the peoples whos homes were valued "lower" due to location next to a freeway, to gain equity off the taxpayers. My buddy sold his house for a significant higher price after the wall was up than he could of before. He bought the house based on it having a sucky view of the freeway and the house was priced accordingly. Not that a wall is much better but still. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin R. Posted May 9, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 Heres something else that pissed me off that kinda follows these lines. I was pissed that taxpayer dollars were spent to put up all these concrete walls around 270 and allowed the peoples whos homes were valued "lower" due to location next to a freeway, to gain equity off the taxpayers. My buddy sold his house for a significant higher price after the wall was up than he could of before. He bought the house based on it having a sucky view of the freeway and the house was priced accordingly. Not that a wall is much better but still. Right. So everyone paid their tax money into his pocket basically. :nod: 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wnaplay1647545503 Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 Right. So everyone paid their tax money into his pocket basically. :nod: I like your way of thinking, positive rep points for you. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JuicedH22 Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 I do not think the mortgage "crisis" is a leading factor of the failing economy huh? the housing crisis is a HUGE factor in the failing economy. I would suggest reading up on this, knowing why our economy is so horrible helps you make smarter decisions on a daily basis. as a start, here is one of the first links that popped up on a google search, that gives some good insight http://seekingalpha.com/article/67263-housing-market-tracker-macro-and-global-effects-of-housing-crisis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTQ B4U Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 Personally I don't give a shit. when the market was booming and my house was "worth more" it still didn't get me excited as every home we looked at next was over fucking priced so I didn't net anything. There was no gain to be had. There really is no 'loss of equity" occurring IMO. It was never really there to begin with. It was all short term bookie-math IMO. Lenders are getting what they deserve. I remember laughing when our friends who bought new homes thought they were actually gaining like $20k from phase one to phase two or three just in equity. Not only did they pay tons more in interest thus offsetting any gain they may have thought they had, many are now stuck in that home at a loss because they over-fucking paid. We are only a handful of years from owning our home out-right thus it's equity isn't an issue...I'll be happy to not have a mortgage. We'll stay put if need be. However, the home we were going to build has dropped in price way further and faster than any market loss we're going to supposedly take on the selling price of our home. The builder has dropped over $90k off the price, made our three car garage a side load and added in a a four season room since we came close to inking the deal last spring but decided not to. I just got another letter from the sales office too. For the record I agree with you guys - however, to be devil's advocate: If you own a home already and people in your neighborhood start walking from their homes due to lack of equity, the value of your home decreases as the supply of homes increases. So you are paying for it one way or another. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin R. Posted May 9, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 huh? the housing crisis is a HUGE factor in the failing economy. I would suggest reading up on this, knowing why our economy is so horrible helps you make smarter decisions on a daily basis. as a start, here is one of the first links that popped up on a google search, that gives some good insight http://seekingalpha.com/article/67263-housing-market-tracker-macro-and-global-effects-of-housing-crisis I guess I mean people losing their homes is not a priority to me and where government "problem fixing" money should go unless they want to front the bill. I worded this wrong. I know the housing crisis and lowering interest rate is one of the main causes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTQ B4U Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 The walls were put up to reduce noise and benefit the surrounding homes but I don't see why you're pissed? Tax dollars benfitting home owners in a secondary way pisses you off just because it didn't directly benefit you particularly? How about the folks along Hard Road that in reverse now have a four to five lane road in their back yard vs a two lane road....or any other area where roads are widened and easements are enforced? People lose too...but I for one am happy to see tax dollars actually raising property values and bettering a neighborhood. Contrast that with the Mayors Dumb fucking pet project of a trolley car system downtown. Dumb fuck Coleman and his agenda. Or how about the folks that live around 161 and Sunbury Road / Little Turtle...are the tax dollars being spent on the road system that definitely are benefiting those areas making you mad too? IMO, he took the risk and dealt with he situation when he bought his home and in return kudos to him for making out just a little better than average for doing so. It's no different than folks in Miami that bought a home 10yrs ago for $220k and now are able to sell it for $650k thanks to the market evolving. Tax dollars paid for the the infrastructure in those areas too. Heres something else that pissed me off that kinda follows these lines. I was pissed that taxpayer dollars were spent to put up all these concrete walls around 270 and allowed the peoples whos homes were valued "lower" due to location next to a freeway, to gain equity off the taxpayers. My buddy sold his house for a significant higher price after the wall was up than he could of before. He bought the house based on it having a sucky view of the freeway and the house was priced accordingly. Not that a wall is much better but still. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTQ B4U Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 The "they" in our Government is "us." Our tax dollars pay for just about everything "they" do. Money above and beyond our contributions is call debt, which in turn is "our" debt. I guess I mean people losing their homes is not a priority to me and where government "problem fixing" money should go unless they want to front the bill. I worded this wrong. I know the housing crisis and lowering interest rate is one of the main causes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrblunt Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 Spending money on concrete walls boosted the local economy and made the area typically look nicer. Money went to local construction companies instead of to lazy fuk's sitting on their ass waiting for a handout with no incentive to go get a job. I have no problem with that money and more than likely you buddy padded his pockets then turned around and put it back into circulation (either the bank invested it or he bought a new BMW) so it all comes around full circle. Stuff like that doesn't bug me too much but I'd tell your buddy to F off if I heard him bitching about it b/c he didnt have to buy that house I was listening to MSNBC or CNN the other day talking about the mortgage situation. A economist was talking about how lenders were 'pressured' to get as many people in homes as possible so they took these risks. Their shady lending practices are as big of a problem IMO. They were so quick to get people locked into these loans, make a quick buck, then dump off the loan to outside investors. What's funny is they made it so easy for someone 5 yrs to get a house with no money down and shitty credit that they've turned around and made it 10x harder for that same bucket of people today and now they're writing off losses like crazy. Uniformed consumers are only part of the problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin R. Posted May 9, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 The "they" in our Government is "us." Our tax dollars pay for just about everything "they" do. Money above and beyond our contributions is call debt, which in turn is "our" debt. I know this. I was saying that they should only do it, IMO, if it is not coming out of "our" pockets. The government giving out stimulus checks is not going into my tax dollars; same concept. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wease Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 If you own a home already and people in your neighborhood start walking from their homes due to lack of equity, the value of your home decreases as the supply of homes increases. So you are paying for it one way or another. I disagree with you on this, because I agree with Tim. I don't plan on selling my house and that perceived "equity" I was gaining was nothing more than the bubble getting bigger. What also helps someone like me is that I don't live in a "neighborhood" with a lot of other houses. It's just me, so people walking away doesn't hurt me. The bubble bursting won't hurt me in the long run, because I plan on being where I am perhaps until I retire. However, I don't want to have to pay for someone else's mistakes through taxes... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTQ B4U Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 Well essentially the Stimulus checks are our tax dollars being given back to us to use vs being allocated towards projects by the gov't. so the good is it's in our hands, the bad (depending on how you look at it), it's coming from a gov't spending budget somewhere....so we're paying the price in some way. I'd much rather have those that qualify for it spend it vs the gov't any day. I know this. I was saying that they should only do it, IMO, if it is not coming out of "our" pockets. The government giving out stimulus checks is not going into my tax dollars; same concept. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Science Abuse Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 The ecomomy is sliping and WILL NOT STOP untill it bottoms out. All this shit we're doing is just slowing it down, but at great costs and effectively lowering the "bottom -out" point. The more we fight it, the worse it will get. We need to let it fall, as quickly as possible, and start back up from zero. It is the only way we will ever have a strong economy again. The great depression only lasted about 10 years, we've been fuxing with this reccesion for 20, and will continue screwing with it indefinately. Let the K car die, then replace it. History is repeating itself, this has all happened before, and government interference and attempts to "prop up" the economy only made things owrse and made the path to full recovery more difficult. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LJ Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 The ecomomy is sliping and WILL NOT STOP untill it bottoms out. All this shit we're doing is just slowing it down, but at great costs and effectively lowering the "bottom -out" point. The more we fight it, the worse it will get. We need to let it fall, as quickly as possible, and start back up from zero. It is the only way we will ever have a strong economy again. The great depression only lasted about 10 years, we've been fuxing with this reccesion for 20, and will continue screwing with it indefinately. Let the K car die, then replace it. this post makes me laugh hysterically.... Fucking with a recession for 20 years? WTF? Do you even understand economics and that a free market economy is cyclical? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LJ Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 BTW, the U.S. economy is NOT in a recession. It is merely a period of "Slow growth". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Science Abuse Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 Do you even understand economics and that a free market economy is cyclical? Umm yes, that was the point. It's going to happen, stop trying to patch it and let it sink. These artificial credit-driven booms that everyone calls "stimulus" are going to kill us in the long run. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LJ Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 Umm yes, that was the point. It's going to happen, stop trying to patch it and let it sink. These artificial credit-driven booms that everyone calls "stimulus" are going to kill us in the long run. We are nowhere near the 2000-2001 levels... Not even close to 1987 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Science Abuse Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 I didn't list any relavance, I didn't even say the recession is getting better or worse. I jsut said we're in one, and have been for a while. The meddling is what creates the fluxuations (as well as consumer confidence, but that's a psycology discussion), up-down-up-down, but the slope is still a downward one. Also consider that this isn't just economics, it's macroeconomics. The last great depression was world-wide, and the next one will be, also. The world is ripe for it, it's not going to take much. Everyone is in debt on things that are depriciating rapidly. Everyone is saving because they cant afford to spend. Engery costs and demand are both rising Food costs are begining to reach problematic levels All we need is a few costly natural disasters, a long and expensive military campaign, and bunch of people pulling their money out of the market... ohh I dunno, like say a massive generation of people who are retiring and cashing out. That could never happen, right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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