Cordell Posted March 7, 2011 Report Share Posted March 7, 2011 I have a 2010 Silverado ext cab as some of you know and I am getting interested in doing a nice car audio set-up. I want to come up with a plan and put together something that sounds good with excellent clarity but is capable of being loud. I really want to make the truck feel like a concert hall. I don't want to spend a fortune, but I know in most cases you get what you pay for but lets keep it in reason. The truck is a base model so it doesn't even have a CD player, I don't mind removing everything thats in it currently including the back seat, speakers, head unit, I don't care, those of you who know me know that like getting great results. I've never been very knowegable in car audio, having worked as an electrician I understand all the basics. Good wiring, proper routing, and proper power and ground sources are a given. I built a system when I was about 19 in my extended cab S10 that sounded okay, made out of Best Buy's finest products (I didn't know any better back then), whatever the best Fosgate subs they sold back then, I had 2 10s and 2 12s, 2 6x9s, 2 6.5s, and 2 4x6s, with a 500w rms amp for the highs and a 2 channel 500w rms amp for the subs. This sounded okay and was loud enough but didn't have the clarity I was after. I'm sure there are some better components out there for the money. Don't just throw brands out there, lets hear how you would build a system for my truck. Would you use Dynamat? How would your power supply be put together? Your only limitations are the basic cab design of the truck (I'm not willing to do any major cutting), and that we are not looking at a competition truck but high quality loud truck, no bass drowning out everything else, but it does need good bass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nurkvinny Posted March 7, 2011 Report Share Posted March 7, 2011 My $.02 ... There are some great threads on the net about folks doing exactly what you're doing and from what I remember, the number one problem was always people putting in too MANY speakers. Some high end guys say for a clarity build, one great set of components and 2 subs. That's it as far as speakers. Totally 180 from the systems I used to build. But then again, I had no real idea of what I was doing and the clearest system I ever road in was an early-80's El Camino with a very simple design. Components spread out over a custom door panel and smallish subs under the rear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cordell Posted March 7, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 7, 2011 Could you point me in the direction of some of these articles? I want to learn more about it before I start spending money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjrsplat Posted March 7, 2011 Report Share Posted March 7, 2011 if you need help designing a system, id be glad to help you out, i have built quite a few ranging from competition quality spl setups to sound quality setups, and used about every decent speaker brand in the business.. you dont need to spend a ton of money to sound great, most of the big name speakers are overpriced junk truthfully.. in order to design a sound system for you we would need to take measurements of the vehicle, decide ported or sealed enclosure (you get smoother bass response in a properly tuned ported enclosure, and can sound every bit as clean as a sealed enclosure.) size and amount of woofers, and then go from there. after you pick out what you want the enclosure to be, build around that, components, amps, etc. if you're not planning on going too crazy with power, i would suggest doing the big 3 upgrade which is replacing alternator wire, motor ground, and battery ground with larger wires. if you are planning on tremendous power, consider a second battery (dont even waste your money on a capacitor, they are worthless) at any rate if you want to seriously discuss your options, feel free to pm me and we can set something up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FST94TSI Posted March 7, 2011 Report Share Posted March 7, 2011 Well first you absolutely need capacitors. Second there's no need at all to lose your backseat unless youre going for an extreme amount of bass. The best power upgrade without replacing your alternator which really isn't necessary in a v8 truck is a kinetic power cell. They come in several different sizes depending on you total amp power output. They are a high brid battery capacitor design that gives the advantages of both in a small compact case the size of an average battery. When you see someones lights blinking like crazy with the bass that's a sign of needing a capacitor. I installed professionally in real stereo shops for about 12 years. (no hokie pokie best buy bullshit). Secondly there are quite. A few really nice boxes that fit under the rear seat in those trucks and provide either space for 2 10"s or 2 12"s. That decision is based soley on what type of sound you want and how much volume you want. As for the door speakers up front you can reuse the factory locations with a small amount of modification behind the scenes and you'll be able to get plenty of sound. A 6.5" component set will fit in the factory location I. The doors just fine. The rear locations don't give you very much size but crossed over properly they can provide nice fill to even out the sound. If you're not happy with the amount of volume or clarity because you have to over compensate for not having the amount of volume you want coming from the fronts then a nice set of kick panels is pretty easy ti build down near the foot rests on each side of the front floor boards. As for radio that's purely personal preference and those trucks will fit just about anything with little or no modification. Their are interfaces although they can get pricey that will allow you to retain onstar, Bluetooth, steering wheel controls etc. Most of the interfaces that allow all if this stuff are in the $100.00 plus range. If you're interested in talking more and possibly getting a quote from me, please feel free to contact me even if it's just some questions so you don't get ripped off or misinformed. Although I don't work for a shop anymore and don't want too, I do installs at home and offer a money back guarantee. If you're not happy with the work you dont have to pay. I could easily do your truck completely setup, tuned, and installed on a Saturday or Sunday, no problem. I'm nit trying to start a pissing war with the other guy that said no capacitor but it's a fact that you'll need one to do it right. It's a good, better, best scenario. Car batteries by nature are made to slowly discharge and recharge. Capacitors by nature discharge and recharge extremely quick thus keeping up with the demand of the beats and such in music. You really need a little of both to get the best results. That's why I recommended the kinetic high brid design. That way all in one case you get capacitance to keep up with the quick draw of the music and the reservrve power of a battery to keep up with the overall needs of the system while playing and recharging everything else. I assure you that you'll be quite happy if you contact me to help with setting this up even if you don't want me to do the install. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Bruh Posted March 7, 2011 Report Share Posted March 7, 2011 Well first you absolutely need capacitors. hahahaha. That's funny. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SPL_Josh Posted March 7, 2011 Report Share Posted March 7, 2011 Y u no pm me? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SPL_Josh Posted March 7, 2011 Report Share Posted March 7, 2011 Anyone who reccommends capacitors doesn't know what their doing. There are better sound deadners for cheaper than dynamat. You'll get the most out of a custom box with a small sub than a pre Fab box with mulitple subs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neonkiller Posted March 7, 2011 Report Share Posted March 7, 2011 If I could put my in house surround sound setup in my house in my car that is what I would wanna hear super loud and not to much bass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SPL_Josh Posted March 7, 2011 Report Share Posted March 7, 2011 If I could put my in house surround sound setup in my house in my car that is what I would wanna hear super loud and not to much bass. You can put a 5.1 system in a car. There are different ways to go about that Either with an active headinit or secondary processors/amps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjrsplat Posted March 7, 2011 Report Share Posted March 7, 2011 Well first you absolutely need capacitors. Second there's no need at all to lose your backseat unless youre going for an extreme amount of bass. The best power upgrade without replacing your alternator which really isn't necessary in a v8 truck is a kinetic power cell. They come in several different sizes depending on you total amp power output. They are a high brid battery capacitor design that gives the advantages of both in a small compact case the size of an average battery. When you see someones lights blinking like crazy with the bass that's a sign of needing a capacitor. I installed professionally in real stereo shops for about 12 years. (no hokie pokie best buy bullshit). Secondly there are quite. A few really nice boxes that fit under the rear seat in those trucks and provide either space for 2 10"s or 2 12"s. That decision is based soley on what type of sound you want and how much volume you want. As for the door speakers up front you can reuse the factory locations with a small amount of modification behind the scenes and you'll be able to get plenty of sound. A 6.5" component set will fit in the factory location I. The doors just fine. The rear locations don't give you very much size but crossed over properly they can provide nice fill to even out the sound. If you're not happy with the amount of volume or clarity because you have to over compensate for not having the amount of volume you want coming from the fronts then a nice set of kick panels is pretty easy ti build down near the foot rests on each side of the front floor boards. As for radio that's purely personal preference and those trucks will fit just about anything with little or no modification. Their are interfaces although they can get pricey that will allow you to retain onstar, Bluetooth, steering wheel controls etc. Most of the interfaces that allow all if this stuff are in the $100.00 plus range. If you're interested in talking more and possibly getting a quote from me, please feel free to contact me even if it's just some questions so you don't get ripped off or misinformed. Although I don't work for a shop anymore and don't want too, I do installs at home and offer a money back guarantee. If you're not happy with the work you dont have to pay. I could easily do your truck completely setup, tuned, and installed on a Saturday or Sunday, no problem. I'm nit trying to start a pissing war with the other guy that said no capacitor but it's a fact that you'll need one to do it right. It's a good, better, best scenario. Car batteries by nature are made to slowly discharge and recharge. Capacitors by nature discharge and recharge extremely quick thus keeping up with the demand of the beats and such in music. You really need a little of both to get the best results. That's why I recommended the kinetic high brid design. That way all in one case you get capacitance to keep up with the quick draw of the music and the reservrve power of a battery to keep up with the overall needs of the system while playing and recharging everything else. I assure you that you'll be quite happy if you contact me to help with setting this up even if you don't want me to do the install. capacitors drain quick. recharge time takes longer. 1 decent bass note and the cap is dead, wheras an extra battery would not be. think of it like a disposable camera flash, takes about 5-10 seconds to charge the capacitor in a camera flash, then a quick blink of light and the capacitor is drained. imagine trying to make that capacitor hold that flash light on for more than a split second. not to start a pissing match, but yeah, shops are out there to make money. high five to you for being an installer, but at the end of the day that means you were trained buy a guy who wants you to push parts and make money, whereas i was trained by car audio guys that have been winning competitions since the early 90's call your old boss and tell him to sell more batteries, capacitors are a waste of money unless you want to power a camera flash. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickey4271647545519 Posted March 7, 2011 Report Share Posted March 7, 2011 Actually caps respond faster than batts do, and in a properly put together system you'll have a nice big cap along with batts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjrsplat Posted March 7, 2011 Report Share Posted March 7, 2011 Actually caps respond faster than batts do, and in a properly put together system you'll have a nice big cap along with batts. nobody is arguing they respond faster, they respond too fast, thats the problem with them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cordell Posted March 7, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 7, 2011 Y u no pm me? Anyone who reccommends capacitors doesn't know what their doing. There are better sound deadners for cheaper than dynamat. You'll get the most out of a custom box with a small sub than a pre Fab box with mulitple subs Well whenever you want to see the truck and talk about how to put a nice reasonable system together let me know. I don't really want to have a 50 PM discussion. I did think of PMing you, especially when Dyno Brian says you know what you're doing, but I'm just in the getting ideas together and planning what I'm going to do and how I'm going to sell it to the wife. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SPL_Josh Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 Pm me your cell I know Nick was advising you on a head unit and front/rear sound stage. I prefer to only work on sub stages. So I can check out size limitations and what your wanting out of the truck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FST94TSI Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 Well first mjrsplat I was an installer, a salesperson, and a manager , so your statement is lacking in all credibility. As I stated the kinetic batteries that are a combination of a capacitor and a battery are the best way to go. Moron assholes like yourself that start screaming competition this and competition that are usually total idiots and you prove this thoroughly. He never said he wanted a competition system. He said he wanted a suggestions for a nice system that didn't break the bank. Go to the kinetic website and educate yourself about them before you speak. Yes caps drain quickly but they recharge just as quick thus keeping a more consistent amount of power on hand for an amplifier while a battery provides a longer constant charge, basically a reserve on hand all the time for the amplifiers in a system. Have you ever owned an amp that didn't have capacitors built into it? Well I suppose amps have capacitors built into them because the engineers who designed them are idiots right? The more voltage and the more consistent voltage that an amplifier has provided to it the higher and more consistent power it will provide to a system. Spljosh you seem to know what you're talking about from prior posts but why do you not like capacitors ? I'm just curious. I do agree that a capacitor by itself is a waste of money but in tandem with a nice deep cycle battery it's undeniably useful. Spljosh I don't mind discussing this with you but that other idiot needs to learn a whole lot before he joins this discussion with people who know what they're talking about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SPL_Josh Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 My gripe with caps (yes they do discharge and recharge fast) is that your electrical system isn't up too par its a waste. If your amp full tilt is drawing 100 amps then your car needs to putt out 100 amps of current. Well a cap can discharge in 1/10's of seconds. If the bass line is 2/10< then you need 100+< amps. So if it takes 5-10 amps to charge a cap then on a sine wave your gonna draw more power than than just the amp itself. Kinetik and xs power are batteries geared towards audio. Well they're agm batteries. Agm=agm. And there are alot of cheaper agm batteries out there. Deka comes to mind. Hell orielys has rebadged dekas under the orielys name. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KillJoy Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 eDead > Dynomat :thumbup: KillJoy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjrsplat Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 Well first mjrsplat I was an installer, a salesperson, and a manager , so your statement is lacking in all credibility. As I stated the kinetic batteries that are a combination of a capacitor and a battery are the best way to go. Moron assholes like yourself that start screaming competition this and competition that are usually total idiots and you prove this thoroughly. He never said he wanted a competition system. He said he wanted a suggestions for a nice system that didn't break the bank. Go to the kinetic website and educate yourself about them before you speak. Yes caps drain quickly but they recharge just as quick thus keeping a more consistent amount of power on hand for an amplifier while a battery provides a longer constant charge, basically a reserve on hand all the time for the amplifiers in a system. Have you ever owned an amp that didn't have capacitors built into it? Well I suppose amps have capacitors built into them because the engineers who designed them are idiots right? The more voltage and the more consistent voltage that an amplifier has provided to it the higher and more consistent power it will provide to a system. Spljosh you seem to know what you're talking about from prior posts but why do you not like capacitors ? I'm just curious. I do agree that a capacitor by itself is a waste of money but in tandem with a nice deep cycle battery it's undeniably useful. Spljosh I don't mind discussing this with you but that other idiot needs to learn a whole lot before he joins this discussion with people who know what they're talking about. i never said he wanted a competition system did i? i only stated that people with years of experience building their own stereos, yes competetion stereos seem to grasp car audio concepts a hell of a lot better than the people trying to get your business in the store. they dont have a hidden agenda to sell you shit. i have been building quality stereo systems for the past 10+ years. i too have experience in car audio shops. as an installer, fabricator, and a sales rep. working in a car audio shop didnt teach me shit compared to the people i met building their own setups. growing up i learned a lot from my friends dad who has a degree in sound engineering, and put it to good use building his own stereos. at any rate, the only person looking like an idiot here is you. you assumed i dont know shit, you assumed i never worked in a car audio shop, and you assumed that just because someone builds their own competition quality system, they must not know anything about car audio at all, only that its loud. spljosh is right on the money why capacitors suck, they drain too fast to do much good in a car audio setup, plain and simple. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Spam Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 I dont think you understand fully the physics behind a cap do you splatty? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjrsplat Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 I dont think you understand fully the physics behind a cap do you splatty? yes i do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nurkvinny Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 A lot of us had great sounding (and some just flat-out hitting) systems using the car's original alternator and battery and using no caps. Hell I ran 4 isobaric Pioneer 12's with only what GM put in an 87 Z24. With an amp obviously. No issues. I think people get carried away with what is really needed to make good sound. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FST94TSI Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 Nurvinny you are correct. I did state that it's a good better best scenario. A cap is not a must, that part is obvious however it will help stiffen the amount of voltage going to an amp under heavy music loads. The same reason that nearly every amp built has caps in them is the exact same reason why a system will benefit from having them inline. The more power you can store to release for long heavy bass notes the better an amp will run. Amps with non regulated power supplies benefit the most but even amps with regulated power supplies do benefit from having one. Answer me this guys who doubt me. If caps are not necessary in a system then why do all amplifiers in car audio come with them and the more power an amp puts out generally the more of them there are in the amplifiers build specs. Point blank amplifiers need them for the quick power demands that they put on a system. A cap and an extra battery are by far the way to go in MY OPINION. One can absolutely build a system without either of them being in play but a properly setup system will benefit from the extra reserve power of an extra battery and the stiffened quick release power stored up by a cap. Spljosh I do agree that most of the time there are non name brand alternatives that are cheaper and still work just as good however be careful because sometimes there's a reason for the cheaper price that goes deeper than just a sticker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FST94TSI Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 My last system consisted of a Rockford power t2001 and a Rockford power t15004 with a deep cycle gell cell for each amp and Rockford 100 farad cap. On a stock alternator with little upgrade to the charging wires I had no light dim at night and very minimal voltage movement until very near full volume. I did install a digital voltage gauge so that I could monitor the effects on the car. Now my one big advantage was that it was a 5 series BMW so the battery was already in the trunk thus making my longest run of power wire maybe 4 or 5 feet. I will say that before we installed the cap there was quite a but of light dimming at night and about a 1.5 volt drop under heavy volume loads. Once the cap was in ther little to no voltage drop no matter what the volume was set at. Here's one for you guts to chew on. I firmly believe that an RCA line driver makes a huge difference in volume. That's one that I'll put money on for anybody that wants to debate that fact. Allow me to set it up in any system with an aftermarket amp and if it doesn't make a huge difference I'll pay you double what you payed for the line driver. It must be a quality line driver though and I'll back it up with cold hard cash. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SPL_Josh Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 Lol thread has been derailed. cordell asked for help not a pissing match. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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