So are the people finally being heard ?

[TTQ B4U]

• With the reaction to changes Netflix encountered
  
• With the latest example at Bank of America and the backlash of raising their fees.
  
• With the entire Tea Party Movement
  
• etc.
  

 

Is the voice of the people finally being heard? I don't agree with all aspects of the tent cities around the country and protesters on Wall Street but I do agree with the visibility that it's providing others who may be on the edge of doing nothing or doing something.

 

We've all discussed how the country is going to shit but what are each of us doing about it?

 

Shit-can of discussion opened up. Let her rip....

[wagner]

• With the reaction to changes Netflix encountered
  
• With the latest example at Bank of America and the backlash of raising their fees.
  
• With the entire Tea Party Movement
  
• etc.
  

 

Is the voice of the people finally being heard? I don't agree with all aspects of the tent cities around the country and protesters on Wall Street but I do agree with the visibility that it's providing others who may be on the edge of doing nothing or doing something.

 

We've all discussed how the country is going to shit but what are each of us doing about it?

 

Shit-can of discussion opened up. Let her rip....

 

2 of those 3 I am ok with. The Tea Party are not how I want my voice to be heard.

[iwashmycar]

Yes. It also appears the large corporations are showing some love. They did not have to do anything, but I am certain the negative publicity was hurting the checkbook. That is all it comes down to really.

 

Take money = see results

[truckin]

I thought a first the Tea Party was gonna be a great thing to get behind, being a conservative. But they are just as blinded and miss guided as the rest of the organizations out there.

 

As far as Netflix and the Bank of America I really haven't paid attention to either on and don't know enough about it to really comment other than I have never used either one.

 

My issue is with Ohio's blinded lawmakers and the direct attack on Ohio's middle class working families with SB5.

[Scotty2Hotty]

I go to work, make money and pay taxes.

[wagner]

I thought a first the Tea Party was gonna be a great thing to get behind, being a conservative. But they are just as blinded and miss guided as the rest of the organizations out there.

 

As far as Netflix and the Bank of America I really haven't paid attention to either on and don't know enough about it to really comment other than I have never used either one.

 

My issue is with Ohio's blinded lawmakers and the direct attack on Ohio's middle class working families with SB5.

 

Fuck SB5 and the lawmakers who came up with it. From what I understand, and I could be wrong the lawmakers pay and benifits don't get touched?

[Gergwheel1647545492]

I go to work, make money and pay taxes.

 

+1

[Gergwheel1647545492]

Fuck SB5 and the lawmakers who came up with it. From what I understand, and I could be wrong the lawmakers pay and benifits don't get touched?

 

devils advocate:

 

why are all state employees pay, benefits and retirement better than 90% of private sector jobs? that doesn't seem fair to me, just sayin

[wagner]

devils advocate:

 

why are all state employees pay, benefits and retirement better than 90% of private sector jobs? that doesn't seem fair to me, just sayin

 

Not going to say that is right, by why not go after private companies that have crappy benefits? Force them to raise the bar? You can look at this and spin it a lot of different ways.

 

My take, I see what they are trying to do but the way they are going about it sucks. It reflects how piss poor this adminstration is in ohio, how sad the GOP is, and useless the current elected officials are.

 

 

There are better ways to fix this issue, like maybe just make them pay more for their benefits? That would be a pretty simple and easy fix right?

[jeffro]

problem with these tent cities is half of them have no idea what their even protesting. Or are protesting something totally different from the rest of the group. The movement needs a centralized "leader" so to speak.

 

as for me? Nothing. Going to a cheap community college, working my ass of to pay bills, and just moving on.

[BigOxley]

devils advocate:

 

why are all state employees pay, benefits and retirement better than 90% of private sector jobs? that doesn't seem fair to me, just sayin

 

i realize you are playing the devil's advocate, but

 

1. please cite where you get the 90%

 

2. if you don't like your job, get another higher paying job.

 

it's not the state/government workers fault corporations are shipping the good jobs overseas and giving the rest of the workers less benefits.

 

this 43% "better wages" for state workers that you are seeing on tv, is simply not true.

[Trouble Maker]

The tea party is a paid for movement funded by corporations and achieved stellar results compared to what was expected. They've managed to stall the government making any real progress on anything. While corporations use this planned 'uncertantity' to rake in trillions of dollars. Overall they represent a fringe of society. If you think this is the peoples will being heard you need your head checked.

 

Not many shits would be given about SB5 if it weren't a blatant power grab by the GOP by trying to eliminate (probably) the biggest union (backing Dem's) in the state. They far overreached and are not representing the will of the people and will be punished by their bill being voted down by the will of the people. Our beloved Governor is single-handedly trying to either privatize or eliminate every state government program in the guise of reducing the budget. All with the end game of putting more control in the hands of the wealthy and the corporations. Hopefully enough people can see this to vote that asshole out when his time comes. This shit bag could destroy a lot more over the next 3+ years.

[Gergwheel1647545492]

i realize you are playing the devil's advocate, but

 

1. please cite where you get the 90%

 

2. if you don't like your job, get another higher paying job.

 

it's not the state/government workers fault corporations are shipping the good jobs overseas and giving the rest of the workers less benefits.

 

this 43% "better wages" for state workers that you are seeing on TV, is simply not true.

 

1. I worked for the govt and now I'm in the private sector, while the govt pay was shit the retirement was awesome and that is what kept me at that job for 5 years. I made up the 90%, but i feel that its pretty accurate seeing how STERS, SERS, OPERS works alone makes the govt retirement better than almost any corp.

 

also it is very easy for a state employee to retire after 30 years and be comfortable with their retirement, my dad has been working for 35 years and won't be able to retire for at least another 5-7 due to his 401k taking a dump and social security taking a crap as well.

 

2. I love my job and I'm compensated very well for what i do. Again, I'm just playing devil's advocate. I firmly believe teachers are underpaid for the amount of time they have to put in and all the teachers i know also put a lot of their own money into the school systems to help the children learn better.

[CRed05]

I did not know anything about SB5, so after I did some quick reading, it seems to me that it's a good thing on the surface. Making striking illegal, pay based on performance, reduced sick leave and paid vacation, not having to pay union fees if you don't want to be in a union...

[ForeverMaker]

pay based on performance

 

Please explain how this would work for teachers (let alone police and firefighters).

 

I am genuinely curious.

[CRed05]

I firmly believe teachers are underpaid for the amount of time they have to put in and all the teachers i know also put a lot of their own money into the school systems to help the children learn better.

 

Meh, teachers are over rated IMO. They are just a middle man between a student and a book. Except their book has all the answers in it already.

[greg1647545532]

My take, I see what they are trying to do but the way they are going about it sucks. It reflects how piss poor this adminstration is in ohio, how sad the GOP is, and useless the current elected officials are.

 

Exactly. I could get behind a bill that directly cut costs somehow, even if those costs came out of state pension and benefit programs. But SB5 doesn't actually cut any costs, it just eviscerates union rights with no clear goal or reason. It's the most transparent ideological misdirection I've seen in a long time.

 

If the state sucks so much at negotiating that they need to make the playing field ludicrously lopsided in their favor, maybe we need better negotiators.

 

 

To the OP: I have no optimism that anything will change. Netflix will go back to fucking their customers once everyone's had a chance to get used to the idea. Bank of America will find another way to fuck their customers with fees without being so public about it. And the gov't will make a big show about listening to OWS or the Tea Party but the next crop of politicians is going to act exactly like the current crop.

[Gergwheel1647545492]

Please explain how this would work for teachers (let alone police and firefighters).

 

I am genuinely curious.

 

a lot of teachers are already given raises and judged by performance, its based on how well the students do on standardized testing. This is not a fair judge of how well a teacher performs at all.

 

However, are you saying that a teacher should get a 5% raise every year no matter how good/bad they do? that's not fair to the tax payers at all either. I have no solution to the problem, just listing the problems that i see.

[ForeverMaker]

My wife is a teacher with her masters and she does not get a 5% raise every year.

 

Try 0% most years and slashes in healthcare, etc.

[Gergwheel1647545492]

My wife is a teacher with her masters and she does not get a 5% raise every year.

 

Try 0% most years and slashes in healthcare, etc.

 

does she work in a low-income district?

[CRed05]

Please explain how this would work for teachers (let alone police and firefighters).

 

I am genuinely curious.

 

Same way it would for someone flipping burgers, changing oil or pumping out computer code. I think it's pretty self explanatory, if you are showing a good "performance", your pay will be "based" on it. Do you show up on time? Do you know what the fuck you are doing? Do you only do the minimum? Are you taking cigarette breaks every 10 mins? List goes on and on...

 

I don't think you should base it on student performance, because that's not the teacher's performance. You then also run into issues with teachers for special needs students.

[greg1647545532]

Same way it would for someone flipping burgers, changing oil or pumping out computer code. I think it's pretty self explanatory, if you are showing a good "performance", your pay will be "based" on it. Do you show up on time? Do you know what the fuck you are doing? Do you only do the minimum? Are you taking cigarette breaks every 10 mins? List goes on and on...

 

I don't think you should base it on student performance, because that's not the teacher's performance.

 

Clearly you've never worked for the government...

[ForeverMaker]

I don't think you should base it on student performance, because that's not the teacher's performance. You then also run into issues with teachers for special needs students.

 

Well-said.

[CRed05]

Clearly you've never worked for the government...

 

No, what am I missing here? To me it seems like a pretty easy ride.

[TTQ B4U]

also it is very easy for a state employee to retire after 30 years and be comfortable with their retirement, my dad has been working for 35 years and won't be able to retire for at least another 5-7 due to his 401k taking a dump and social security taking a crap as well.

 

^^ this. My beef with the system is that it's the retirement plans of a lot of public service jobs like teachers and law enforcement are able to spend more time retired and drawing a nice pension for longer than the years they contributed.

 

I have a friend who worked for 25yrs with Perry Township Police. He recently retired and "worked the system" by putting in tons of overtime and paid gigs his last three years knowing his retirement was based on the average of his highest three years. His best year was nearly 80k and at age 47 retired with 60% of that for the rest of his life. Kicker is the Township rehired him in another role making some very nice money. Combined with his retirement and benefits, he's making some serious coin and living a nice life. Not bad for a beat cop.

 

He's in great shape and will likely live into his mid to upper 70's thus enjoying a 60% payroll check for longer than he put in. On top of that, he's also occupying a position that a non-retired person could have instead. It's this type of "working the system" that is strapping states for cash. FUCK the .5% tax Coleman pulled in to support the force today. BULLSHIT...free up the money that retired guys are reaping in and adding to their now new-found careers and have the state fund the public sector as they should.

 

It's even worse for teachers. With a majority of them women, living much longer than the current retirement plan was intended to be supportive of, made possible by great health benefits, etc...STRS is also going broke trying to support those that are retired. So now they are strapped when it comes to trying to educate our kids today.

 

FUCK ANY levy they try and pass. I'll be damned if they are going to bullshit me in that they need the money for schools and programs left and right. Stop funding the posh retirements of all those people who only had to put in 30yrs and can easily reap retirement for 30 more. Raise the number of years for an employee to put in to 40yrs and fix what is broke instead of trying to have me fund their retirements. I have my own retirement and family to provide for.