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BRZ Decisions... WWCRD?

Draco-REX

By Draco-REX
in Passing Lane

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99StockGT Newbie

99StockGT

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I'm sure you've talked with your shop after all this was done, what was their thought? What all exactly was done to this for the repair? Any time we ever release a car to a customer that's had custom work done to it there are always miles/break-in on it to make sure this exact thing doesn't happen.. sorry to hear your foray into heavily modded has gone so poorly :(

 

With the fact you already have your racecar itch handled I would probably recommend going to a platform that ISN'T much supported in the aftermarket. Less availability means less temptation... spoken from someone who does NOT live his own advice.

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Draco-REX Newbie

Draco-REX

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I'm sure you've talked with your shop after all this was done, what was their thought? What all exactly was done to this for the repair? Any time we ever release a car to a customer that's had custom work done to it there are always miles/break-in on it to make sure this exact thing doesn't happen.. sorry to hear your foray into heavily modded has gone so poorly :(

 

With the fact you already have your racecar itch handled I would probably recommend going to a platform that ISN'T much supported in the aftermarket. Less availability means less temptation... spoken from someone who does NOT live his own advice.

 

Well, here's the short version:

 

The FA20 rockers aren't actually attached to anything in the head. They sit atop the valve stem and a hollow lifter with oil pressure behind it. On top of the rocker sits the cam. So the only thing holding the rocker in place is spring tension and oil pressure.

 

After the first failure, when we discovered it wasn't due to a pin failure in the rocker was to research other causes. The concensus was that the stock valve springs were on the weaker side. Since earlier that day I had rode the rev limiter a couple times for a second or two, I figured the rocker had worked its way out of place, and then eventually came out later that day when the oil pressure was at its lowest. Since the rocker caused a lot of damage, I had to replace the whole head. In that case, I picked up a set of P&P heads with dual valve springs.

 

Shortly after that repair, not 20 miles or so, a rocker came loose again. Since we knew the valve spring tension wasn't the issue, the only other thing was the lifter. Again, calling around to performance shops that have worked with this engine, we came to the conclusion that the stock oil pump didn't move enough oil at idle, and that in combination with my oil cooler was allowing the lifters to collapse. To combat this, we removed the oil cooler and shimmed the bypas valve to give the oil pressure a bump. (I've been running a heavier oil since the super charger any ways).

 

But again, less than 20 miles later, the engine failed and it sounds just like the previous failure.. That's where I'm at. There's something wrong with the engine either by accident or design, and I'm not going to continue throwing money at it to find out what it is.

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Doc1647545523 Newbie

Doc1647545523

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Well, you asked for advice. Most people are telling you that you're right to cut your losses and run, give up on this doomed project, find something else that will come close....

 

You've made a lot of threads on this build. You loved it from afar before the car could even be purchased. You defended it for page after page against all its haters. You lead us in painstaking detail through your decisions to use X instead of Y, wheels/tires/power adders. You built your dream. I remember telling you how much I admired your choices for this car.

 

But the car has had multiple, debilitating failures. If I read you right, you're saying the problem won out and you're quitting because of that. I would claim it's the other way around: the problem only wins because you quit.

 

If you're okay with the idea of walking away from this project (and it seems that you are and that many others agree), then you probably should. Maybe not reach so far next time .... try something safer. Think of it as cursed, or as screwed up by Toyota from the onset .... anything to distance yourself from it.

 

But if you're not comfortable with the idea that you put so much of your thought, time, energy and money into a car that you can't keep running, well, I would just consider carefully your next step. "I built the most awesome car, but it didn't run." You'll spend the next few years, maybe longer, "chasing Amy,"

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Draco-REX Newbie

Draco-REX

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Well, you asked for advice. Most people are telling you that you're right to cut your losses and run, give up on this doomed project, find something else that will come close....

 

You've made a lot of threads on this build. You loved it from afar before the car could even be purchased. You defended it for page after page against all its haters. You lead us in painstaking detail through your decisions to use X instead of Y, wheels/tires/power adders. You built your dream. I remember telling you how much I admired your choices for this car.

 

But the car has had multiple, debilitating failures. If I read you right, you're saying the problem won out and you're quitting because of that. I would claim it's the other way around: the problem only wins because you quit.

 

If you're okay with the idea of walking away from this project (and it seems that you are and that many others agree), then you probably should. Maybe not reach so far next time .... try something safer. Think of it as cursed, or as screwed up by Toyota from the onset .... anything to distance yourself from it.

 

But if you're not comfortable with the idea that you put so much of your thought, time, energy and money into a car that you can't keep running, well, I would just consider carefully your next step. "I built the most awesome car, but it didn't run." You'll spend the next few years, maybe longer, "chasing Amy,"

 

I completely agree. Every step of the way, I've made choices based on making this car the best it can be, I haven't cut corners and went into the mods with the full understanding that I was creating a potential for issues. But I also did all that I could to keep the possibility of those issues to a minimum. What I didn't foresee is that the problem I'd run into is related to the basic design of the engine. I didn't break a rod, crack a ring land, or destroy the transmission; something that I could replace with better stronger components. Instead, the design of the valvetrain has become a weak point. And now, as long as there is a FA20 under that hood, that weakness will be there too. I can't trust this engine.

 

One of my choices was the keep the car and go with a LS swap. But while the engine will be more reliable, I question if I would just be moving the source of the issues from the engine to the electrical system. There are no full swap kits yet. Integrating the LS ECU with the BCM is a one-off thing every time this is done. Wouldn't I be just inviting more headaches and more down time?

 

And you're right about "Chasing Amy". This is definitely a case where it is NOT better to have love then lost. The last day it ran, it was perfect. I've never had a car that responded so well, or that felt so "right" as it did that day. I will be comparing any car I get to fill this spot in my garage to the BRZ on that day.

 

It kills me to walk away from this car. I drive past it every day when I leave or return home and I just can't help slowing down and admiring how it looks. I would love to find a way to keep this car. But can I? Can I drive this car again when I'm constantly worried it will break down? Let's say I started this thread instead by saying the BRZ broke down and I was going to LS swap it? I'm sure there would be a good amount of support, but equally I think there would be a number of replies calling my insane for going for an even MORE complex modification while looking for reliability.

 

I just don't know.

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Grudes Newbie

Grudes

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Well, you asked for advice. Most people are telling you that you're right to cut your losses and run, give up on this doomed project, find something else that will come close....

 

You've made a lot of threads on this build. You loved it from afar before the car could even be purchased. You defended it for page after page against all its haters. You lead us in painstaking detail through your decisions to use X instead of Y, wheels/tires/power adders. You built your dream. I remember telling you how much I admired your choices for this car.

 

But the car has had multiple, debilitating failures. If I read you right, you're saying the problem won out and you're quitting because of that. I would claim it's the other way around: the problem only wins because you quit.

 

If you're okay with the idea of walking away from this project (and it seems that you are and that many others agree), then you probably should. Maybe not reach so far next time .... try something safer. Think of it as cursed, or as screwed up by Toyota from the onset .... anything to distance yourself from it.

 

But if you're not comfortable with the idea that you put so much of your thought, time, energy and money into a car that you can't keep running, well, I would just consider carefully your next step. "I built the most awesome car, but it didn't run." You'll spend the next few years, maybe longer, "chasing Amy,"

 

Wow, most people have to pay for a breakdown like this

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99StockGT Newbie

99StockGT

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You mentioned previously that there are others out there with more power than you are, guessing you have compared notes with them? Typically the Subaru community is one of the better out there on sharing ideas/experiences/dreams so I'm shocked to find no one has run into this and found a fix.

 

Certainly not on the same scale as you but my Merkur feels somewhat similar, I've owned the car a little over 3 years now and purchased it as a track car. Several thousand dollars later, a few engine rebuilds, buying 2 OTHER Merkurs, lots and lots of parts... and it's STILL never made it on track. But, it's something I still enjoy standing around scratching my head and tinkering with, the idea of selling it isn't even an option. Sometimes these pains and memories we build with our rides are worth it... sometimes not.

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Draco-REX Newbie

Draco-REX

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You mentioned previously that there are others out there with more power than you are, guessing you have compared notes with them? Typically the Subaru community is one of the better out there on sharing ideas/experiences/dreams so I'm shocked to find no one has run into this and found a fix.

 

Certainly not on the same scale as you but my Merkur feels somewhat similar, I've owned the car a little over 3 years now and purchased it as a track car. Several thousand dollars later, a few engine rebuilds, buying 2 OTHER Merkurs, lots and lots of parts... and it's STILL never made it on track. But, it's something I still enjoy standing around scratching my head and tinkering with, the idea of selling it isn't even an option. Sometimes these pains and memories we build with our rides are worth it... sometimes not.

 

This would be a different matter if I could see a solution to the problem. Even if it took two used engines and a lot of parts, if I knew the problem would be fixed and would never occur again, I'd do it. That was one reason why I went to the built heads. At that point it looked like the problem was with the springs so I tried to make sure it would never happen again. But then it did.. twice.

 

I don't see that there is a next step towards a solution, so the journey is at an end.

 

If I could be assured that a LS swap would be reliable and that I wouldn't lose functionality, the option would be very high on my list.

 

Tomorrow I'm going to head up to Twinsburg to check out the Exige that Robochan linked. (Going to miss out on what will probably be an awesome C&C.) It should fit the bill, but I think I might not fit inside it with a helmet on. If it turns out that I can fit reasonably, I may jump on the opportunity. Otherwise, I'll have more time to consider other options.

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Draco-REX Newbie

Draco-REX

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Does an EJ engine not work in one of these? It's an FA motor right?

 

It's not a bolt-in. There are a couple with EJs, but it's a swap like any other engine. Since you don't really save any time or trouble going to an EJ over another engine, most who do swaps will choose a different engine. Not to mention, the super charger won't bolt to an EJ either.

 

 

In other, but related news, I've apparently made my decision.

 

I went up to SwitchCars in Twinsburg to check out the Lotus.

http://www.switchcars.com/cars-for-sale/8/2006-lotus-exige-supercharged

 

And I bought it. Doug was great to work with and he worked a pretty good deal for me. Overall I was happy with my experience with SwitchCars.

 

The car itself is very good. The Exige as-is is a minimal little go-kart of a car. This one is even more so. The HVAC has been reduced to just a fan, and the windshield wiper has been removed (I may replace this). Definitely a hard-core ride. The nice thing is that it's fully track-prepped. I want to get to track days more often in the near future, and everything I'd want to do has already been done.

 

The big question was, could I fit my 6'3" carcass inside it comfortably? Surprisingly, the answer is Yes. There's an amazing amount for fore/aft adjustment in the seat. I actually had to move it up a couple notches. So someone taller than me, with that extra height being in the legs, would fit. I even had some room between my head and the roof. However, with a helmet on, I was touching the roof. Good thing the roof comes off. :)

 

Now, getting IN and OUT of the car is an entirely different matter. I think I figured out the best way to do it, but I still look like a drunk chick trying to sneak under a velvet rope. I may get the hang of it, but I'll never be graceful at it.

 

The steering is a little vague at center and the brakes grab before the pedal tightens up, but I should be able to adjust to it. This should be a fun car to drive. I've always wanted a Lotus due to their focused nature: "Simplify, and add lightness." So I'm looking forward to driving this car. I think it will fill the BRZ's spot very well.

 

If there's one thing I don't like about this car, it's that there really isn't anything I can modify/customize on it. Maybe I'll get the wheels painted something obscenely bright... ;)

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Doc1647545523 Newbie

Doc1647545523

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Now, getting IN and OUT of the car is an entirely different matter. I think I figured out the best way to do it, but I still look like a drunk chick trying to sneak under a velvet rope. I may get the hang of it, but I'll never be graceful at it.

 

Well, there's another side to that .....

 

http://i355.photobucket.com/albums/r445/martyr65/eliseposter2.jpg

 

A great track car? Yep, no doubt.

 

But she ain't Amy.

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