Political dumpster fire Part III Greg and Kerry Vs CR

[zeitgeist57]

So...first off, I feel I have a good understanding of western U.S. wildfires:

1) Wildfires are natural events during dry seasons ANYWHERE there is vast vegetation on the planet. (Happens every year in the Florida Everglades, too)

2) Too many people moving into areas that had been undeveloped for thousands of years. Buildings, roads, landscaping changing the ground for fire-spread potential.

3) Human activity (campfires, power lines, explosions) creating fires instead of natural events (like lightning).

4) Climate change affecting rainfall/groundwater/humidity levels

 

That all being said, it truly is sad that so many lives have been lost. I have to say that part of this issue is overpopulation in these fire zones where there hadn't been 100+ years ago.

 

BUT....TRUMP LOL. Can he not get a halfway intelligent thought across without sounding like a totally uninformed moron?

https://earther.gizmodo.com/trump-suggests-california-wildfires-can-be-avoided-by-r-1830516283

[greg1647545532]

The media is just being unfair to Trump by reporting his actual words. Totally unfair.

[wagner]

So...first off, I feel I have a good understanding of western U.S. wildfires:

1) Wildfires are natural events during dry seasons ANYWHERE there is vast vegetation on the planet. (Happens every year in the Florida Everglades, too)

2) Too many people moving into areas that had been undeveloped for thousands of years. Buildings, roads, landscaping changing the ground for fire-spread potential.

3) Human activity (campfires, power lines, explosions) creating fires instead of natural events (like lightning).

4) Climate change affecting rainfall/groundwater/humidity levels

 

That all being said, it truly is sad that so many lives have been lost. I have to say that part of this issue is overpopulation in these fire zones where there hadn't been 100+ years ago.

 

BUT....TRUMP LOL. Can he not get a halfway intelligent thought across without sounding like a totally uninformed moron?

https://earther.gizmodo.com/trump-suggests-california-wildfires-can-be-avoided-by-r-1830516283

 

My wife is a CNN addict and loves anti-trump porn, so I hear and see all the stupid stuff he says all the time. She reads his tweets and this other trash and looks at me like I'm supposed to get mad, and then asks, "well what do you think" like I'm going to defend him.

 

I finally told her that I really don't care what he said, the man is a fucking idiot.

[iwashmycar]

My wife does the exact same thing. I'm still happy he won the election. He's still an idiot.

[wagner]

My wife does the exact same thing. I'm still happy he won the election. He's still an idiot.

 

It's exhausting, but I'm nice about it.

[Otis Nice]

 

 

http://www.bitterrootbugle.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/directed-energy-weapons--300x300.jpg

 

 

 

In on 1.

[RedRocket1647545505]

A large part of the reason for the fires that happen out West is that they aren't allowed to happen naturally, because humans obviously don't want them burning their shit down. It's a very natural cycle for lightning to start a fire, thin the shit out of everything, and then new growth starts very soon afterwards. They're actually GOOD for the forests, as backwards as that sounds.

 

Where we run into problems is that we constantly put them out, because we're trying to save our neighborhoods, and the forests get thicker and thicker and thicker. Then, when a dry spell comes along, something sparks, and you get these massive, uncontrollable rage-monsters.

 

I also don't believe that fire management is covered by the Federal .gov. I believe its up to the States to combat these [very] expensive fires on their own. I don't think it's too big of a stretch to say that the States, individually, don't have the funds to adequately fight these things.

[greg1647545532]

I read that 60% of California is under some type of federal land management program. A lot of the west is like that, because most of the land out there that the federal government bought/stole from Mexico is useless and there was no reason for the states to want it. So they do have a roll to play. I also read that the majority of the "largest" fires in California happened predominately on federal land, however since that land is mostly unpopulated none of them are all that deadly/destructive and therefore we don't really hear about them. However, as Californians have expanded closer and closer to that federal land, those fires are suddenly spreading to populated areas. Hard to say what responsibility the federal government has in that regard, since it's people's own dumb fault for moving to such a dry, dangerous area, but I also don't think it's the federal government's place to point fingers in times of crisis. They should supply the help that's needed, and deal with the poor decisions after the fact. Donald "it's never my fault" Trump apparently disagrees.

[RedRocket1647545505]

I read that 60% of California is under some type of federal land management program. A lot of the west is like that, because most of the land out there that the federal government bought/stole from Mexico is useless and there was no reason for the states to want it. So they do have a roll to play. I also read that the majority of the "largest" fires in California happened predominately on federal land, however since that land is mostly unpopulated none of them are all that deadly/destructive and therefore we don't really hear about them. However, as Californians have expanded closer and closer to that federal land, those fires are suddenly spreading to populated areas. Hard to say what responsibility the federal government has in that regard, since it's people's own dumb fault for moving to such a dry, dangerous area, but I also don't think it's the federal government's place to point fingers in times of crisis. They should supply the help that's needed, and deal with the poor decisions after the fact. Donald "it's never my fault" Trump apparently disagrees.

 

 

Yea, it's Federal land. Mostly National Forests and Bureau of Land Management. The money to combat the fires though, comes out of the State's budget.

 

I also wouldn't, personally, consider the land useless. If you're an outdoorsy person (I am), then you should truly appreciate the gift that is National Forest Land and BLM land. It's yours, as a public land owner, so you should really take some time in your life to enjoy it. I've been on several hunting trips out West on public land and it's simply amazing out there.

 

One huge criticism I have against the Right, is their general desire to dump these lands back into the States' laps. The States can't afford to fight the fires on them, let alone afford all the rest of the upkeep that they generally require. What generally ends up happening is the States take them back, end up not being able to afford them, and then sell them off to pay for other things. Folks like you and I never get a crack at them because they're sold to billionaires and corporations. And once they're gone, they're gone.

 

I also agree with you that these morons who move into the middle of the forest really have nobody to blame but themselves. I figure it's on-par with the folks who live along the coast who get railroaded by a Cat 4 hurricane. What did you really expect to happen? Still, I do feel for them.

[CRed05]

A large part of the reason for the fires that happen out West is that they aren't allowed to happen naturally, because humans obviously don't want them burning their shit down. It's a very natural cycle for lightning to start a fire, thin the shit out of everything, and then new growth starts very soon afterwards. They're actually GOOD for the forests, as backwards as that sounds.

 

So I grew up in a climate very similar to California, and we also had annual wild fires in the winter time. After a fire everything was black, but as soon as it rained, shit turned green as if there never was a fire. In fact, there is a species of trees that requires fire for it to reproduce. A lot of the time the fires were started by firefighters on purpose because they had control over it.

 

I've always wondered why Cali has such a big problem with wildfires. The house I grew up in was on a hill, right next to a nature preserve and every year it would burn, but it was never an issue. One year I remember it coming really close to the house, it was touching our brick wall. So my mom called the fire department and they came and put it out just enough to stop going towards our house any further.

[RedRocket1647545505]

After a fire everything was black, but as soon as it rained, shit turned green as if there never was a fire. In fact, there is a species of trees that requires fire for it to reproduce.

 

 

That area in Northern Cali (Camp Fire?) will be overrun with Tule Elk come next Spring. The animals love it also. The area I hunted in Idaho this year completely burnt to a crisp in 2015, and it was really starting to green up when I was there.

[SpaceGhost]

Wait, So Gary is meeting with fire departments about “blue lasers” that are clearly folks smartphones flash is on when taking pics at night in the dark?!

[CRed05]

Cards Against Humanity buys land along Mexican border to block wall

Donald Trump is a preposterous golem who is afraid of Mexicans. He is so afraid that he wants to build a twenty-billion dollar wall that everyone knows will accomplish nothing. So we've purchased a plot of vacant land on the border and retained a law firm specializing in eminent domain to make it as time-consuming and expensive as possible for the wall to get built.

https://www.wkrn.com/news/cards-against-humanity-buys-land-along-mexican-border-to-block-wall/1605903901

 

So I used to mock the wall. I thought it was just a silly thing Trump used to get stupid hilljacks to vote for him. Then I actually learned about how we really do need a new wall. The wall in place today, that was built in the 90s out of old scrap metal from Vietnam, is a joke. It's weak, flimsy, been repaired and patched way too many times.

 

I suggest Card Against Humanity does a little research of their own.

[cdk 4219]

I read that 60% of California is under some type of federal land management program. A lot of the west is like that, because most of the land out there that the federal government bought/stole from Mexico is useless and there was no reason for the states to want it. So they do have a roll to play. I also read that the majority of the "largest" fires in California happened predominately on federal land, however since that land is mostly unpopulated none of them are all that deadly/destructive and therefore we don't really hear about them. However, as Californians have expanded closer and closer to that federal land, those fires are suddenly spreading to populated areas. Hard to say what responsibility the federal government has in that regard, since it's people's own dumb fault for moving to such a dry, dangerous area, but I also don't think it's the federal government's place to point fingers in times of crisis. They should supply the help that's needed, and deal with the poor decisions after the fact. Donald "it's never my fault" Trump apparently disagrees.

 

California is broke from silly decisions such as this. If you feel so strongly about giving, there is nothing stopping you from donating. Or should it be someone else that helps?

[greg1647545532]

California is broke from silly decisions such as this. If you feel so strongly about giving, there is nothing stopping you from donating. Or should it be someone else that helps?

 

Nothing I just quoted makes any sense to me, especially in context of my post. Can you spell it out for me?

[brent1976]

I talked to a fire fighter that explained this to me. All the township fire departments try to do controlled burns in areas that need them to happen. They keep an eye on all the area they cover and set up when and where they need to do them. Most are in very remote areas of federal land that are unpopulated. People that live anywhere remotely close to where they say they need to do a controlled burn start petitions and lawsuits to stop them because they don’t want to smell smoke for a day or two and stop it from happening. The fire departments have to fight for a couple years to get it to happen but by then it takes way longer to get it cleared enough for it to be an actual controlled burn. They get so far behind on controlled burns because of the people fighting it that they can’t catch up because there’s always a fight. Everywhere gets overgrown then giant fires happen that take weeks to put out and burn into populated areas. They try and if they could do controlled burns when and where they need to they couldn’t stop them all but they could stop most.

[Otis Nice]

Also hard for firefighters when they put one out then the gubmint lasers another one somewhere else.

[Geeto67]

A friend of mine wrote this pretty good article for Outside magazine on the myths surrounding the forest fires, many of which are being presented in this thread as fact. This is worth a read:

 

https://www.outsideonline.com/2368571/why-you-cant-rake-america-great-again

[cdk 4219]

Nothing I just quoted makes any sense to me, especially in context of my post. Can you spell it out for me?

 

If you feel that much about it, you can certainly donate some money or time to the cause, or you can complain and say someone else should help. Pretty simple, maybe too complex for you?

[greg1647545532]

If you feel that much about it, you can certainly donate some money or time to the cause, or you can complain and say someone else should help. Pretty simple, maybe too complex for you?

 

No I got that part, but what does this have to do with anything I said, though? What point do you think I was making, and how is this a relevant response to that point?

 

Let's break down my post. I think I was making these points:

 

1) A lot of California actually is either federal land or is the responsibility of the federal government.

 

2) Californians have not done themselves any favors by expanding into areas with frequent existing wildfires.

 

3) The federal government shouldn't point fingers when providing emergency assistance.

 

4) Trump is an asshole for doing exactly that.

 

What do you disagree with in those 4 points that caused you to lash out at me for some perceived financial injustice?

[Otis Nice]

A friend of mine wrote this pretty good article for Outside magazine on the myths surrounding the forest fires, many of which are being presented in this thread as fact. This is worth a read:

 

https://www.outsideonline.com/2368571/why-you-cant-rake-america-great-again

 

Proof.

Edited November 21, 2018 by Otis Nice

[10phone2]

great. I likely ended up on a watch list reading that. lol

[Otis Nice]

great. I likely ended up on a watch list reading that. lol

 

You're welcome. :lolguy:

[cdk 4219]

If you want to discuss the causes of wildfire, you have to discuss climate change.

 

Funny how he skims over the too many people and hones in on addressing climate change as an actual direct cause for these fires. Please don’t mention the fact that the state has nearly tripled in population in 50 years. More things to burn and more people to burn them makes more fires.

[Mace1647545504]

If you want to discuss the causes of wildfire, you have to discuss climate change.

 

Funny how he skims over the too many people and hones in on addressing climate change as an actual direct cause for these fires. Please don’t mention the fact that the state has nearly tripled in population in 50 years. More things to burn and more people to burn them makes more fires.

 

Now don't confuse the issue by bringing up facts

I think it was the force