☆~PoLOLtics~☆

[Otis Nice]

The secret service spent more renting golf carts at Mar A Lago while chasing Trump around the golf course.

 

That makes it ok.

[Mallard]

That makes it ok.

My point was that he was silent then, but outraged now, and I didn't even have to point out how much the secret service had to pay to rent rooms and buy food at Trump resorts.

 

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[Otis Nice]

My point was that he was silent then, but outraged now, and I didn't even have to point out how much the secret service had to pay to rent rooms and buy food at Trump resorts.

 

Fair enough.

 

For the record I think they're both buffoons. Different types perhaps but buffoons none the less.

[Mace1647545504]

I never said I was outraged, I just pointed out a fact. You sounded outraged.

What does outrage me is the way the socialist..aaaa I mean the democratic party is spending money.

 

Clay..I didn't make the statement, so I don't have to prove or disprove what was said.

[Furloaf]

Government wastes money who would have thunk?

 

Would have been cheaper to just buy a couple to keep there. Hell even to build a secure garage to house them in.

 

Dems seem to have dropped the walls don't work mantra. After they put one up around the Capitol and now Bidens refuge or whatever. And gave Israel a billion dollars to build one (that was bipartisan).

[99FLHRCI]

My point was that he was silent then, but outraged now, and I didn't even have to point out how much the secret service had to pay to rent rooms and buy food at Trump resorts.

 

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https://www.cnn.com/2021/10/23/politics/joe-biden-weekends-away/index.html

 

Biden has vacationed almost twice as much as Trump at the same period in their respective presidencies. I seem to remember lots of outrage during Trump also (Hence why it only took 15 seconds to find an article about it.) The only part I found surprising about all this is that the article making Biden look worse was on CNN.

[greg1647545532]

I seem to remember lots of outrage during Trump also

 

Not outrage, just exasperation. See, Trump rose to political prominence by attacking Obama for every dumb thing that came into his head on Twitter, from being a secret Kenyan citizen to playing golf or basketball or for flying to Hawaii (where, you know, he was actually from). Trump also said during the campaign that if HE were elected, he would be too busy presidenting to play golf at all, let alone how often that bastard Obama hit the links.

 

And then he gets elected and he spends way more time golfing than Obama ever did. All the shit he scored points with his braindead followers by attacking Obama for, he did the exact same things.

 

So we throw our hands up in exasperation.

 

Anyway, I'm sure y'all can dig up all of Biden's tweets where he said he wouldn't ever play golf or take vacation because he'd be too busy being the Best President Ever, or all the tweets Biden made attacking Trump for playing golf. Eh?

[Mallard]

https://www.cnn.com/2021/10/23/politics/joe-biden-weekends-away/index.html

 

 

 

Biden has vacationed almost twice as much as Trump at the same period in their respective presidencies. I seem to remember lots of outrage during Trump also (Hence why it only took 15 seconds to find an article about it.) The only part I found surprising about all this is that the article making Biden look worse was on CNN.

I'm not surprised this is on CNN because (though left leaning) they are not the democratic propaganda mouthpiece that Trump supporters have been convinced it is. It's not the lefts equivalent of FOX News; you would never have found a story criticizing Trump on FOX.

 

Democrats have no problem criticizing other dems, and they will. This is what normal discourse looks like in a functioning democracy. Contrast that with the tribalism you see on the right...

 

FWIW, in principle I don't have a problem with the president taking weekends away from Washington. I believe there is an ethical issue when those weekends away result in hundreds of thousands to millions of tax dollars being funneled into the presidents businesses. The security of the president is a high priority, and they will have protection for life, so if that results in security improvements to a personal residence it's understandable. With Trump you also had a guy who campaigned on calling Obama the Golfer in Chief, and claimed he "wouldn't have time to golf if he's elected president," only to golf more than Obama.

 

[EDIT: looks like Greg beat me to most of this]

[Mallard]

 

What does outrage me is the way the socialist..aaaa I mean the democratic party is spending money.

 

Can you name what new spending that has been passed under Biden that you disagree with? I'm genuinely curious.

 

Do you believe the Trump tax cuts that went largely to the wealthy and corporations, and resulted in massive shock buy backs with no "trickle down" to middle class workers was money well-spent?

 

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[99FLHRCI]

Do you believe the Trump tax cuts that went largely to the wealthy and corporations, and resulted in massive shock buy backs with no "trickle down" to middle class workers was money well-spent?

 

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While I don't agree with those tax cuts, I do think they trickle down. As has been evidenced by many talking heads, increasing taxes on companies with increase prices. Companies are not going to settle for eating those costs. The bad thing is, when the cuts do come, the savings is not proportional downstream. Big companies are already seeing increased costs which they pass on to the consumers and we pay more. Same thing will happen if they raise taxes or close loop holes. Unfortunately, other then not supporting as much as feasible, I don't know any way to combat that.

[Mallard]

While I don't agree with those tax cuts, I do think they trickle down.

 

When taxes go up the price increase trickles down to the consumer. When taxes go down the savings do not.

 

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[99FLHRCI]

When taxes go up the price increase trickles down to the consumer. When taxes go down the savings do not.

 

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I sure could afford a lot more things and toys last year.

[greg1647545532]

I sure could afford a lot more things and toys last year.

 

Do you have any data, or shit, even anecdotes, maybe about things that you bought post-2018 after the Trump tax cuts that were cheaper than the were pre-2018?

 

Or are you just saying that you personally had more money because the government increased the deficit in order to lower your tax burden?

[Otis Nice]

Not outrage, just exasperation. See, Trump rose to political prominence by attacking Obama for every dumb thing that came into his head on Twitter, from being a secret Kenyan citizen to playing golf or basketball or for flying to Hawaii (where, you know, he was actually from). Trump also said during the campaign that if HE were elected, he would be too busy presidenting to play golf at all, let alone how often that bastard Obama hit the links.

 

And then he gets elected and he spends way more time golfing than Obama ever did. All the shit he scored points with his braindead followers by attacking Obama for, he did the exact same things.

 

So we throw our hands up in exasperation.

 

It's almost as if politicians, ya know...lie. Weird.

 

Anyway, I'm sure y'all can dig up all of Biden's tweets where he said he wouldn't ever play golf or take vacation because he'd be too busy being the Best President Ever, or all the tweets Biden made attacking Trump for playing golf. Eh?

 

While I agree Trump was an idiot and should have stayed off of Twitter Biden wouldn't know how to use Twitter if he had a daily briefing about it every morning. By the afternoon he'd be back to thinking his phone is a Casio calculator.

 

His claim to fame is def his live appearances. I, for one, have enjoyed them. They're hilarious.

[greg1647545532]

It's almost as if politicians, ya know...lie. Weird.

 

Trump's not a politician, he's a businessman. I like him because he's not politically correct. He says what he means and means what he says, and doesn't sugarcoat it. Drain the swamp. Drain the swamp.

 

Just admit that Trump supporters were gullible rubes, the dumbest voters America could muster, and let's move on.

[Otis Nice]

Trump is most definitely a politician.

 

pol·i·ti·cian

/ˌpäləˈtiSHən/

noun

 

- a person who is professionally involved in politics, especially as a holder of or a candidate for an elected office.

 

- a person who acts in a manipulative and devious way, typically to gain advancement within an organization.

 

 

Just admit that Trump supporters were gullible rubes, the dumbest voters America could muster, and let's move on.

 

I agree and in the same breath will say the same about Biden's voters. IMO the same can be said about every single person who insists the two party system is the only way to vote and just slings mud back and forth getting nowhere as well. Both parties suck. They just suck a little differently. Not a lot differently but just enough to give peons the fervor and testicular fortitude needed to argue politics (esp online). What's the definition of insanity again? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

Let's just admit this and move on.

 

http://www.columbusracing.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=1009&pictureid=9874

[greg1647545532]

I agree and in the same breath will say the same about Biden's voters.

 

Let's address the false equivalency, because I said Trump supporters and you said Biden voters. I voted for Biden but he's doing slightly worse than a mediocre job and I'm willing to admit that. I really don't have any particular beef with people who, likewise, held their nose and voted for Trump because he was the "better of two bad options" or whatever.

 

But people fucking love Trump, and they are the dumbest fucking people. They still have signs up all over the place, I still see MAGA hats, they still have Trump rallies. People worship that dumbfuck.

 

Come on, you and I need to live in the same reality on this. There is no Biden equivalent of the Trump phenomenon. You cannot say they are the same.

[Otis Nice]

Let's address the false equivalency, because I said Trump supporters and you said Biden voters. I voted for Biden but he's doing slightly worse than a mediocre job and I'm willing to admit that. I really don't have any particular beef with people who, likewise, held their nose and voted for Trump because he was the "better of two bad options" or whatever.

 

Fair enough. I can respect that admission. Apologies for my choice of words. I'm taking a break from working after rushing out to my shop where dad found a roof panel missing and we hastily had to throw a tarp up in a down pour and now I'm home eating chili and trying to keep my 3 year old entertained. lol

 

The latter part of this paragraph is really what I was getting at. Folks want to keep voting for the lesser of two evils (...which means they're both evil and we should vote for neither but I digress) and then back that person as if they ARE a flagrant supporter.

 

So you chose to vote for, in your opinion, the lesser of two evils but back the guy as if he's God's gift to America. If he's doing, again according to what you wrote here, just slightly better than mediocre why all the arguing in here? Why not just go, "yeah, he's doing some stupid shit, but I think overall he's doing better than Trump."? Why all the shit throwing? Why is it that every time someone points out a Biden faux pas you immediately jump on them and bash Trump...and sometimes them? As you would say: I'm genuinely curious. You definitely SEEM to be a "yuge" supporter and fan.

 

But people fucking love Trump, and they are the dumbest fucking people. They still have signs up all over the place, I still see MAGA hats, they still have Trump rallies. People worship that dumbfuck.

 

Yeah, there are some extremists. Good thing that doesn't happen anywhere else ever.

 

You would never catch me in a hat with a politicians name on it. Nothing on my vehicles either. I won't even put out a yard sign. I'll only do that for sports. lol

 

Come on, you and I need to live in the same reality on this. There is no Biden equivalent of the Trump phenomenon. You cannot say they are the same.

 

Say who aren't the same? Trump and Biden? Sure i can. I think they're both a terrible choice for the leader of our country and in that way they are exactly the same.

 

Are you talking about the fanbase behind each? Sure I can. The only difference is the Trump folks are out and about and wear it proudly (don't tell them I related them to being out and proud. They'll get all angry and whiney) while the dem's for 4 years littered my news feeds with anti-Trump shit and now are 100% silent. They DEF don't want to talk about Biden's shortcomings. They linked articles, gave their opinions, etc. IRL it's def tipped in Trump's favor but anti-Trumpers were AWFUL for 4 years.

 

...everyone is an idiots.

[greg1647545532]

So you chose to vote for, in your opinion, the lesser of two evils but back the guy as if he's God's gift to America. If he's doing, again according to what you wrote here, just slightly better than mediocre why all the arguing in here? Why not just go, "yeah, he's doing some stupid shit, but I think overall he's doing better than Trump."? Why all the shit throwing? Why is it that every time someone points out a Biden faux pas you immediately jump on them and bash Trump...and sometimes them? As you would say: I'm genuinely curious. You definitely SEEM to be a "yuge" supporter and fan.

 

Point out examples, by all means. I don't think I've acted the way you're suggested I act.

 

Look at this exchange for example. Mace does what Mace does, which is evidently get all his information from Yahoo! News and post random links here like everyone's favorite grandpa (hi Mace!). Even though he posted the link without any commentary, Mallard made the (probably correct) assumption that Mace didn't think taxpayers should be wasting money on Biden's beach house, so he pointed out that, you know, it's par for the course, because we taxpayers spent a lot of money for Trump to play golf.

 

Then 00TypeR says that he remembers "lots of outrage" about Trump. Well, I didn't bring up Trump, and I have no particular interest in defending Biden here, but I remember things different and the situations are different. And so that's all I did -- I addressed 00TypeR's memory about a particular bit of political discourse from 4 or 5 years ago, and how it doesn't equate to whatever dumb thing we're criticizing Sleepy Joe for on a Monday, because he's not the same level of dumbshit that Trump was.

 

So anyway, I guess I do that and you and some others here think I'm attacking people left and right as a brainless leftist, because there's no room for any nuance in politics and I must be every liberal stereotype in the books instead of someone who just really doesn't want to live in a country where Trump's particular brand of bullshit becomes the norm.

 

 

 

*IF* I were actually going to address the article Mace posted, I would say that being POTUS is hard, and that person deserves vacations and leisure time, and the amount of money we spend on secret service protection is a drop in the ocean, and I don't give 2 shits about any of it, and I wish people would stop talking about it. And, I'm guessing, you're 100% in agreement with all of that.

 

 

eta: Just want to add, I can say, in plain English, that I think Biden is slightly worse than a mediocre president. I'm fairly disappointed so far, because my low expectations haven't even been met. That is my position, I'm willing to say it, full stop. No trickery. But 2 pages from now everyone is going to ignore that and act like I have a Biden tattoo on my face. Because politics, and because CR.

[99FLHRCI]

Do you have any data, or shit, even anecdotes, maybe about things that you bought post-2018 after the Trump tax cuts that were cheaper than the were pre-2018?

 

Or are you just saying that you personally had more money because the government increased the deficit in order to lower your tax burden?

 

Inflation

2017 - 2.1%

2018 - 2.4%

2019 - 1.8%

2020 - 1.2%

2021 - 4.05% (first 9 months, last 5 have all been over 5%, highest since 1991)

 

Gas Sept

2017 - $2.64

2018 - $2.83

2019 - $2.62

2020 - $2.18

2021 - $3.17

[greg1647545532]

Inflation

2017 - 2.1%

2018 - 2.4%

2019 - 1.8%

2020 - 1.2%

2021 - 4.05% (first 9 months, last 5 have all been over 5%, highest since 1991)

 

Gas Sept

2017 - $2.64

2018 - $2.83

2019 - $2.62

2020 - $2.18

2021 - $3.17

 

This... doesn't seem to support your theory that corporations passed their tax savings on to the consumer.

[Otis Nice]

K. My bad.

 

...he's not the same level of dumbshit that Trump was.

 

Oh, I 100% agree with that. He's on a completely different style of dumbshit. He isn't even aware he exists half the time let alone where he is.

 

So anyway, I guess I do that and you and some others here think I'm attacking people left and right as a brainless leftist...

 

You're using the most recent conversation as a small sample. I and others have spoken of the bigger picture.

 

...because there's no room for any nuance in politics and I must be every liberal stereotype in the books instead of someone who just really doesn't want to live in a country where Trump's particular brand of bullshit because the norm.

 

Do you not see the slight hypocrisy here? Even a little bit?

 

 

 

 

Glad we have shit but a new type of shit just like Trumpshit was different but not different than Obamashit was different but not different as Dubyashit...

 

Insanity.

[greg1647545532]

You're using the most recent conversation as a small sample. I and others have spoken of the bigger picture.

 

I know, but every time you and I actually dissect an issue or an exchange you seem to soften your opinion in the moment. And then a couple pages later I'm back to being an unreasonable caricature. *shrug*

 

Do you not see the slight hypocrisy here? Even a little bit?

 

And in some cases, it doesn't even take a couple of pages.

[Otis Nice]

I know, but every time you and I actually dissect an issue or an exchange you seem to soften your opinion in the moment. And then a couple pages later I'm back to being an unreasonable caricature. *shrug*

 

I'm sorry you feel that way. I've never said you were unreasonable that I recall. I have asked questions to gain understanding and pointed out some things that stood out to me. Maybe I have. I might not recall. My memory is not great.

 

And in some cases, it doesn't even take a couple of pages.

 

It was a genuine question. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[greg1647545532]

I'm sorry you feel that way. I've never said you were unreasonable that I recall.

 

You say I attack people and sling shit. Is that reasonable in your eyes?

 

 

It was a genuine question. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

I think my posts reflect frequent nuance. Do I see the irony in saying all Trump supporters are gullible rubes while bemoaning a lack of nuance in politics? From a certain point of view, yes. From another point of view, this is a message board and I'd rather save my nuance for things that require more nuance, and I'm not going to lose sleep about painting Trump supporters with a broad brush. I'm only human, and I'm sure you make generalizations from time to time.