For all those who oppose Arizona's immigration law

[Casper]

http://dailycaller.com/2010/05/21/lets-adopt-mexicos-fair-and-respectful-immigration-policy/

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/05/20/calderon-criticism-arizona-law-overlooks-mexicos-tough-immigration-policy/

BLITZER: So if people want to come from Guatemala or Honduras or El Salvador or Nicaragua, they want to just come into Mexico, they can just walk in?

CALDERON: No. They need to fulfill a form. They need to establish their right name. We analyze if they have not a criminal precedent. And they coming into Mexico. Actually…

BLITZER: Do Mexican police go around asking for papers of people they suspect are illegal immigrants?

CALDERON: Of course. Of course, in the border, we are asking the people, who are you?

And if they explain…

BLITZER: At the border, I understand, when they come in.

CALDERON: Yes.

BLITZER: But once they’re in…

CALDERON: But not — but not in — if — once they are inside the — inside the country, what the Mexican police do is, of course, enforce the law. But by any means, immigration is a crime anymore in Mexico.

BLITZER: Immigration is not a crime, you’re saying?

CALDERON: It’s not a crime.

BLITZER: So in other words, if somebody sneaks in from Nicaragua or some other country in Central America, through the southern border of Mexico, they wind up in Mexico, they can go get a job…

CALDERON: No, no.

BLITZER: They can work.

CALDERON: If — if somebody do that without permission, we send back — we send back them.

Don't expect something from us that you won't give to us.

[chevysoldier]

But we, the Federal government, will roll over and try to please them.

[fusion]

I'm not a fan of the Arizona law, but I HATE illegal immigration. I think there is too much opportunity for it to be exercised in a manner that is unconstitutional. However I think every illegal should be deported and if you are breaking into our country and attempt to run from Border Patrol, military or police while doing it you should be stopped by any means necessary even if it means shooting and killing.

[Casper]

I'm not a fan of the Arizona law, but I HATE illegal immigration. I think there is too much opportunity for it to be exercised in a manner that is unconstitutional. However I think every illegal should be deported and if you are breaking into our country and attempt to run from Border Patrol, military or police while doing it you should be stopped by any means necessary even if it means shooting and killing.

So then you are a fan of the Arizona law.

Have you read it?

http://www.scribd.com/doc/31005811/SB-1070-Signed

[YSR_Racer_99]

Synopsis: Mexico doesn't tolerate anyone coming into their country w/o checking them out first.

PLEASE take a moment to read this. Only takes a minute.

THIS needs to be all over the media, but its not being mentioned at all:

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1005/19/sitroom.01.html

Jeff

[bambam]

http://dailycaller.com/2010/05/21/lets-adopt-mexicos-fair-and-respectful-immigration-policy/

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/05/20/calderon-criticism-arizona-law-overlooks-mexicos-tough-immigration-policy/

Don't expect something from us that you won't give to us.

I think you missed the important bit. Perhaps because it negates the argument somewhat..

CALDERON: If -- if somebody do that without permission, we send back -- we send back them.

BLITZER: You find them and you send them back?

CALDERON: Yes. However, especially with the people of Guatemala, we are providing a new system in which any single citizen from Guatemala could be able to visit any single border (INAUDIBLE) in the south. And even with all the requirements, he can or she can visit any parts of Mexico.

BLITZER: I ask the questions because there's an argument that people in Arizona and New Mexico and -- and Texas, they say they're only trying to do in their states what Mexico itself does in the southern part of Mexico.

CALDERON: I know. And that is a very powerful argument. But that is one of the reasons why we are trying to change our policy.

And let me be frank, Wolf. In the past, Mexican authorities were in a -- in a -- in an unfortunate way in the treatment for immigrants. But now we are changing the policy. We changed already the law. And that is different today. We are trying to write a new story, talking about immigrants, especially coming from Central American countries.

(END VIDEO TAPE)

I was stopped and checked in New Mexico by Immigration officers many years back. I think they had no reason to stop me, but they did. They frisked me, did an on the spot background check, removed every item from my car (which was basically everything I owned as I was relocating at the time) and searched them. I was on the side of the highway with my wife for several hours. God Bless the USA.

I had done nothing wrong, so I had nothing to fear. Yes? But it was still pretty scary.

When that kind of thing starts happening to everyone, regularly, maybe they will reconsider their support for these invasive laws. Probably not though, and by then it will be too late.

[Todd#43]

I'm not a fan of the Arizona law, but I HATE illegal immigration. I think there is too much opportunity for it to be exercised in a manner that is unconstitutional.

Is it unconstitutional for a cop to ask you for your driver's license when he pulls you over?

Is it unconstitutional for the broad at the airline ticket counter to ask for your ID when you purchase an airline ticket?

Is it unconstitutional for Rahgib at the Quickie Mart ask you for ID when you buy your 12 pack of beer?

Is it unconstitutional for a cop to ask to see your CHL when you're being detained?

If all of that is acceptable, why is it unacceptable to ask someone who appears to be here illegally for proof that they aren't?

Illegal Aliens dont have any constitutional rights, fuck-o.

[CoolWhip]

^^

[Todd#43]

I think you missed the important bit. Perhaps because it negates the argument somewhat..

I was stopped and checked in New Mexico by Immigration officers many years back. I think they had no reason to stop me, but they did. They frisked me, did an on the spot background check, removed every item from my car (which was basically everything I owned as I was relocating at the time) and searched them. I was on the side of the highway with my wife for several hours. God Bless the USA.

I had done nothing wrong, so I had nothing to fear. Yes? But it was still pretty scary.

When that kind of thing starts happening to everyone, regularly, maybe they will reconsider their support for these invasive laws. Probably not though, and by then it will be too late.

Just curious - did this occur at a border crossing from Mexico into the States? If so, random searches at border crossings are pretty typical. It happens at the airports all the time too.

If it happened in another scenario, why did you consent to the search?

[max power]

Illegal Aliens dont have any constitutional rights, fuck-o.

Finally, a sig worthy quote from Todd Petty!

[fusion]

So then you are a fan of the Arizona law.

Have you read it?

http://www.scribd.com/doc/31005811/SB-1070-Signed

I have. The problem is the original wording wasn't strict enough. They have since corrected the wording to be more in line with what I think is acceptable, but I would be hesitant to support a group that thought the way it was passed originally was in anyway helpful. It was like they were willing to scrape away a little at the constitution. Even their own law enforcement agencies expressed concern over the original wording.

Now as long as they apply the new version of the law equally I have no problems, but I'm not holding my breath.

Is it unconstitutional for a cop to ask you for your driver's license when he pulls you over?

Is it unconstitutional for the broad at the airline ticket counter to ask for your ID when you purchase an airline ticket?

Is it unconstitutional for Rahgib at the Quickie Mart ask you for ID when you buy your 12 pack of beer?

Is it unconstitutional for a cop to ask to see your CHL when you're being detained?

If all of that is acceptable, why is it unacceptable to ask someone who appears to be here illegally for proof that they aren't?

Illegal Aliens dont have any constitutional rights, fuck-o.

Just when I thought you couldn't get any more fucking stupid.

[Todd#43]

Just when I thought you couldn't get any more fucking stupid.

Explain to me then, oh wise one, how its different?

[Todd#43]

Finally, a sig worthy quote from Todd Petty!

Yay.

Now I'm all famous and shit.

[fusion]

Explain to me then, oh wise one, how its different?

Tell me this, how does one 'appear to be here illegally'?

The color of their skin?

An accent?

The way they dress?

It's all or nothing. You either question everyone, equally, and every time in situations where appropriate or don't do it at all.

[Todd#43]

Tell me this, how does one 'appear to be here illegally'?

The color of their skin?

An accent?

The way they dress?

It's all or nothing. You either question everyone, equally, and every time in situations where appropriate or don't do it at all.

By reading the law it would appear that when detained during the course of lawful contact you have to show:

1. A valid Arizona State Driver's License
   
2. A valid Arizona Nonoperating Identification Card
   
3. Tribal ID
   
4. Resident Alien ID
   
5. Virtually any other government issued ID
   

Have you ever been outside of this country? Get stopped their without a passport or their form of Green Card (for any reason) and you're FUCKED, period. Why should we be any different?

Oh boooo hoooo.....we dont want any "profiling" going on. However, if a person matches the DESCRIPTION of someone that committed a felony, and a cop see him/her they're going to get stopped, questioned, etc. Sometimes, they even catch the badguy that way. Maybe we should stop that too? I mean, its not fair to stop all the people that look like the bad guy, but arent - right Mr. Allornothing?

Fuck that.

[YSR_Racer_99]

Bam Bam,

"They can cross the border and visit any place in Mexico". Okay. So Mexico KNOWS they're in the country. They're not opening the gateway on their borders, especially not to "just Guatemalans". They're controlling who comes across their borders.

OPEN BORDERS is part of the effort to merge Canada, USA, and Mexico into one country.

What exactly do Canada and Mexico bring to the table? Why in the world would we want to become one with those countries?

I will never be ashamed or apologize for being an American. American by birth, Texan by the grace of God. I don't believe that all countries are equal. I believe that America is great because it was founded by brilliant men with (for the most part) a belief in God. The ones who weren't strong believers didn't slight those who were. Open borders with another country will not accomplish anything good for America. We used to be able to go down to Laredo, walk across the bridge, and spend the day in Mexico. No longer. Its a warzone, like Juarez. Its not a good place, and letting that spill over into our country doesn't benefit us at all. Calderon wants to open the borders because his folks will come here, work, then send most of their money back to Mexico. Its a win-win for Mexico, and a lose-lose for us (except for employers exploiting cheap labor). What did I read? Phoenix is #2 in kidnappings now?

Obama needs to stop apologizing for America. He needs to stop people like Calderon when they stand on the White House lawn and denigrate America. If you still refuse to see the "real Obama", his staff, and their agenda to "change" America, its because you don't want to see what he's doing.

It ain't good.

[YSR_Racer_99]

I have to show my DL and insurance when I get pulled over, but an illegal doesn't, and can't even be asked to? Does this make sense in any way?

When citizens have a barcode on their foreheads, and the illegals don't, will it be okay to ask them why they don't have one?

[Hwilli]

Can someone clarify something for me.

Originally I thought this "new" law was giving police the power to pull you over at their digression just to check if you are an illegal.

Now I have been told that they are only allowed to check your status after a legitimate stop.

If it is the former, than I don't agree we should open that door. If it is the later, then what the hell is the difference?

If you are pulled over and cannot produce a valid drivers license you go to jail. If you are a citizen or not. If you are found to be an illegal, then you SHOULD be being deported. Seems pretty common sense...

Of course as I have been saying for years, common sense isn't so common anymore.

H

[fusion]

By reading the law it would appear that when detained during the course of lawful contact you have to show:

1. A valid Arizona State Driver's License
   
2. A valid Arizona Nonoperating Identification Card
   
3. Tribal ID
   
4. Resident Alien ID
   
5. Virtually any other government issued ID
   

Have you ever been outside of this country? Get stopped their without a passport or their form of Green Card (for any reason) and you're FUCKED, period. Why should we be any different?

Oh boooo hoooo.....we dont want any "profiling" going on. However, if a person matches the DESCRIPTION of someone that committed a felony, and a cop see him/her they're going to get stopped, questioned, etc. Sometimes, they even catch the badguy that way. Maybe we should stop that too? I mean, its not fair to stop all the people that look like the bad guy, but arent - right Mr. Allornothing?

Fuck that.

Most countries aren't as diverse as ours.

WTF does stopping someone who matches a description of a crime have to do with profiling? You realize they can't stop someone that matches a description based solely on skin color/ethnicity right?

So according to your reading EVERYONE has to show one of those when "detained during the course of lawful contact of a lawful stop"? Or do they get to pick and chose who they question?

[Todd#43]

Can someone clarify something for me.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/31005811/SB-1070-Signed

Read it for yourself.

[Todd#43]

Most countries aren't as diverse as ours.

Diversity is fucking myth. If you're a citizen, you're an American. Go to Germany sometime, or Italy, or Spain and tell me again about the "diversity" they DON'T have

WTF does stopping someone who matches a description of a crime have to do with profiling? You realize they can't stop someone that matches a description based solely on skin color/ethnicity right?

Ahh, but if a black guy with braids did the crime, they aren't going to be pulling over blonde haired, blue eyed guys in the interest of "fairness".

So according to your reading EVERYONE has to show one of those when "detained during the course of lawful contact of a lawful stop"? Or do they get to pick and chose who they question?

Dude, have you really never, ever been detained by the police? Ever been pulled over while driving? Yes, you REALLY do have to identify yourself and PROVE who the fuck you are. If you dont/wont/cant they'll haul your ass off until they can prove who you are. Did you forget the whole "Henry-Gates-Cambridge-Cops-are-Stupid-Teachable-Moment-Beer-Summit Issue with your boy last year?

[curby]

Illegal Aliens dont have any constitutional rights, fuck-o.

I approve this message.

[Hwilli]

http://www.scribd.com/doc/31005811/SB-1070-Signed

Read it for yourself.

Ok, it's the second of the two. Then common sense dictates EVERYWHERE should be doing this.

[Todd#43]

Ok, it's the second of the two. Then common sense dictates EVERYWHERE should be doing this.

Actually, the Federal Gov't. should be taking care of this everywhere.

Obviously, they aren't.

[Hwilli]

Actually, the Federal Gov't. should be taking care of this everywhere.

Obviously, they aren't.

Possibly, but your local law enforcement is going to be the first contact. It will be they who make the stop, and determine the legal status of the individual.

If the person is deemed illegal, then they should be sent somewhere to be held until they are deported. This could be either Federal or State run. I personally am NOT a supporter of large government, but whatever it would take to correct the problem.

I was actually thinking about this the other day. I was always told to be very careful when going to Mexico not to get on the wrong side of the law, as they were very corrupt and would not hesitate to throw you in some rat invested prison cell and throw away the key. America is too soft. If you could instill this same fear into illegals. Perhaps when the are caught put them in a facility that meets the bare minimum of human rights organizational standards. As it stands now, they don't have any reason to fear getting arrested and deported, other than it is a hassle.

Just my 2 cents.

H