Disclaimer Posted August 15, 2011 Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 I get the feeling that IP smokes pole. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imprez55 Posted August 15, 2011 Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 (edited) It is being done now, because there is no constitutional carry. The system for sure isnt perfect and it never will be, what our founding fathers tried to lay out for us was a great plan on paper and for the most part works very well. The right to bear arms especially in public is a touchy subject, I feel an armed society is a polite society but folks doing so need to be educated and experienced is all.All ready too many folks on the roads that can't drive, now imagine if they all had guns too!!!!!!Why is the right to bear arms in public any different then the right to bear arms in private? We are further entering a world where there is less and less distinction between the two anyway. That's not really a good comparison at all for a couple reasons: a gun is used in a situation where that is your total focus, people drive because they have to get places regardless of if they know they are a bad driver or not whereas a person who does not want/feel responsible to have a gun won't use it, among others.You're about to enter a firearms debate with an Ohioan that doesn't agree with barring felons from carrying firearms. I find that to be a stupid regulation as well.+1 Edited August 15, 2011 by imprez55 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disclaimer Posted August 15, 2011 Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 @ ip Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pokey Posted August 15, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 Now I understand why they called you a dumb fuck liberal. If you want to put that regulation on yourself go right ahead, if you think that makes you better than others. Stay the hell away from my family with your liberal ideas of regulating their ability to protect themselves. If they are careless and harm others without cause punish them but don't assume to know their level of competency based on an arbitrary skills test. How would you like it if you fell below the level of competency for a skills test and had your ability to protect you and your family taken away? Believe me I can find people who think your skills with a firearm are woefully inadequate.I find that to be a stupid regulation as well.Except I am not, just have a conflicting opinion is all. So no regulations should be set in place for firearm carry, what about anything else for that matter? I am no better than anyone, what gives you the assumption that I feel that way? Do I have more experience than some folks do with guns, yeah I probably do...... but also have allot less than others as well. Have you spent much time on a gun range, a gun shop or a gun show......many folks have no idea what they are doing, but they can learn is all I am saying. It isnt about being a good marksman, it is more along the lines of gun safety, gun handling, dealing with law enforcement, knowing your weapon, and educating people about guns....that is all I am trying to say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disclaimer Posted August 15, 2011 Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 If you let everyone have a gun, liberals will have guns too We don't want that. You should have to recite the Pledge of Allegiance WITH the 'under God'-part to prove you're a patriot and conservative capable of handling a firearm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pokey Posted August 15, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 If you let everyone have a gun, liberals will have guns too We don't want that. You should have to recite the Pledge of Allegiance WITH the 'under God'-part to prove you're a patriot and conservative capable of handling a firearm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pokey Posted August 15, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 We hear you. Loud and clear. The problem is how exactly do you regulate "smartness"? Who should be the arbiters of firearm intelligence? The government? No' date=' they're barely functional themselves. The military? No, this isn't Vietnam. The police? LoLoLoLoLoL... Um, I don't think so. So, what's it going to be? Also, what if my neighbor happens to fall just a bit shy of your "eligibility" requirements? Are you going to follow him everywhere he goes to make sure he's protected? If not, why do you get to carry a gun, and he doesn't? What makes you so privileged? You still haven't given us any numbers, facts, statistics to support your stance.[/quote']Not my eligibility requirements, not my job to do so. Will bet that many in law enforcement would tend to disagree with everyone being allowed to carry too. I am only privileged because I went through the proper channels to get a CHL, but that is the only legal way at this point of doing so. I am not a statistics guy and never have been, more of a gut feeling kinda guy. Not sure who would be a good smart police, not sure anybody is really qualified. There are many experience levels when it comes to firearms, it can go from none to a ton....all I would like to see is something more than little to none before carrying is all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Punk Posted August 15, 2011 Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 I am no better than anyone, what gives you the assumption that I feel that way?I assume that you have a CHL and you feel that your level of competency allows you to have one if not you would turn it in until you have the correct amount of proficiency. This makes me think because you have stated others shouldn't receive a CHL unless they are trained that you are better than they are and that your life is more important than theirs. You would like to keep firearms away from them as a means to protect them. I find training and competency levels to be so arbitrary when speaking of firearms that it is laughable. I have been in gun shops that employ off duty LEOs and hate their level of firearms handling. A similar argument can be held for riding a motorcycle. Not everyone wants to use a motorcycle the same therefore not everyone needs to have the same level of proficiency to commute or pleasure ride. Not being able to ride as well as others doesn't make you inferior to them, it doesn't make you enjoy your experiences any less and it shouldn't be any of my business it you don't meet the same level of competency that I have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pokey Posted August 15, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 Well' date=' if all you have to go on is "gut feeling", then you're wasting time and energy fighting a fight that probably needs no fighting. [/quote']Nah I am for sure not fighting, nothing I can do about it anyways......and like my opinion matters. A fine line has gotta be drawn somewhere, looks like it has been drawn for now. Whatever happens concerning future gun laws, I will just roll with it. I feel if we all do our part to make things better no matter how big or small that is, it can only help us all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Punk Posted August 15, 2011 Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 Well' date=' if all you have to go on is "gut feeling", then you're wasting time and energy fighting a fight that probably needs no fighting. [/quote']I don't agree that numbers mean anything pertaining to this argument because if they didn't support my stance I wouldn't care. There are several reasons for this but mostly numbers aren't applied correctly. Thousands of people die in motor vehicle accidents yet I would never advocate for them to be banned. Thousands of people die from firearm wounds yet I would never try to ban them either. A discussion doesn’t need numbers to make it legitimate since they can be manipulated to support your argument with no real meaning. Liberals do this stupid shit all the time and I expect Jrmiii to bring some into this discussion any time now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pokey Posted August 15, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 I assume that you have a CHL and you feel that your level of competency allows you to have one if not you would turn it in until you have the correct amount of proficiency. This makes me think because you have stated others shouldn't receive a CHL unless they are trained that you are better than they are and that your life is more important than theirs. You would like to keep firearms away from them as a means to protect them. I find training and competency levels to be so arbitrary when speaking of firearms that it is laughable. I have been in gun shops that employ off duty LEOs and hate their level of firearms handling. A similar argument can be held for riding a motorcycle. Not everyone wants to use a motorcycle the same therefore not everyone needs to have the same level of proficiency to commute or pleasure ride. Not being able to ride as well as others doesn't make you inferior to them, it doesn't make you enjoy your experiences any less and it shouldn't be any of my business it you don't meet the same level of competency that I have.Yeah I do have a CHL, but that just makes me legal. I know what you are talking about concerning folks that you would think are qualified firearms handlers, now imagine those that have none? The motorcycle analogy is a very good one, I like that allot. My life is not more important than anyone, I would love for us all to be as safe as possible everywhere we go......and I think that could be obtainable. I am not the best marksman but can get the job done, have grownup around guns my whole life and have taught my son as well. We all have the right to be safe, and I feel the first step of doing so is informing/instructing/teaching folks about guns. I would never pass up an opportunity to teach somebody what I have learned, or better yet pass them on to somebody else who knows even more. Guns are not dangerous at all, only people......but we can all get better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pokey Posted August 15, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 Thread is now locked over there, I'm sure I will be banned soon. Unfortunate if I am, regardless if I decide to even go back anyways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Punk Posted August 15, 2011 Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 I was an armorer (This does not mean that I am proficient with a weapon.) so I issued and received weapons along with running firing lines; the level of incompetency among those who have training is staggering. This has nothing to do with the fact that the means of which you choose to protect yourself or your competency to do so should be my decision. You have given me no reason to believe that it would be or should be. Are you doing yourself an injustice by not learning to be more proficient? Maybe, maybe not as I don't know what you want to achieve with your training. If you harm others by being incompetent then you should be punished but I shouldn't have to prove I am competent to protect myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Punk Posted August 15, 2011 Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 I never said numbers would mean anything. I just wanted him to look for them' date=' from reputable sources. They aren't out there, and I know it. I wanted him to prove to me that this wasn't about his perception of the regulation... and he couldn't. It always boils down to someone having a bad feeling. Knee jerk legislation is all about trying to protect someone by finding the quickest way to appease those crying the loudest.[/quote']Why didn't you warn me that you were trying to be a dick by setting him up for failure. I would have let it play out for you a little longer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pokey Posted August 15, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 I never said numbers would mean anything. I just wanted him to look for them' date=' from reputable sources. They aren't out there, and I know it. I wanted him to prove to me that this wasn't about his perception of the regulation... and he couldn't. [b']It always boils down to someone having a bad feeling. Knee jerk legislation is all about trying to protect someone by finding the quickest way to appease those crying the loudest.Having a bad feeling can keep you alive, have you not ever had a bad feeling, and what do you mean by my "perception of the regulation"? I am not crying loud about anything, just looking for good honest feedback more than anything else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pokey Posted August 15, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 (edited) For sure not a Neocon.......thanks for asking though. I think I am more of a "Centrist". Edited August 15, 2011 by Pokey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Punk Posted August 15, 2011 Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 Your feeling of the situation is wrong and without merit. When others in our country are allowed to protect themselves without regulation nothing bad happens. Why do you have so little faith in us buckeyes? Show me where not regulating has caused problems pertaining to 2nd amendment rights to defend ourselves and we can start a discussion. Until then your feelings are unfounded and shouldn’t be considered as a valid argument. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pokey Posted August 15, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 Your feeling of the situation is wrong and without merit. When others in our country are allowed to protect themselves without regulation nothing bad happens. Why do you have so little faith in us buckeyes? Show me where not regulating has caused problems pertaining to 2nd amendment rights to defend ourselves and we can start a discussion. Until then your feelings are unfounded and shouldn’t be considered as a valid argument.Is this toward me? If so I am 110% all for protecting oneself especially at home, it could just be a bit unsettling with everyone carrying is all. Could it work......I sure hope it can if it were to happen, do I have a bad feeling in my gut......at the moment yes I do "just being honest". And I have all the faith in my Buckeye Brethern, that is why I still live here going on 40 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pokey Posted August 15, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 Sure' date=' I've had bad feelings. Your perception of the regulation... means your perception of the regulation. It's not knowledge, because you haven't done your homework. I never said you were crying loud, either. I meant that euphemistically. You didn't ask for feedback. You said you were being attacked for your differing views and it appeared to me as though you were venting, or looking for like-minded allies.[/quote']Isnt everything a perception one way or another? Yes I was venting, and yes I was hoping to find at least a few that might see my point I was trying/still trying to make. I just want this country to be safe and successful again, and it starts and ends with its people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Punk Posted August 15, 2011 Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 Is this toward me? If so I am 110% all for protecting oneself especially at home, it could just be a bit unsettling with everyone carrying is all. Could it work......I sure hope it can if it were to happen, do I have a bad feeling in my gut......at the moment yes I do "just being honest". And I have all the faith in my Buckeye Brethern, that is why I still live here going on 40 years.Yes, directed at you. Could it work, yes, it has for many states so you don't have to worry if it will. It's okay to have gut feelings that are wrong that is why you have us adults are here, to guide you through your misguided naive feelings. It's all good and if you ever feel the need to make public your desire to take away rights from people just ask again we will be happy to tell you how wrong you are again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Punk Posted August 15, 2011 Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 I just want this country to be safe and successful again, and it starts and ends with its people. If you want this country to be successful again you can start by not regulating them so much and allowing them to succeed or fail on their own. This is the struggle for the people to pursue or overcome not the governments. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crb Posted August 15, 2011 Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 I have never been on the Buckeye Firearms site but I imagine it is similar to the OFCC site. I have looked around that site and couldn't join in any of the discussions because of too many restrictions. Like I stated earlier it is a great site for information but if it's a discussion you are looking for it's a very poor source for it. A good site for discussion doesn't mean that everyone has to agree with you and I don't mind at all being told I'm wrong in someone else’s opinion. I usually have a decent understanding of an issue if I’m making my take of it public, if not I’ll ask what are the facts I need to know if I haven’t formed an opinion. This is the internet and nothing is being solved by discussing issues. It may help to solidify or weaken your thoughts on an issue but nothing is getting solved. If I call you an idiot for your beliefs it doesn’t make it a fact so why get bent out of shape if others disagree with you?It's getting as bad as OFCC. I tend not to agree with everything, but overall they are an excellent resource for the current law. I've had lots of questions since Ohio's firearm are so screwry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crb Posted August 15, 2011 Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 OFCC is a good resource. Just don't let 'em smell the atheist on you. (if you are one' date=' that is)[/quote']Lol how did you know that was an arguument I had with them because religion discussion is against the rules there, but they don't consider atheism a religion. Fyi I'm not an atheist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crb Posted August 15, 2011 Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 Every group has a couple bad apples that make them look bad. Look at how I was treated here when I stated my opinion about the "anointed one"! I was attacked just like you were there so this site is not immune to the personal attacks and name calling. I am in between on the idea of Constitutional Carry. I like the training requirement, although I think most people would seek proper training. I came from Indiana where all you have to do is pass a background check to get a permit no training required. I did not seek in person training, but I did a lot of research, and online training, I also didn't carry a firearm until I was proficient with it at the range. Of course I am not the norm so people will carry without ever firing a firearm. I can see both sides of the argument personally. Also look at how Harley riders get treated here. I have many many problems with OFCC the religion topic is just the top of the iceberg. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Casper Posted August 15, 2011 Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 Give us a link so we can join and fuk with the Overlordz.Damn it. It's locked. I really wanted to have some fun in that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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