The death of roadracing on US TV

[Moto-Brian]

So are the AMA races shown in other countries? Or does no one at all get to watch? How the hell is nascar watched so dam much???

NASCAR is watched so much because the fan base. We are all wanting road racing on TV for sure. But, we are a minority. The sport is not well followed and we can all crack on NASCAR all we want (Although I am a fan to a degree as I respect a lot of engineering and driving), but at the end of the day, it is all about the almighty dollar.

The racing is still going to be on TV. The article isn't 100% factual as it misleads us to think there will be ZERO coverage. But, NBC and CBS's sport channels are working on deals. AMA supposedly has three events due.

But, the bottom line is this... AMA killed road racing. Like they did with Supermoto... They have essentially a program series that is successful in SX/MX. Yes, they are organized by the AMA, but promoted and televised and everything via another group. But, what they do, how they promote and what they bring as far as a "show" creates gobs of fans. The stadiums are packed, the outdoors are well attended and even if AMA road racing got HALF of that attendance, they'd get more sponsors and more recognition of the sport.

But, they don't. So, we get screwed on race coverage.

But, to compare and complain about NASCAR, look at it with an unbiased set of eyes. The fan base and the number of people that follow, spend and attend NASCAR events makes it one of the top motorsport sports out there. Period. Certainly the biggest in this country.

We suffer due to the fact that there isn't money in it. We see it in sponsors falling off, riders paying for rides, TV coverage at stupid hours and now, no AMA coverage possible...

[madcat6183]

NASCAR is watched so much because the fan base. We are all wanting road racing on TV for sure. But, we are a minority. The sport is not well followed and we can all crack on NASCAR all we want (Although I am a fan to a degree as I respect a lot of engineering and driving), but at the end of the day, it is all about the almighty dollar.

The racing is still going to be on TV. The article isn't 100% factual as it misleads us to think there will be ZERO coverage. But, NBC and CBS's sport channels are working on deals. AMA supposedly has three events due.

But, the bottom line is this... AMA killed road racing. Like they did with Supermoto... They have essentially a program series that is successful in SX/MX. Yes, they are organized by the AMA, but promoted and televised and everything via another group. But, what they do, how they promote and what they bring as far as a "show" creates gobs of fans. The stadiums are packed, the outdoors are well attended and even if AMA road racing got HALF of that attendance, they'd get more sponsors and more recognition of the sport.

But, they don't. So, we get screwed on race coverage.

But, to compare and complain about NASCAR, look at it with an unbiased set of eyes. The fan base and the number of people that follow, spend and attend NASCAR events makes it one of the top motorsport sports out there. Period. Certainly the biggest in this country.

We suffer due to the fact that there isn't money in it. We see it in sponsors falling off, riders paying for rides, TV coverage at stupid hours and now, no AMA coverage possible...

All this and not one single poke at me? I feel like we aren't brah's anymore.

[Moto-Brian]

There are something like 6 shows about cake. With all the terrible cable channels I got to think that someone would pick up AMA. FUEL, G4, ESPN 8 (The Ocho), something...

Again... It is about ROI, guys. People like reality TV. Simple. They don't know about motorcycles as much. We ride, race and breath motorcycles on here. But, we are a HUGE minority. There are VERY few riders vs people that drive cars, that golf, that play sports. Think about football in this country and baseball.

How many kids play either of these sports in school? Of the number of kids in school, how many ride motorcycles? There's your issue.

In europe, soccer and racing are the baseball and football here. It is in their DNA. We had a little of that with the NASCAR stuff and why it is so attractive to people nationwide here. It is part of our history as Americans. Running whiskey and drag racing. It was a mainstay in the US and WAAAAAY moreso than motorcycles...

We are a minority. If the sport cannot pay or provide attraction to sponsors, why would a cable company want it? Face the facts - until AMA gets it in their head to follow the formula of say, SX/MX, we will see road racing decline more and more until it just is all club racing...

AMA used to be attractive. It used to be chock full of factory support and deep in talent. Now? It is really glorified club racing. It doesn't have the exposure it once had, it doesn't have the flow of money it once had and it certainly has talent in the ranks, but where do they go once they peak? The seats are full at the factory level (what is left) and the only way to excel in one's dream as a road racer in this country is to race overseas.

AMA can fix it. Maybe. But, they should at least try. BUT, even if they come up with something, understand one simple thing. The motorcycle industry took a HUGE hit and while we didn't get bail outs to survive, it is bouncing back slightly in the US. HOWEVER, the rest of the world is suffering and the economic hit we all experienced is hitting Europe right now. The motorcycle companies are global and not US only. The issue is marketing and budgets and racing is part of Marketing. Until cash flow gets better, no matter what the series brings, the manufacturers can only pick what they feel is the best ROI and for the idea of racing, that is SX/MX right now.

[Moto-Brian]

All this and not one single poke at me? I feel like we aren't brah's anymore.

I thought we were talking about racing. Not pretend racing... Are you really a racer? Wasn't too sure...

Boom goes the dynamite.

Love ya, Mads... You know that!!

[madcat6183]

Damn, no love for me today, I haz failz. I pretend to be fast but Iz just slow.

Haha, I can't wait for this season, so much win to come.

[r1crusher]

If you promise me a HJ I'll let you follow me around Beaverun again this year.

[Tpoppa]

Again... It is about ROI, guys. People like reality TV. Simple. They don't know about motorcycles as much. We ride, race and breath motorcycles on here. But, we are a HUGE minority. There are VERY few riders vs people that drive cars, that golf, that play sports. Think about football in this country and baseball.

Then the AMA should get smart and create a reality show about young riders trying to qualify for a sponsored ride. UFC blew up after TUF. Sure there was a fan base before TUF, but UFC's revenue & ratings exploded after TUF.

Edited February 12, 2013 by Tpoppa

[Mary#17]

AMA used to be attractive. It used to be chock full of factory support and deep in talent. Now? It is really glorified club racing.

Yup, couldn't agree more.

[madcat6183]

If you promise me a HJ I'll let you follow me around Beaverun again this year.

Nah it's okay, my radiator is fixed now so my bike will actually be running right. Well until Craig takes it out and tries to break it lol.

Beaver is the track I need to hit most this season though, only being there once, I wasn't able to shave as much time as I wanted to Sunday. Can I still give you a HJ tho?

[r1crusher]

Well, you'll only be there twice this year so I wouldn't worry about it a whole lot.

And yes, I never turn down a HJ.

[cOoTeR]

Then the AMA should get smart and create a reality show about young riders trying to qualify for a sponsored ride. UFC blew up after TUF. Sure there was a fan base before TUF, but UFC's revenue & ratings exploded after TUF.

Thatd be cool but probably wont get as much interest.

[blue03636]

Nah it's okay, my radiator is fixed now so my bike will actually be running right. Well until Craig takes it out and tries to break it lol.

Beaver is the track I need to hit most this season though, only being there once, I wasn't able to shave as much time as I wanted to Sunday. Can I still give you a HJ tho?

Didn't I find the problem with yours?

[cOoTeR]

Didn't I find the problem with yours?

His hj?

[blue03636]

Yes, he's all thumbs

[r1crusher]

You'll want to stay away from his FJ's then.

[Tpoppa]

The AMA's problem is they are not creative at marketing their product. NASCAR is a marketing machine. They pull sponsors and dollars from every possible angle.

If you've never seen a NASCAR race, I bet you could still recognize Jeff Gordon or Earnhardt Jr. Very few non-AMA fans have ever heard the names Josh Hayes or Danny Eslick.

[Mary#17]

NASCAR is very good at marketing their product but they are struggling as well. Attendance is down and the ratings are nowhere near where they used to be. They fell into the same traps that many other forms of racing fall into - Greed. They started building tracks that were identical, one mile slightly banked....... you get it and they are eroding their base. F1 is doing the same thing by bidding tracks out to the highest bidder but who the frigg wants to go to Korea? At least Ecclestone’s daughters will be taken care.

The AMA did the same thing by messing with the manufacturers - during a down economy no less -and made road racing in the US more of a hassle than it was worth. The AMA races were actually doing fairly well for a while there. The Mid-Ohio race used to be the biggest race weekend for the track and one of the biggest for the series. Now it’s a joke.

Roadracing is a highly niche sport in the US. It's never been super popular so you really need to keep your message clean and not alienate your base. The AMA didn't do that.

The only reason Supercross isn't faltering is dirt bikes still resonate with the general population more than sportbikes do.

Mary

[TRMN8TR]

I understand the marketing debate in the NASCAR vs. AMA/roadracing in general.

What I don't get is...how do I word this without my biased dislike of NASCAR.....why do people enjoy watching cars go around in a circle, where races can be won or lost by not being the best driver but having the fastest pit stop, but are not interested in close racing action where riders/drivers turn left and right? A superbike racer hanging off his bike inches from the ground at 100+ mph is way more interesting to me than than a car going around in circles. Late-braking into a corner to make a pass is way more exciting than watching a driver hanging back, conserving fuel and tires so they don't have to make that last pit stop, and then passing a bunch of cars in the pits. Need I go on? I think it would be so much easier to market that, but it's still not being done?

And people will watch anything that is a "reality" show, so make some B.S. show to promote AMA and start doing a little marketing...Get road racing involved as a sport in the X-games or some crap like that. 5-10 lap sprint races around some short track that gets peoples attention. Have lots of close-ups on the umbrella girls. Have a reality show about building a superbike from showroom floor to race ready. Put it on a dyno and show the results, people love all that "before and after" bullcrap on TV. Shit, AMA needs to hire me to do their marketing.

[Mary#17]

You can drink yourself into oblivion and see the whole track without ever having to get up and still know what's going on?

Most people watch TV as a fantasy release. They can envision themselves playing football or driving their Grand National around like a NASCAR driver but very few people understand or can ever contemplate putting a knee on the ground.

Mary

[Moto-Brian]

If you promise me a HJ I'll let you follow me around Beaverun again this year.

Why would he go for that gig? He's gonna be following everyone he races against...

[blue03636]

Why would he go for that gig? He's gonna be following everyone he races against...

Not 100% true, Nick will be there.

[Tpoppa]

What I don't get is...how do I word this without my biased dislike of NASCAR.....why do people enjoy watching cars go around in a circle, where races can be won or lost by not being the best driver but having the fastest pit stop, but are not interested in close racing action where riders/drivers turn left and right?

The short answer is that the races are almost always close. With 5 laps left the winner is still in doubt & lots drivers still have a chance at 1st place. The fans of those drivers still think their guy can win.

Would you rather see Mladin lap the field of Eslick beat up Herrin for 20 laps?

It takes more skill to ride a Superbike, F1 cars are faster, but NASCAR rules make the races close...restrictor plates...aerodynamic limits, cautions that bunch up the field, etc.

[Moto-Brian]

I understand the marketing debate in the NASCAR vs. AMA/roadracing in general.

What I don't get is...how do I word this without my biased dislike of NASCAR.....why do people enjoy watching cars go around in a circle, where races can be won or lost by not being the best driver but having the fastest pit stop, but are not interested in close racing action where riders/drivers turn left and right? A superbike racer hanging off his bike inches from the ground at 100+ mph is way more interesting to me than than a car going around in circles. Late-braking into a corner to make a pass is way more exciting than watching a driver hanging back, conserving fuel and tires so they don't have to make that last pit stop, and then passing a bunch of cars in the pits. Need I go on? I think it would be so much easier to market that, but it's still not being done?

And people will watch anything that is a "reality" show, so make some B.S. show to promote AMA and start doing a little marketing...Get road racing involved as a sport in the X-games or some crap like that. 5-10 lap sprint races around some short track that gets peoples attention. Have lots of close-ups on the umbrella girls. Have a reality show about building a superbike from showroom floor to race ready. Put it on a dyno and show the results, people love all that "before and after" bullcrap on TV. Shit, AMA needs to hire me to do their marketing.

It relates more. The cars tug at heart strings. Again, you guys are all missing one key ingredient - motorcyclists are a minority vs. car owners. You were 16 and look around the group of 16 year old kids and count the number of motorcycles. Kids want cars, they grow up with cars, they see cars, they get it in the system at an early age.

I'm a car guy, passionate for the car racing and have a love for them. The sounds of a V8 as a kid at the track was all I needed and I was already wanting to race cars at an EARLY age. race cars and toys, etc.

Yes, my kids are around bikes and want to race bikes and love them. Toys, clothing, what we do on weekends, they ride, etc. But, my son is a minority in that regard at school...

It's a show and NASCAR does a great job. It has a LOOOOONG history and again, was handed from generation to generation. My grandfather use to run moonshine, my dad street raced and drag raced, friends of our family were road race car guys. It was all about cars for me growing up. I didn't get into bikes until I was 18...

Cars are part of our growing up and life here in the US. Big V8 powered American Muscle. NASCAR plays on that and they do a damn good job.

Yes, they are slacking in attendance and you can blame greed, but it is the economy. People have to make a decision. Pay big bucks on the show (Travel, gas, food, hotel, etc) and the gate fees, food at the track, strinkets they buy, etc. OR, do they stay home?

One major issue with even the NFL is that even though the sport still is strong, more and more people watch on TV vs going. NASCAR on TV is easier and almost as close to the action as one can get. I got to admit that I like watching MotoGP on TV rather than at the track. The show on the road is tough as I love the atmosphere and the smell and sounds, but watching the race from a grandstand sucks nuts.

Another issue with road racing is that it isn't an easy viewing experience. You can see maybe a handful of turns. Then, you wait. TV allows full viewing. It shows replays, it shows slow motion and how things happened or works. It's such a better TV package than in real life for someone that isn't a fan - yet.

SX/MX is different. You can see everything at once. They also make it a show - like NASCAR. The show is what makes you want to come back.

I live 20 minutes from Mid-Ohio and have been at the AMA races since 1989. Every year. Raced AMA there, raced club there, done track days. I actually am bored out of my mind watching the racing there. It is too much a part of my life and if I can't do it, it makes me yawn. But, I watch an SX race start to finish and it is SOOOOO much better in person. Same with NASCAR and NFL games.

Anyways, want this to change? They need to get sponsorship. They need to get the right people running the marketing efforts. We need more exciting road racing websites like you see in SX/MX. We need drama, action, movement from team to team by riders that means something. Hayes could go to Yosh tomorrow and nobody would be that shocked. They'd know he still wax everyone.

Then the classes. Superbike is a joke. It should be unobtainable stuff, exotic, amazing. The riders and teams should be all factory and close racing. WSBK basically. It's 5 guys that are pulled away from everyone else and then the rest of the top ten are semi fast guys and 10-20th are club guys. Terrible.

600 is where it is at. The young pups are hungry and fast! They want to prove they are worth something and it shows. 600 DSB and SS should be the classes recognized as premium.

But, I think Superstock needs to come back. More of the racers believe this also. Get rid of HD as it is not viewed as a serious class. It's looked at the same way they looked at the 883 classes way back when. Ditch it for Superstock and watch the young pups from 600 SS swing a leg over a liter bike and race each other. Then, the factories can develop teams to accept the young pups and grow the rider base in Superbike. Basically, model what was working great back in say, 1999 or similar.

But, it will not be overnight. It won't be anytime soon, either. It is at a cross roads and I fear it may be a while before it gets turned around.

Rant over...

[grapesmuggler27]

Why would he go for that gig? He's gonna be following everyone he races against...

Not if I end up picking up another bike

[natedogg624]

I personally like what M1 did with the Big Kahuna rounds. If you weren't able to make it the atmosphere was much more optimistic with far more fan zone activities. I hope they are able to take over the marketing and promotion for the entire 2013 season.