Steve Butters Posted February 11, 2014 Report Share Posted February 11, 2014 (edited) Apparently RIP has a different meaning. Video makes these look pretty neat... Although after initial impact, the main slug seems awfully small... Too bad there's no guantanamo prisoners we can test these on to see real world application Edited February 11, 2014 by Steve Butters Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadTrainDriver Posted February 11, 2014 Report Share Posted February 11, 2014 If you have to shoot someone and that is what you're carrying, good luck convincing a jury that you're a responsible gun owner. God forbid I ever have to draw my weapon and shoot it to defend myself or my family...but if it ever happens, I'll have no problem explaining to my peers that it was fully my intent to cause death when I used said deadly force, as per outlined in Ohio's law. Sec 2901.05 (B)(1) Subject to division (B)(2) of this section, a person is presumed to have acted in self defense or defense of another when using defensive force that is intended or likely to cause death or great bodily harm to another if the person against whom the defensive force is used is in the process of unlawfully and without privilege to do so entering, or has unlawfully and without privilege to do so entered, the residence or vehicle occupied by the person using the defensive force. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CleaveTheGreat Posted February 11, 2014 Report Share Posted February 11, 2014 God forbid I ever have to draw my weapon and shoot it to defend myself or my family...but if it ever happens, I'll have no problem explaining to my peers that it was fully my intent to cause death when I used said deadly force, as per outlined in Ohio's law. Sec 2901.05 (B)(1) Subject to division (B)(2) of this section, a person is presumed to have acted in self defense or defense of another when using defensive force that is intended or likely to cause death or great bodily harm to another if the person against whom the defensive force is used is in the process of unlawfully and without privilege to do so entering, or has unlawfully and without privilege to do so entered, the residence or vehicle occupied by the person using the defensive force. I agree that you would be within your rights to carry this round and use it if necessary. However, I'm not going to take my chances when members of the jury and/or the prosecutor may be anti-gun. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Butters Posted February 11, 2014 Report Share Posted February 11, 2014 The name is a null point... Rip stands for radically invasive projectile... It's not like they're marketing rest in peace murder brand ammo... Just an acronym Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadTrainDriver Posted February 11, 2014 Report Share Posted February 11, 2014 I agree that you would be within your rights to carry this round and use it if necessary. However, I'm not going to take my chances when members of the jury and/or the prosecutor may be anti-gun. If members of the jury are anti-gun, they are not my peers.That's what lawyers are for Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CleaveTheGreat Posted February 12, 2014 Report Share Posted February 12, 2014 (edited) The name is a null point... Rip stands for radically invasive projectile... It's not like they're marketing rest in peace murder brand ammo... Just an acronym If members of the jury are anti-gun, they are not my peers.That's what lawyers are for Both valid points. But if there is something I can do to reduce my chances of being wrongly convicted, even if it only reduces them by .000001%, I'm going to do it. I happens to be my personal opinion that not carrying this ammo is one of those things. Edited February 12, 2014 by CleaveTheGreat 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bad324 Posted February 12, 2014 Report Share Posted February 12, 2014 Both valid points. But if there is something I can do to reduce my chances of being wrongly convicted, even if it only reduces them by .000001%, I'm going to do it. I happens to be my personal opinion that not carrying this ammo is one of those things.Completely agree. In my opinion there is no issue with the ammo or the name but because of the overly sensitive PC culture that is New America, it is something I could absolutely see a defense lawyer exploitingCan you imagine if Zimmerman used these in his gun? How do you think that outcome would've been if that was the case 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Butters Posted February 12, 2014 Report Share Posted February 12, 2014 They couldn't have said anything worse about Z already... It wouldn't have changed anything Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smccrory Posted February 12, 2014 Report Share Posted February 12, 2014 Completely agree. In my opinion there is no issue with the ammo or the name but because of the overly sensitive PC culture that is New America, it is something I could absolutely see a defense lawyer exploiting/quote]Yup, they'd try to establish a pattern of blood thirstiness to discredit a self defense plea. I'm not saying that's justifiable, but that is one of the reasons why Glaser Safety Slugs and Mag-Safes were named as such. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kawi kid Posted February 18, 2014 Report Share Posted February 18, 2014 A jury of your peers is a laughable phrase. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagr Posted February 27, 2014 Report Share Posted February 27, 2014 God forbid I ever have to draw my weapon and shoot it to defend myself or my family...but if it ever happens, I'll have no problem explaining to my peers that it was fully my intent to cause death when I used said deadly force, as per outlined in Ohio's law. Sec 2901.05 (B)(1) Subject to division (B)(2) of this section, a person is presumed to have acted in self defense or defense of another when using defensive force that is intended or likely to cause death or great bodily harm to another if the person against whom the defensive force is used is in the process of unlawfully and without privilege to do so entering, or has unlawfully and without privilege to do so entered, the residence or vehicle occupied by the person using the defensive force.Not ragging on you Brother nor am i whole heartedly disagreeing with you but IF you are involved in a shooting lets chat about this statement you made. Remember our training, actions, words and equipment need to convey out determination to protect life. That's right protect life, not the taking of it. . Sound backwards? I'm sure it does but I'm not just talking about preserving the bad guys life I'm talking about preserving yours. Everything that happens in that incident will be picked apart for the world to see. Every aspect your training, or lack of, will be picked apart and used against you. You meant to cause his death you say?People have been convicted of pre-meditated murder for having the thought ONE SECOND prior to a critical incident. You just typed it here and we all know the internet is forever. One second doesn't seem pre-meditated to me but I'm not the one who's going to put you away for most of your life. You hear people say "you never shoot to kill you only shoot to stop the threat." That doesn't mean kill it means what it says. I'll have no problem explaining if to a jury of my peers. I think we know the reality of this and it may well be the 2nd biggest problem you ever face. Imagine explaining to 12 uber religious soccer moms why you talked about and planned prior to the killing of little average hometown teen Johnny. They will bring everyone they can to say what a good but maybe misunderstood boy Johnny was and yes he may have been engaged in a home invasion to feed his pill addiction but Hey, he was just turning his life around when you killed him. You could have just let him leave? He's just a 6' 300# teddy bear. But no, you had to kill him with your Rest in Pieces death ammo shot from your super auto Glock 42! You were punishing all the people who did you wrong. That's why you have that "punisher" symbol all over your gun. Think I'm wrong? Think I'm being dramatic? Read some cases transcripts or watch the WEEKS of footage and this is the ridiculousness you will see. Again it's not "us" you have to convince its "them" as in your peers. I see you have quoted a snippet of code about Castle doctrine. Remember that only removed your duty to retreat. Your situation must meet the 2 other conditions.1. Not at fault. 2. A real belief of death or serious bodily harm. (immediate and otherwise unavoidable danger of death or grave bodily harm to the innocent)Just because someone is in your home illegally does not give you a reason to use deadly force. You must be able to convey your "reasonable fear". You must be able to explain how the intruder had AOJ. ABILITYOPPORTUNITYJEOPARDYAbility means that the other person has the power to kill or to cripple you.Opportunity means that the circumstances are such that the other person would be able to use his ability against you.Jeopardy means that the other person’s actions or words provide you with a reasonably-perceived belief that he intends to kill you or cripple you.You hear a bump in the night and grab your mossberg to investigate. As you come down the stair and turn the corner you come face to face with the intruder. You panic and press the trigger and punch a fist sized hole into their chest. Who was it? A drunk in the wrong house? An elderly senile neighbor? Your son sneaking back in from a party? A teenager with your blue ray player under his arm? How are you going to justify your actions? Did you meet the 2 conditions? Do any meet the AOJ? Nope. You can definitely be charged. You may get off but you have to live with your actions and most certainly face a civil lawsuit. As you can see this can go on and on and on. Let me get back to preserving life. At the point in a critical incident your firearm is clearing your holster you must know your next action is not about taking life it's about Saving life. At this point you are in Triage.You are deciding whose life can be saved based on the severity of conditions at hand and the limited resources available. You will most likely have seconds to decide what must be done. Whatever action you choose, if it is just, will have saved your life, your families life and your way of life. Choose wrong and you will have destroyed your life and the lives of your family should they survive.If all this sounds silly or foreign I advise you seek out literature on the subject and get some real training. It's not about carrying a gun to shoot people it's about carrying a gun and being responsibly trained and knowledgable in self defense law. It's about knowing what to do and when to do nothing. Believe me when I say doing nothing may be the hardest thing you'll ever have to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kawi kid Posted February 27, 2014 Report Share Posted February 27, 2014 I know, big surprise when I say I agree with Jagr. Wanna guess what sets our classes apart from other's? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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