Robin Williams Dead at 63

[JackFlash]

Never criticize a man until you've

walked a mile in his moccasins.

 

No one really knows the demons

we each personally fight inside of

our own heads.

 

.

[Pokey]

Every 65 minutes a veteran takes his/her own life. Fucking cowards.

 

 Hey........depression is a dark heartless bitch and who knows what other issues that he had going on in that head of his, but I stand by what I said that suicide is the cowardly way out, and that is regardless of what a person has been through. I had a long time childhood friend that killed himself a few years back, and everyone that he has left behind is still trying to cope with it, same can be said for an old work colleague of mine. There is nobody that I hold a higher regard for than our soldiers, but many are able to cope with their demons and endure......they don't give up. I did not say Robin Williams or people who end it all are cowards, I said it was a cowardly thing to do, so don't put words in my mouth and say that is what was intently meant. Soldiers, those in healthcare, law enforcement, firemen and EMT, think they don't see and deal with horrible shit every damn day? Everyone has a different threshold for dealing with shit and for how much they can take, but death is final and no coming back from that. Think what you want concerning what I said, you too are known to speak your mind and not have everyone agree with you either. There is no BEING for me to thank for doing what I choose or not choose to do, because choice is what we have.

[Calinazaret]

Suicide is selfish, IMO. When give. A choice, my family would always choose more time with me and often I've gone there and turned back out of consideration for my loved ones.

Cowardly though, I'm not sure. When you've battled demons all your life and choose not to anymore it's not always out of fear or lack of strength to go on.

When older people commit suicide I see it more as a desire to control ones own destiny rather than be at the mercy of it, which I have a great deal of respect for.

[jdonn]

I fucking hate it when people say this. It only displays an incredible amount of ignorance and lack of understanding for people in need of something they cannot find. The amount of sadness and hopelessness one needs to feel in order to, not only contemplate, but carry out the act of taking their own life is beyond our comprehension. Thank whatever being you worship for that lack insight. You are lucky to not know this kind of sorrow.

Well said man, very well said

[Tpoppa]

IMO, suicide can be both selfish and cowardly.  But, It can be other things too.

 

Unfortunately, I've had friends that have attempted it (real attempts, not a cry for help or attention), and one that followed through.  If I included freinds of friends, the list gets larger.

 

I wouldn't call suicide that resulted from mental illness cowardly, it's more complex than that.  But it can also be attempted out of fear of changing ones current situation (that easily could have been changed).  I think that is cowardly to a degree. 

 

It's pretty hard to to generalize on something that complicated.  It's not understood by very many. 

[Tpoppa]

I believe that calling it cowardly, on any level, is generalizing. 

I'm not going to argue with your point of view.  But that statement is also a generalization.  

 

A suicide that I was reasonably close to was out of fear of ending a bad marriage and starting a new life for them self.  Is that a scary proposition?  Yep.  But sometimes life is scary.  There was certainly sadness from being in a bad marriage, but nothing I would call clinical depression or mental illness.  

 

There are different reasons, circumstances, and types:

https://www.trinity.edu/mkearl/death-su.html

 

• egoistic: perhaps the most prevalent form in the United States, is the result of too little social integration, such as the suicide of a retired elderly widower;
• altruistic: the consequence of excessive integration, such as deaths of a Japanese kamikaze pilot during World War II or the self-sacrifice of an Indian suttee, where a widow throws herself upon her husband's funeral pyre;
• anomic: results from too little regulation or the shattering of one ties with society, such as with divorce or unemployment;
• fatalistic: this form is the result of excessive regulation coupled with high personal needs to control one's environment, as when a highly motivated college student takes his own life upon failing a critical exam.

[zx3vfr]

If someone wants to die, they should be able to do so. People need to learn to make peace with the god they worship and get over it if someone they know kills themself. Chances are if you claim to be close to someone who kills themself chancee are you should have recognozed the warning signs. Remember christian god forgives all sins. Jewish god only rewards you here on earth and muslim god flips a coin when you die, but chamces are all that happens is we rot in the ground. People meed to stop lookint for answers and move on. If you were really concerned about suicide youd wcall you congressman and tell him to do something about big pharma pushing suicide pills err anti depressents

[Bad324]

Dear brainwashed Catholics,

Read this and fucking learn something that isn't a made up story of hearsay from thousands of years ago. Suicide is bullshit and sucks bad for everyone. Chastising someone's choice is pretty ironic from a book that likes to use the "who cast the first stone" shit or whatever

http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/5672519?ncid=fcbklnkushpmg00000063

[Bad324]

Is alcoholism a disease or a selfish act?

Is drug addiction a disease or a selfish act?

Is smoking cigarettes a disease or a selfish act?

All instances are Choices an individual makes and can all ultimately lead to an untimely death. So start chastising those who die of these issues for being "selfish and cowardly" and see where that gets you.

Everyone thinks they understand why someone would do such a thing but 90% of people truly don't have the slightest clue and never will

[Bad324]

Hell you guys must think riding a motorcycle is absolutely a selfish act. Sitting your ass on that bike and hitting public roads is just another form of Russian roulette. That's ridiculously selfish

[Tpoppa]

I won't even try to catergorize this one, but you are free to...

 

I didn't know this person well, but he was a friend of the family.  45 year old father of 5 killed himself last year.  Kids range from 5 to 15 years old.  Mother is a stay at home mom that didn't work.  No known or at least no diagnosed mental illness, but it could have been there.

 

He lost his job and went over a year without being able to find work.  Was facing losing the family home and bankruptcy and the time of death.  I was told there were no warning signs.  The family was obviously devastated & in financial jeopardy.  The wife doesn't have much work history or skills to rely on.  The financial problems he was dealing with, are now worse for his family now that he isn't there.  This family has been heavily involved in their church.  The members of the church have helped them with food, etc, but that won't contniue forever.  They qualify for public assistance, but they are still in a tough spot.

[zx3vfr]

Like Brian said, those of us with families and ride motorcycles, are we selfish? To recieve some kind of euphoric gratification for what, 2 hours once a week?

 

Smokers, yep you're selfish, especially when you have kids because your kids go to school and smell like smoke. Remember less than half the population smokes now, and plus you're gonna die 15 years sooner.

 

Just think of all those selfish activites we do because one day your little girl isn't going to have a dad to walk her down the aisle when she gets married.

 

 

 

Ya imo suicide is the pussy way out, but it really doesn't matter because we all die and I fully support any legislation for assisted suicide.

[Josh1234]

Actually, I think Motorcycle riding is selfish. I owe it to my wife to live as long as possible and be as healthy as possible, and riding simply increases the chance that shit will happen.

 

Then again, EVERYthing is a calculated risk.  Like getting cancer from smoking.  

 

Some people think that soldiers, sailors, & marines shouldn't be allowed to be married.  After all, how can you give two conflicting oaths?  One saying you're willing to die for your country, and the other saying you'll do everything you can do to have a successful & healthy marriage?

[Bad324]

I won't even try to catergorize this one, but you are free to...

I didn't know this person well, but he was a friend of the family. 45 year old father of 5 killed himself last year. Kids range from 5 to 15 years old. Mother is a stay at home mom that didn't work. No known or at least no diagnosed mental illness, but it could have been there.

He lost his job and went over a year without being able to find work. Was facing losing the family home and bankruptcy and the time of death. I was told there were no warning signs. The family was obviously devastated & in financial jeopardy. The wife doesn't have much work history or skills to rely on. The financial problems he was dealing with, are now worse for his family now that he isn't there. This family has been heavily involved in their church. The members of the church have helped them with food, etc, but that won't contniue forever. They qualify for public assistance, but they are still in a tough spot.

That's somewhat similar to the situation with my step dad except my mom can work and take care of stuff and us 4 kids are all older and can take care of ourselves

[Tpoppa]

I'll bet that there are plenty on this forum that have been affected by the suicide of a friend or family member.  It's easy to take offense when words like "selfish" or "cowardly" are being tossed around when you can remember a loved one a similar situation.  Like I said earlier, you really can't generalize about something so complex.  Every situation is different. 

 

As far as RW...I feel for his friends/family, but I can't get too upset over a celebrity death  It only really affects us by increasing public awareness. 

[Sapphy]

IMO, suicide can be both selfish and cowardly.  But, It can be other things too.

 

Unfortunately, I've had friends that have attempted it (real attempts, not a cry for help or attention), and one that followed through.  If I included freinds of friends, the list gets larger.

 

I wouldn't call suicide that resulted from mental illness cowardly, it's more complex than that.  But it can also be attempted out of fear of changing ones current situation (that easily could have been changed).  I think that is cowardly to a degree. 

 

It's pretty hard to to generalize on something that complicated.  It's not understood by very many. 

 

 

Selfish is really not a good word for it.  From the suicidal person's point of view, they often see it as selfless.  They often feel like they are such a burden and such a drain on the people around them, they see their death a lifting the burden from the ones they love. 

[Bad324]

Selfish is really not a good word for it. From the suicidal person's point of view, they often see it as selfless. They often feel like they are such a burden and such a drain on the people around them, they see their death a lifting the burden from the ones they love.

Bingo! Not in all instances but many I'm sure

[Tigerpaw]

Some people think that soldiers, sailors, & marines shouldn't be allowed to be married.  After all, how can you give two conflicting oaths?  One saying you're willing to die for your country, and the other saying you'll do everything you can do to have a successful & healthy marriage?

 

I have never heard this before.  Interesting logic.

 

I personally disagree.  Can you really expect our armed forces to serve 10, 20, 30 years without being married.  Living in sin, depending on which flavor of religion you prefer?

 

I had already served 4 years before getting married.  My wife's mom was a career Airman.  She fully knew and accepted what we were committing to.   As did I.

 

/soapbox

[Josh1234]

I have never heard this before.  Interesting logic.

 

I personally disagree.  Can you really expect our armed forces to serve 10, 20, 30 years without being married.  Living in sin, depending on which flavor of religion you prefer?

 

I had already served 4 years before getting married.  My wife's mom was a career Airman.  She fully knew and accepted what we were committing to.   As did I.

 

/soapbox

 

I just saw so much heartache when I was in the Navy.  People who were getting ready to deploy when their wives had just had babies 3 days ago.  Or were due in three days.  Or whose kid was 2 and needed a mother or father as they enter second grade.  Or as a teenager.  I found myself thinking "that is not good parenting."  

 

And if you think about it, it's NOT good parenting to be completely absent for 6 months at a time (in the case of an overseas deployment).  Heaven forbid you're on a sub, and don't even get to make phone calls & send e-mails daily.  

 

And this is only talking about the absence.  It's infinitely worse when you realize that some military parents aren't just ABSENT, they're actually putting themselves in harm's way (often on purpose, intentionally) as part of their duties.  

 

But of course, it's crazy to expect people to serve without getting married or having kids.  We need to remember (and KNOW!) what we were fighting for, after all.

[Tpoppa]

When I was in the Marines, I knew a few guys who already had families when they joined.  I though it was an odd to have a family but choose to be away from them.

 

Also, lots of young kids who join the military are away from home fro the first time ever.  They get homesick and many rush to get married at very young ages.   

[Tigerpaw]

I just saw so much heartache when I was in the Navy.  People who were getting ready to deploy when their wives had just had babies 3 days ago.  Or were due in three days.  Or whose kid was 2 and needed a mother or father as they enter second grade.  Or as a teenager.  I found myself thinking "that is not good parenting."  

 

And if you think about it, it's NOT good parenting to be completely absent for 6 months at a time (in the case of an overseas deployment).  Heaven forbid you're on a sub, and don't even get to make phone calls & send e-mails daily.  

 

And this is only talking about the absence.  It's infinitely worse when you realize that some military parents aren't just ABSENT, they're actually putting themselves in harm's way (often on purpose, intentionally) as part of their duties.  

 

But of course, it's crazy to expect people to serve without getting married or having kids.  We need to remember (and KNOW!) what we were fighting for, after all.

Lots of heartbreaking family stories out there.  Some of them even occur outside the military.