open challenge

[Science Abuse]

Something that I'm trying for, so I figure why not get other people inone it and offer a trophy or something as prize.

Playing with these gliders and rockets has me thinking, and I have a goal...

 

Build something that will fly, unguided, for 1/2 mile....for under $20. I said "fly", not "shoot", so it must be able to glide when unpowered.

Any takers?

[Rotarded1647545491]

Did it in 7th grade.

 

http://www.acsupplyco.com/estes/estes_scissorwing.htm

 

Also made a rocket that ejected a hang glider canopy instead of a 'chute.

 

Give us something hard, beotch!

[Science Abuse]

.

Originally posted by Rotarded:

 

Give us something hard, beotch!

Will it go the distance, though? Those are designed to circle, anyways, not actualy cover distance. Made it doable so people would actualy try, beotch! tongue.gif But, you want it hard, I'll give it to ya hard;

Now its a full mile, 5280 horizontal feet, and a coupel new rules; 100% horizontal flight, and it has to go in a direction you point it.

[Guest timmybgood]

Originally posted by Rotarded:

http://www.acsupplyco.com/estes/estes_scissorwing.htm

 

wouldn't that be cheating though? granted you have to put it together, but its not really building your own craft.

 

in middle school we had a competition launching 2L pop bottles with water and air and see who's would take the longest to come down(most had parachutes). i won because i put wings from a styrofoam glider on it and it flew for about a 1/4 mile. i'm halfway there

[Science Abuse]

I could cheat, my girlfreinds dad has a PHD in aeronautical physics. But in all likelyhood he'd probably want to compete on his own. tongue.gif

 

 

edit; test fuselage #1 is being retired and is up to anyone wanting it, for free. 37" long, 33" wingspan. It flies, but I'm going a different direction with engine mounting. would make a good test bed.

 

[ 04. July 2005, 03:56 PM: Message edited by: The Stig ]

[RedRocket1647545505]

C6 Vet C6 and I have agreed to take up this challenge and thoroughly kick it's ass. Updates to come.

 

BTW, is there a deadline?

[Guest timmybgood]

Originally posted by The Stig:

my girlfreinds dad has a PHD in aeronautical physics.

so does my dad, but apparently it skips a generation...

[Rob1647545496]

Originally posted by Tater:

C6 Vet C6 and I have agreed to take up this challenge and thoroughly kick it's ass. Updates to come.

 

BTW, is there a deadline?

HAHA Game on.

[Rob1647545496]

Ok i have no idea why it posted it twice but while i'm editiong why doesn't my sig. show up all the time.

[Trouble Maker]

Originally posted by C6 VET C6:

...but while i'm editiong why doesn't my sig. show up all the time.

It only shows up the first time you post on the page.

[Rob1647545496]

Originally posted by Trouble Maker:

It only shows up the first time you post on the page.

oh thanks. i just recently got my sig working, now i know.

[Mowgli1647545497]

Originally posted by timmybgood:

so does my dad, but apparently it skips a generation...

Is this a Pro-Am type event?

 

I don't have a PhD, only have a couple Bachelors, Aeronautical Engineering and Astronautical Engineering... do you have to prove that $20 limit for new "off the shelf" components? It'd have to be new, because used for 20 bucks I could score some gyros, and an engine and enough fuel to put 10 miles down...

 

Materials only, or total cost?

 

No wait, I won't compete. Oh hey did I mention how swamped I am at work this summer? I can't play. But have fun and post pics!

 

*cough*

 

C# developers PM me.

 

*cough*

[Science Abuse]

Originally posted by Tater:

BTW, is there a deadline?

yes, the deadline is...before anyone else. Its a very loose competition. Lets start with half a mile. When/if that is broken, we'll bump it up to a mile, and so on and so fourth. We'll go untill the FAA makes us stop. tongue.gif

 

btw, $20 store bought materials only. I dont want to hear "Oh, well my cousin sold me his cessena for $20.". tongue.gif

[Mowgli1647545497]

total measured as landing distance from launch or flight distance logged?

[RedRocket1647545505]

Originally posted by The Stig:

We'll go untill the FAA makes us stop. tongue.gif

Now that's funny.

 

 

BTW, Mowgli. What can you tell me about aeronautical and astronautical engineering? I'm thinking about that as a major(s). Is it extremely difficult? I'm sure it's not easy. How is the job market for them? Anything you want to throw in, feel free to do so, if you have time. Thanks.

[Mowgli1647545497]

Its more difficult than civil engineering and mechanical engineering, but I would say less difficult than electrical engineering (for the e-mag discipline subset, not the circuitry subset). I say that because by my sophomore year my structure classes I was doing problem solving that I later saw was on my civil engineering roommates senior year graduate courses.

 

If you are good at physics you should have no problem. And even if you suck at chemistry, you'll have no problem. I suck at chem but always just intuitively "got" physics, so I sailed. My hardest time actually of the whole undergrad curriculum was with the inorganic chem I needed to take as a pre-req.

 

You'll learn structural engineering beyond C.E.'s and fluid flow dynamics beyond what M.E.'s learn int total within the first 2 years. After that initial grounding you pretty much have to decide what it is you're going to do: fluid flow, structures, orbital mechanics, propulsion, etc. Make that choice and then tailor your curriculum for the remainder. Its not hard to choose - by your 2nd year you'll know what you like most.

 

As for the job market - its a high capital field. Everything costs alot in the world of aero/astro. Therefore, only big companies do it, or small companies contracting to big companies. And the big companies pretty much live/die from defense. Sure there's commercial, but aside from Boeing and Airbus the reality is that as goes Defense, so goes the Aero community.

 

 

Until we get more celebs and millionaires going into space on recreation. Thats not a joke. Right now there's no immediate reason/need for people to go into or be in or live in space. There's not. Anything you hear is circular logic. But we should continue to go. Its just all long term reasons. Anyhow, root for folks like Rutan and his SpaceShipOne. Root for Sigorney Weaver taking a ride on Branson's first space tour flight. What they're doing is the short term future of the private astro industry. Go there for the thrill seekers, get good at going there. Get it cheap. THEN someone can make the case for staying there.

[Science Abuse]

Originally posted by Mowgli:

total measured as landing distance from launch or flight distance logged?

A to point B. We'd have no reliable means to do it, unless your craft is efficient enough to take the weight of a gps.

 

How about everyone just build and test, then we can set a date and place to fly for the competition.

 

 

Originally posted by Mowgli:

Its more difficult than civil engineering and mechanical engineering,

Aeronautical and mechanical engineers design weapons, civil engineers design targets.

 

btw, anyone know where to get junk airplane parts? Would make nice trophy fodder. graemlins/thumb.gif

 

honnestly, Rutans outfit is where I'd love to be working right now. None of it is realy cutting edge engineering, but it's making history.

 

There's also the Deep Impact mission of late. Being able make contact with space bits is an important step to making money off space travel. Figure out how to grab asteroids from the Mars/Jupiter belt and get them to orbit earth, you could make a fortune off mining exotic materials. General relativity is all math with established formulas, you just have to worry about powering the big rocks in the right direction.

[RedRocket1647545505]

Originally posted by Mowgli:

Its more difficult than civil engineering and mechanical engineering, but I would say less difficult than electrical engineering (for the e-mag discipline subset, not the circuitry subset). I say that because by my sophomore year my structure classes I was doing problem solving that I later saw was on my civil engineering roommates senior year graduate courses.

 

If you are good at physics you should have no problem. And even if you suck at chemistry, you'll have no problem. I suck at chem but always just intuitively "got" physics, so I sailed. My hardest time actually of the whole undergrad curriculum was with the inorganic chem I needed to take as a pre-req.

 

You'll learn structural engineering beyond C.E.'s and fluid flow dynamics beyond what M.E.'s learn int total within the first 2 years. After that initial grounding you pretty much have to decide what it is you're going to do: fluid flow, structures, orbital mechanics, propulsion, etc. Make that choice and then tailor your curriculum for the remainder. Its not hard to choose - by your 2nd year you'll know what you like most.

 

As for the job market - its a high capital field. Everything costs alot in the world of aero/astro. Therefore, only big companies do it, or small companies contracting to big companies. And the big companies pretty much live/die from defense. Sure there's commercial, but aside from Boeing and Airbus the reality is that as goes Defense, so goes the Aero community.

 

 

Until we get more celebs and millionaires going into space on recreation. Thats not a joke. Right now there's no immediate reason/need for people to go into or be in or live in space. There's not. Anything you hear is circular logic. But we should continue to go. Its just all long term reasons. Anyhow, root for folks like Rutan and his SpaceShipOne. Root for Sigorney Weaver taking a ride on Branson's first space tour flight. What they're doing is the short term future of the private astro industry. Go there for the thrill seekers, get good at going there. Get it cheap. THEN someone can make the case for staying there.

Thanks for taking the time to explain all that. Here's one final question for you. Math? Tons of it?

 

Also, where did you go to college for the aero/astro schooling? I'd like to go to a great school that specializes/excels in that area.

[Mowgli1647545497]

Yes. If you walk thru the doors having done A.P. Calculus in highschool and can start from there Q1, then you're still looking at 4-8 quarters of pure math. Starting at advanced calculus thru homogenius differential equations, thru linear algebra (has nothing to do with algebra despite the name, its calculus on steroids) then non-homogenious differential equations (that last is the good stuff, we're talking equations so complex that the real accomplishment is in figuring out if the equation actually has a solution or not. Not all do. Nevermind finding the solution. Some non-homogenius equations (with solutions) cannot have their solution found within the remaining time in the universe (not a joke). Enjoy. Basically you figure out if a solution even exists. Then you sit back and have a smoke, because unless god hands it to you while you're sitting on the crapper, thats pretty much all you can do with it. THEN, when you're all depressed over the fact that the equation you just spent a week proving has a solution but that you can forget ever finding that solution in your lifetime unless you have an epiphany while banging a sorority chick in your dorm room, or staring at a sunset eating a stick of jerky on a mountaintop, you take one last class where they teach you how to cheat and turn that non-homogenius unsolvable equation with a solution into a homogenius equation that kinda sorta acts the same, mostly, but that you actually CAN solve without the solution appearing to you during an epileptic seizure in a french garden.

 

But the good news is you use the math. In the rest of the classes. Its not esoteric drivel. You're going to use it right away.

 

...and then you're prepared to understand VTEC.

[Science Abuse]

very usefull info guys, but please use http://www.columbusracing.com/ubb/priv_message.gifgraemlins/thumb.gif

 

 

Ona sadder note, During testing, fuselage #2 was destroyed an all 8 on board were lost. In memorium, here are their names:

Abraham Lincoln

Abraham Lincoln

Abraham Lincoln

Abraham Lincoln

Abraham Lincoln

Abraham Lincoln

Abraham Lincoln

Abraham Lincoln

 

On the upside, it traveled much farther for the privilege of destroying itself.

[Science Abuse]

straight unguided flight is probably next to impossible for the didtances discussed here. Wind fucks it all up, this is going to be difficult. graemlins/thumb.gif

[Cougar1647545494]

i had a rocket once, till like the second launch and it just got stuck in a gd tree! I cut that biotch of a tree down but still never found my damn thing! oh well..

 

true story

[Rob1647545496]

Are you guys buying the motors or cooking up your own solid rocket fuel.

[Casper]

Originally posted by C6 VET C6:

Are you guys buying the motors or cooking up your own solid rocket fuel.

i thought we had to glide for 1/2 mile? no engine?

[RedRocket1647545505]

Originally posted by Ich bin der Teufel:

i thought we had to glide for 1/2 mile? no engine?

You got a strong arm? He said it can't be a bullit, and that it has to be capable of gliding without propulsion. I would assume you could have some kind of engine to keep it moving.