1TrueSS Posted July 24, 2006 Report Share Posted July 24, 2006 LS6 Clutch + 5.3L Truck + 18 Months + hot lapping at track 26 times and 50 miles of heavy street use every week, when there is nice weather = !!! :bang: So what do you think of the hot spots and the pressure plate fingers? I am replacing the LS6 combo with the LS2/LS7 combo! We will see how it goes! I also need a bigger garage! http://pic14.picturetrail.com/VOL564/772744/5344526/170715326.jpg http://pic14.picturetrail.com/VOL564/772744/5344526/170724629.jpg http://pic14.picturetrail.com/VOL564/772744/5344526/170724611.jpg http://pic14.picturetrail.com/VOL564/772744/5344526/170724641.jpg http://pic14.picturetrail.com/VOL564/772744/5344526/170715332.jpg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallard Posted July 24, 2006 Report Share Posted July 24, 2006 On the fingers I see normal wear, although what's with the one on the top of the picture? Is that just rust that has discolored that area of the finger or is there a gouge there? The pressure plate does appear to have gotten hot, but nothing out of the ordinary for most warrenty parts I've seen. The hot spots almost exactly 120 degrees from eath other is also fairly normal from returned parts I've seen. I've seen much worse pressure plates. I am, however, worried about how forward adjusted your clutch is. Why do you think it's broken? Was it slipping? Pedal feel like shit? How worn is the disc? Is the friction material in good shape and all black in color? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1TrueSS Posted July 24, 2006 Author Report Share Posted July 24, 2006 Just rust. All black in color and there is alot of clutch left. Clutch was slipping when I tried to spin over the tires and when I got on it is would some times rev then catch. Just did not feel the same anymore. Pedal was always lite feeling. So is this normal clutch wear and there could be something else wrong? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallard Posted July 24, 2006 Report Share Posted July 24, 2006 Well everything looks normal to me in the pics. There could always be something that I can't see that could be causing low clampload. Inspect the inside of the clutch the best you can to see it anything is broken, namely the copper ring that sits inside the diphragm spring, or the retainer ring that adjusts with the springs you see through the top of the cover. Sometimes these clutches forward adjust so you may find some luck turning it back and allowing it to readjust for the current disc thickness. If you don't nkow what I'm talking about let me know and I'll go in depth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1TrueSS Posted July 25, 2006 Author Report Share Posted July 25, 2006 Are you talking about resurfacing the flywheel and pressure plate? The clutch its self looks to be in great shape. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallard Posted July 25, 2006 Report Share Posted July 25, 2006 Nooooo, you shouldn't have to do that as long as the FW and PP surfaces aren't pitted or warped (which they look fine). The clutch you have is a SAC (Self-Adjusting Clutch). The three springs you see (circled in red) are connected to an adjuster ring inside the clutch. As the disc wears and becomes thinner the adjuster ring will rotate, which changes the height of the pressure plate in relation to the FW. This has the effect of retaining close to the new pedal feel through the life of the disc (plus a few other benefits). If your clutch forward adjusts pre-maturely you will end of with an even shittier feeling pedal and low clamp load, i.e. a slipping clutch. What you can try to do is put this clutch set back in, attach the throwout bearing, and have a buddy put a screwdriver (or some tool that fits) where I have pointed in yellow. It would probably be better if you used a screwdriver in 2 of the three slots so that you're lot putting all the load on one. Press the pedal so that the diaphragm spring (fingers) are compressing. As the clutch is being pushed in push the screwdrivers in the direction so compress to small springs I have circled in red. When it's compressed to a certain point it will turn back very ealsily. Don't pull on the screwdrivers extremely hard so that you don't break anything. When you're able to turn it back, hold it there and let the clutch out. Pump the pedal a few times and it will adjust to the current disc thickness. Now, my disclaimer...I have only done this outside of the car on a test stand with a special tool instead of screwdrivers, but screwdrivers will work. I don't know, however, if your stock release bearing will compress the clutch enough for you to turn the clutch back. You can give it a shot and find out. It's free. (but my consultation costs food and beer ) http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h92/mallard1055/170715326.jpg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1TrueSS Posted July 25, 2006 Author Report Share Posted July 25, 2006 Not sure what you mean. Put the trany back in? Not sure I can see anything or get to the springs with the bell housing and trany back in? The throw out bearing is on the slave, right. I am just not picturing how it would press in the clutch if the trany is not bolted in. Added a pic of the clutch! http://pic14.picturetrail.com/VOL564/772744/5344526/170754950.jpg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1TrueSS Posted July 25, 2006 Author Report Share Posted July 25, 2006 Found this info! Clutch pressure plate adjustment is only necessary when the driven (clutch) disc is worn and the pressure plate has compensated for the worn disc. Place the clutch pressure plate, flat surface down, on a press. Compress the pressure plate diaphragm spring fingers until tension is released from the stepped adjusting ring. Hold 2 screwdrivers or other suitable tools, and place them against 2 of the 3 stepped adjusting ring tension spring stops (1), just ahead of the adjusting ring tension springs. Using the screwdrivers, rotate the stepped adjusting ring counterclockwise (compressing the tension springs) until the adjusting ring steps are fully adjusted out, then continue to hold in position. Release the press pressure from the pressure plate diaphragm spring fingers. Release the adjusting ring tension spring stops. Remove the pressure plate from the press. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallard Posted July 25, 2006 Report Share Posted July 25, 2006 Yeah, you're right. With the tranny back in you won't be able to get to the springs. Not sure if you'll be able to turn it back yourself. Your only option for turning it back is probably to bolt the cluthc/disc/FW back together and press in the clutch with a hydrolic press. (Use an old throw-out bearing or something to simulte the bearing in order to make even contact with all the fingers) It's either that or take the clutch back to where you got it and tell them it's forward adjusted and you want a new one. They probably won't have a clue what you're talking about though. A dealer might know since these have been used in a lot of trucks and all LS1/LS2/LS6 cars, but no guarantees. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallard Posted July 25, 2006 Report Share Posted July 25, 2006 Yes, the info you just posted is correct and almost exactly waht I told you to do with the combination of my last two posts Looking at the pics your clutch is definitely forward adjusted. Basically it compensated for a worn disc even though yours isn't and you're getting a reduced clamp load. p.s. The disc looks fine. As long as there's plenty of material above the rivets put it back in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1TrueSS Posted July 25, 2006 Author Report Share Posted July 25, 2006 There is about a 3/8 of an inch still left till the rivets on both sides. I will try to find some one with a press and try that or should I say f-it and put in the lS2/LS7? Also the blue spots feel like they are lower than the other parts of the cerface area. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallard Posted July 25, 2006 Report Share Posted July 25, 2006 I don't think you need an LS2 or LS7 clutch yet. How much hp/torque are you pushing? If you're at or under the stock LS6 power rating I wouldn't worry about it. Plus the LS2 has a dual mass flywheel and you probably wouldn't want to swap the clutch by itself. With any SAC I'd swap the clutch and FW together. The blue spots will fell slightly lower, like a small pit. If it's excessive it might be bad...if it's not a lot you're probably fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Posted July 25, 2006 Report Share Posted July 25, 2006 hi ben, come out and play again, see how we do since your last dyno Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1TrueSS Posted July 25, 2006 Author Report Share Posted July 25, 2006 I have to get the truck back together first and will need some new back tires soon too! So what have you done lately to your car? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1TrueSS Posted July 25, 2006 Author Report Share Posted July 25, 2006 I am putting down about 307hp and 340lbs and the rear wheels, but I also weigh alot more. I have a LS2 FW with a LS7 Clutch and pressureplate. I am also planing on a TR224 w112 and a maybe a lite head job. Maybe N20! What is SAC? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallard Posted July 25, 2006 Report Share Posted July 25, 2006 I am putting down about 307hp and 340lbs and the rear wheels, but I also weigh alot more. I have a LS2 FW with a LS7 Clutch and pressureplate. I am also planing on a TR224 w112 and a maybe a lite head job. Maybe N20! What is SAC? SAC is Self-Adjusting Clutch. It will adjust depending on the thickness of the disc, or if on a different flywheel the critical measurement would be the distance between the flywheel friction surface and the pressure plate, minus the compressed disc thickness. You would want that to be what the stock LS6 package would be in order to aviod adjustment of the clutch. Have a lot of people done the 6 speed with the same FW and Clutch package that you're using? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1TrueSS Posted July 25, 2006 Author Report Share Posted July 25, 2006 Alot of f-body guys are running the LS2/LS7 combo! It bolts right up as does the LS6 combo. As far as truck guys that have done the T56 swap every one is using differant brands. Specs and rams, but I think I am the only one using GM parts. I think I am the only one that is still NA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nitrousbird Posted July 25, 2006 Report Share Posted July 25, 2006 If you are spending the time putting a new clutch in, screw the factory BS and get a good aftermarket one. I've heard nothing but great things from the LSx guys on the Cartek clutches. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallard Posted July 25, 2006 Report Share Posted July 25, 2006 Alot of f-body guys are running the LS2/LS7 combo! It bolts right up as does the LS6 combo. As far as truck guys that have done the T56 swap every one is using differant brands. Specs and rams, but I think I am the only one using GM parts. I think I am the only one that is still NA. Ok, if the F-body guys are doing it with no problems you should be fine. The only difference then is the weight of your truck, but if it was holding up well before the clutch forward adjusted then you're probably fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billy Posted July 25, 2006 Report Share Posted July 25, 2006 What year slave cylinder and master cylinder are you running with your clutch? Since you did the t-56 swap, use the 01 and up slave and master cylinder. The 98-00 ones are junk. Also, look into the textilla clutch setup. It is proablly the best clutch on the market for the t-56. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1TrueSS Posted July 25, 2006 Author Report Share Posted July 25, 2006 I already have the LS7 sitting here and I got it all for juat under $400. $$$ is a big thing for me now! The master is a truck 5-speed from a 02 and the slave is from a 2002 vette! I have also done the "drill mod". After 700 miles I took it to COFBA track day and ran 26 times and beat the sh!t out of the truck. The last two runs I had smoke in the burn out box, but my slicks were not spinning! I also let Anthony and my fiance take it down the track too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stampede Posted July 25, 2006 Report Share Posted July 25, 2006 1TrueSS: Nice truck, I like the fact that you put in the t-56, any thought about putting in a 6.0L from the trucks, cheaper than the LS2? And what is the weight of your truck? And do you still need help, I might be able to help. Thanks, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIG SHAFE Posted July 25, 2006 Report Share Posted July 25, 2006 Plus the LS2 has a dual mass flywheel and you probably wouldn't want to swap the clutch by itself. I don't think all LS2 clutches are DMF's, like in the GTO's. I think the LS2 and LS7 clutch are the same part number the only difference is the disc. I forget now, its been so long. But ya, that bitch is really forward adjusted. Where are you making your shifts at (rpm's)? The LS7 has problems with forward adjusting at the higher rpm's, a la 7000 rpm range. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1TrueSS Posted July 25, 2006 Author Report Share Posted July 25, 2006 I would love to do the 6.0L swap just need the funds. Think the truck weighs 4700lbs, I can't remeber?! I shift about 5800! I did how ever miss a shift one time and it bounced off the 6200 limiter! I went from third to second going around 100mph. I bend two pushrods. Remember that Adam? Could that have done it? I am going to put in the LS2 flywheel, with the LS7 clutch and LS7 pressure plate! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nitrousbird Posted July 26, 2006 Report Share Posted July 26, 2006 I already have the LS7 sitting here and I got it all for juat under $400. $$$ is a big thing for me now. Yeah, I made those same comments before, and it has bitten me in the ass: - LT4 PP w/ Clutchnet Kevlar/Organic disc (wouldn't hold spray from dig) - LT4 PP w/ Clutchnet Kevlar/Bronze disc (blew up, damaged flywheel) - SPEC Stage III Carbon setup (wore out way too quickly, bad spring retainers) - 2nd SPEC Stage III Carbon setup (held together so far, but I don't see her lasting much after I put the car back together). All of that, and had I just spent the $900 on the McLeod Street Twin (comes w/ flywheel), I wouldn't have had to worry about it again. It's best just to do it right the first time. BTW, the prev. owner of my roomate's Vette said it had an LS7 clutch in it, it lived a short life, and was replaced with a SPEC Stage III. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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