RyM3rC Posted November 30, 2009 Report Share Posted November 30, 2009 I believe the climate is going to change hotter or colder naturally, without humans being a major factor. Earthquakes and volcanic activity release more carbon dioxide and greenhouse gases than cars and factories do. Hell, cow farts do more damage than every piece of industrial machinery operating in America today. If humans are to blame, get China and India to front most of the cap-and-trade cost on pollution...have you SEEN the crap they are putting into the air and water??? I have, but not first hand. I'm with you. Until the biggest offenders put up we shouldn't do jack squat. We're already so far ahead of the game the rest of the world should be giving us money! Pretty sure we already have more strict pollution laws than some of Europe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AWW$HEEET Posted November 30, 2009 Report Share Posted November 30, 2009 Weather and climate change is cyclical. Al Gore is a self righteous douche. /thread Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SinisterSS Posted November 30, 2009 Report Share Posted November 30, 2009 i thought scientist have already proven that the earths history warms and cools? has anyone watched the show on discovery about how the earth was made? they showed how it was hot(entire planet was lava), then it cooled down, hot again, cold again, repeat several times throw an ice age in, then warms up and BOOM life, if you ask me its just doing what its been doing for billions of years Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thorne Posted November 30, 2009 Report Share Posted November 30, 2009 Scanned it very quickly. IMO, there's no denying that the climate is changing. Bottom line is Glacier National Park and many of the coldest parts of the earth are not what they used to be 100 years ago. I also won't doubt for one minute that the big bad oil companies are using money and influence to shoot down anything that will in some way impact their profits. Between Oil and Drugs, just follow the money and the truth will eventually be had. Personally, I don't care as much about the use of fossil fuels as I do the impact we have be being so reliant on others to supply us our fix. Either way, we need to find a better source of power. Weather or not we are making a huge impact on the problem is what I question honestly. I can with my own eyes see the effects of global warming on the ice shelf. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmrmnhrm Posted November 30, 2009 Report Share Posted November 30, 2009 If humans are to blame, get China and India to front most of the cap-and-trade cost on pollution...have you SEEN the crap they are putting into the air and water??? Sorry, I was too busy choking to look at what I was breathing at the time. I can't believe the US ever let itself get that bad back in the 60s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orion Posted November 30, 2009 Report Share Posted November 30, 2009 Weather or not we are making a huge impact on the problem is what I question honestly. I see what you did there. Although I am almost positive it was unintentional. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DKilbourne Posted November 30, 2009 Report Share Posted November 30, 2009 I see what you did there. Although I am almost positive it was unintentional. Beat me to it. I have a feeling that you are correct. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Casper Posted November 30, 2009 Report Share Posted November 30, 2009 Also, everyone in this thread that thinks it's fraud has failed to address the fact that CO2 levels are the highest they have been and the problems it is causing in the environment. I, for one, believe the scientists because that's their job, that's their life's work, they pour over extremely large sets of data and do research into their fields. Right now the only people that seem to be denying climate change are politicians and average joe's that have no scientific background. You might want to rethink your statements. CO2 levels are around the lowest in over 600 millions years. Right now we're at around 380 - 400 PPM CO2 in the atmosphere. Only right now (Quaternary Period) and the Carboniferous Period saw such low levels. Hell, during the Permian Period CO2 levels were around 3100 PPM. So, before you go believing everything you read, then spewing it here as Gospel and acting all high and mighty, do some fucking research. :gtfo: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Science Abuse Posted November 30, 2009 Report Share Posted November 30, 2009 (edited) I see no hard evidence that the purported emails weren't fabricated by the hackers themselves. If they're a shady enough character to hack into the orginization to steal data, they're shady enough to make up bullshit to further their cause. I'd frankly be dissapointed if the media did pick up on this, because they're supposed to get news from reliable sources. "Some guys on the internet" are not a valid source. I've been hearing about this. It was bound to happen, honestly. That's not going to stop president osama from signing away our country in copenhagen though. Discuss. Good. Global warming is a red herring and any folk that have decided to take a stance on mankinds involvement, for or against, are gullible fucking morons. A) Global Warming is used by punditis to argue against political opponents. Mans involvment can be neither proven not disproven, AND THAT IS PRECISELY WHY YOU HEAR SO MUCH ABOUT IT. It is brought up by people who love to argue, and it distracts you from the things that really matter. B) Fact: The climate has a billion year history of shifting wildly, whether we were here or not. C) Fact: Global average temperatures have gone up. Deny it and you're a gullible fucking moron who ignores things that you see everyday and favors the bullshit fed to you by your pundits of choice. You beleive what you want to beleive and ignore the obvious. Fault is irrelevant, the shit is happening. D) Pollution kills shit and makes us sick. Period. I don't give a fuck what Co2 does to global average temps over twelve decades. I care about asthma rates skyrocketing, lead and mercury in the waters, inedible fish, and loss of landscapes and resources that make our lives possible. If it were up to me, anyone who mentioned "manmade Global Warming", for or against, would be sentenced to 10 years hard labor in fucking Alaska, punishment for trying to take our eyes off the ball. We need to clean shit up, we need to help motivate other countries to clean shit up. You think China's "Dust Bowl" agricultural disaster is only their problem? That dust makes it all the way over here, millions of tons of it, and that accelerates snowmelt. You can lose Glaciers without global warming, but it is still a man-made effect. We need to clean up, period, "global warming" is irrelevant. Until the biggest offenders put up we shouldn't do jack squat. Dangerous attitude. You're saying that, though you can improve, you shouldn't have to because the kid across the street doesn't have to. In that kind of standoff, nothing happens and things spiral downwards. You're also putting your short-term money before the long-term health of your country and kids. You don't clean your kitchen and wash your dishes because you're showing off to your neighbors. You do it because you'll get sick and die if your food-room is filthy. Want to blow your fucking mind? The short-term money attitude that you have is one of the key contributers to the problem; "Choking the skies with progress". One Super Containership that hauls all of your Walmart goods into US poorts pumps out as much polutants as 50 million cars anually. Have a read about what cheap goods equate to in terms of air quality. Am I going to bring up Co2 output and global warming? Fuck no, I'm not going to waste your time. What I WILL bring up is the direct health impact that these ships are having. The rates of respiratory ailments nationally are going up, and in port towns like Long Beach, where there is a shit ton of sea/truck/train traffic, the rates are double the national average. "4,000 long-time residents around San Pedro Bay die prematurely each year from air pollution-related illnesses that include cancer, heart disease and respiratory illness exacerbated by port-generated emissions." Edited November 30, 2009 by Science Abuse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheHaze Posted November 30, 2009 Report Share Posted November 30, 2009 We need to clean up, period, "global warming" is irrelevant. Win. I tell everyone this. Global warming should be irrelevant as a political issue, as it's just common sense to take care of the planet whether we really affect it or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drewhop Posted November 30, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 30, 2009 Win. I tell everyone this. Global warming should be irrelevant as a political issue, as it's just common sense to take care of the planet whether we really affect it or not. This is the answer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iwishiwascool Posted November 30, 2009 Report Share Posted November 30, 2009 Eric = /thread Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallard Posted November 30, 2009 Report Share Posted November 30, 2009 You might want to rethink your statements. CO2 levels are around the lowest in over 600 millions years. Right now we're at around 380 - 400 PPM CO2 in the atmosphere. Only right now (Quaternary Period) and the Carboniferous Period saw such low levels. Hell, during the Permian Period CO2 levels were around 3100 PPM. So, before you go believing everything you read, then spewing it here as Gospel and acting all high and mighty, do some fucking research. :gtfo: Try reading my original post, asshole. And what about the CO2 levels being the highest ever measured in the atmosphere (and they are able to measure this 100's-1000's of years in the past from ice core samples). And what about the CO2 dissolved in the worlds oceans being so high that is causes acidification and bleaching coral? [/Quote] http://www.whoi.edu/cms/images/oceanus/2006/11/doney-en_34628.jpg I was specifically speaking of the previous 1000 or so years. Why would I care about 100's of millions of years ago (before the rise of humans)? Shouldn't we care about what's on this Earth now and has made it possible for us to prosper? FWIW, I agree with Eric. While I do feel that there is 'climate change' influenced by humans and not naturally occurring, regardless of whether you agree with this or not there is no denying that man-made pollution is seriously fucking up the environment. Everything from drinking water, to fish that we eat, and the air that we breathe is being polluted and is causing health problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Science Abuse Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 Tit for tat, Global cooling=fraud: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/earthnews/6703841/Climate-sceptics-get-it-wrong.html See, it never ends. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crossle Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 I was specifically speaking of the previous 1000 or so years. Why would I care about 100's of millions of years ago (before the rise of humans)? Shouldn't we care about what's on this Earth now and has made it possible for us to prosper? Why wouldn't you? Why would a scientist avoid information that could lead them to a conclusion? Why just the last 1000 years? Do you think this was the only period of time that the earth got warmer to try and prove a point? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallard Posted December 3, 2009 Report Share Posted December 3, 2009 Why wouldn't you? Why would a scientist avoid information that could lead them to a conclusion? Why just the last 1000 years? Do you think this was the only period of time that the earth got warmer to try and prove a point? Because I'm not a scientist doing research. I am an educated person reviewing the research done and trying to figure out how it effects my life. If all my sources of food and drinking water are going to die or be completely contaminated I could care less what the Earth looked like 400 million years ago. The Earth gets warmer and cooler over time, but the rate of warming is what's alarming. I'm not going to turn a blind eye to what we put in our air and water even if I were to think climate change were natural. But according to the worlds best scientists it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wease Posted December 3, 2009 Report Share Posted December 3, 2009 I will be interested to see if the mainstream picks up on this as well... CNN picked it up this morning: http://www.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/europe/12/02/climate.stolen.emails/index.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crossle Posted December 3, 2009 Report Share Posted December 3, 2009 It's reassuring that the lead scientists are stepping down after these emails have been exposed....really looks good on their part lol. If you didn't do anything wrong why step down. They blew this shit way out of proportion like the media always does and hooked a bunch of people....what happened to the swine flu did it go away? Haven't heard that all over the news lately... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpaceGhost Posted December 3, 2009 Report Share Posted December 3, 2009 I saw this on FOx 28 last night, said an Oklahoma Senator is going to push for a hearing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sol740 Posted December 3, 2009 Report Share Posted December 3, 2009 I don't see why everyone is so concerned about global farming. Wouldn't more food be helpful to our dinner environment ? Queue novelty horn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CRed05 Posted December 3, 2009 Report Share Posted December 3, 2009 I have, but not first hand. I'm with you. Until the biggest offenders put up we shouldn't do jack squat. We're already so far ahead of the game the rest of the world should be giving us money! Pretty sure we already have more strict pollution laws than some of Europe. Thats a terrible way of looking at it, and the typical lazy ass American way too. "Why should I do anything, if someone else is doing worse things". The US pollutes more than any other nation, I bet you could combine half the world, if not more and it doesn't pollute as much as the US. With the exception of China, I think they are the #1 dirty fucks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Science Abuse Posted December 3, 2009 Report Share Posted December 3, 2009 The Republican said the E-mails "read more like scientific fascism than scientific process." Godwins law, in ur congress. I saw this on FOx 28 last night, said an Oklahoma Senator is going to push for a hearing. A US senator is going to push for a hearing... regarding a University in another counrty? Posturing, all of it. This also makes the assumption that all of the worlds climate change data came form one place.... which it didnt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devils Advocate Posted December 3, 2009 Report Share Posted December 3, 2009 Ughhhhhhhhhhhh. Thanks again eric, for being one of four sane people on this entire website. Look, you Moh-rans, clean your shit up and encourage others to do the same or were all totally fucked. No ifs, ands, or buts about it. The most frustrating part of this whole argument to me is that it really should be one sided, yet there are soooooo many ignorant buffoons out there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crossle Posted December 3, 2009 Report Share Posted December 3, 2009 It's hard to be one sided when the people on the other side are abusing the system to get rich which is exactly what happened. That's why scientists are stepping down from their positions now, that's why Gore canceled a global warming convention/presentation yesterday. Come on they made it so easy for a University to say that they wanted to study glbal warming, get huge grants from the government just to come up with some bull shit numbers that differed from what other places were getting. It is mind boggling the amount of money being wasted in this country right now on stupid shit. Al Gore himself spent all this money on being more environmentally friendly on his house and yet his electricity bill is larger now than it was before this was going on, and he is still flying around in his own private jet....come on now. I'm not against being green and taking care of things, but for pete's sake, the people shoving it in everyones faces are just trying to get rich off of it.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Science Abuse Posted December 4, 2009 Report Share Posted December 4, 2009 (edited) I'm not against being green and taking care of things, but for pete's sake, the people shoving it in everyones faces are just trying to get rich off of it.... Homie, for every grant-grabbing university making a bit of scratch off of publishing results (which they don't, actually), there are 10 corporations making billions off of screwing shit up. If you want to compare the profitability of the two sides, you'll find the anti-global-warming side is winning, like Bill Gates vs a marginally successful meth dealer. And that is the only reason the anti-environmentalist side has any foothold whatsoever: They have much more money to spend. Edited December 4, 2009 by Science Abuse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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