Israeli Carry

[Hwilli1647545487]

I found this on another forum, and found it interesting.

 

Funny thing about when this subject gets brought up online or IRL...

 

Folks know all about the method and what all but they never seem to know the _history_ of the method and _why_ the Israeli's _used_ to carry their arms in that manner some 50 yrs. ago, and that they no longer train in that method anymore having stopped doing so some 20+ yrs. ago now (!).

 

The Israeli now carry in condition one hammer down (DA) or striker active (SA).

The history is that when the country was first formed they were provided donations of firearms as military surplus from a wide variety of NATO countrys.

What came in was a hodge podge of this, that and the other. at that time as during the 50s there was largely no such thing as being able to carry in Condition Two (round chambered hammer down on a live round) with any degree of safety. As well there was no striker fired handgun technology ala Glock.

So in their earliest days for building a national defense force for the sake of continuity in training and because they had no handgun platform standardization as at that time it was decided that Condition Three (Hammer down, chamber empty with a live magazine inserted) was the best for them at that time means to standardize.

Further this method of carry and training was at that time normal across much of Europe as many other Militarys did same, and a few even still do train that way such as Greece. People and military as well as police had been carrying that way since long before the nation of Israel was formed.

 

FFWD into the late 80s when the country had filtered out all the junk and donated handguns to standardize just as the US and most other major _and_ serious militarys had/have. They moved away from that method to that which is most efficient and all conditions functional, carry as in Condition Two to which they have nearly 20 yrs. ago standardized on the striker fired Glock 17 9mm as the IDF's issue handgun, though unlike the US not all are issued a handgun. they also use Sig Sauer 'Classic' arms such as the P220 (full size 45 ACP), P226 (full size 9mm) and P228 (compact 9mm).

 

They dropped that 'Israeli Carry' method a literal generation ago as it's very much dated and wholly unnecessary.

Also it is slow/slower and it is wholly dependent on the operator having time (!) to react as well as assumptive that the operator will actually have a free hand available which even when not injured is not a good assumption as the arm/hand may be in use offensively or defensively.

 

I wish this subject would go away but it keeps popping back up year to year decade to decade and generation to generation.

Here in the US this same method _used_ to be the norm as for instruction with autoloaders toward police carry. It is not anymore and long ago died away. Akin to carrying a defensive revolver hammer down on an empty chamber.

 

The so called 'Israeli Carry' method is dead and beat.

Let it stay that way.

 

Why handicap yourself for no good reason at all.

Yes a handicapped person with much training and under certain close to optimal conditions can be just a functional and in this case quick as any other. BUT to do so requires great specific training, skill and physical capability...And at the end of the day you are still handicapped where as a non-handicapped person has greater margin of error with all other things being equal.

 

- Janq

 

Additional reading:

* Military equipment of Israel - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_equipment_of_Israel#Active_service_small_arms_in_2009

* Weapons Condition Codes / Awareness Color Codes - http://www.defensivecarry.com/vbulletin/reference-how-forum/94468-weapons-condition-codes-awareness-color-codes.html#post1433633

* Volunteer, Enlist, Serve & Join the IDF (Israel Defense Forces) - Mahal, Nahal Haredi, Hesder, Garin - Mahal Guide & Assistant - http://www.mahal-idf-volunteers.org/

 

[Nate1647545505]

Condition Three (Hammer down, chamber empty with a live magazine inserted)

 

That's how we were taught on the M9 -- interesting none the less.

[Drewhop]

Good read.

[Clifford Automotive]

I got nothing. Thanks Howard.

[Scotty2Hotty]

That's how we were taught on the M9 -- interesting none the less.

 

Yup, Nate knows aswell as I do the weapon's posture depending upon what the threat level is. For instance what Nate described, is what we call an AMBER status. Basically it goes, green, amber, and red. Red obviously locked and loaded, meaning one in the chamber ready for use.