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Obamacare Stands


wagner

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Very disappointing to say the least. I cant believe the fucked up stupid shit this county has done since 2003.

 

My son was born then and I'm ashamed and saddened greatly at how so poorly our leaders have done. Saddened for what he is going to have to Deal with going forward.

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Very disappointing to say the least. I cant believe the fucked up stupid shit this county has done since 2003.

 

My son was born then and I'm ashamed and saddened greatly at how so poorly our leaders have done. Saddened for what he is going to have to Deal with going forward.

 

1 of the many reasons im happy the woman cant have kids. I would hate to bring a child into this world.

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Why is everyone going nutty about this? I really don't understand. Is about taking away "freedom?"

 

We do shit all the time we don't want to do.

 

Its not the end of he world. Its just one more straw on the camels back and his legs are starting to shake....

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Very disappointing to say the least. I cant believe the fucked up stupid shit this county has done since 2003.

 

My son was born then and I'm ashamed and saddened greatly at how so poorly our leaders have done. Saddened for what he is going to have to Deal with going forward.

 

I'm in the worst age group for all of it, where you can get rammed in the ass by tuition and everyone else in line, and no one gives a fuck. If you want things to be better for your kids, if you want them to have a better education, not spend $600 a semester just on textbooks that are worthless within 5 weeks, and in 4 years end up unable to find a job that is relevant to your field at all, do something about it.

 

Our leaders didn't act poorly*, they acted greedily, but so did we.

 

 

*most leaders

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Eek, It's been a while since I posted here regularly but it seems we've swung even a bit further to the right. You guys must have scared the left leaners away.

 

So, I'm game. I have a cocktail in hand and a mountain of photoshoping to do...

 

Is the mandate the only thing that violates your collective ideology or are there other specific provisions with which you disagree?

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1. Roberts is a turncoat more worried about the appearance of the SCOTUS than upholding the constitution.

2. Obamacare is NOT free.

3. Borrowing money from China doesn't make it free.

4. Our constitutional rights are being dissolved, bit by bit.

5. Socialism/communism doesn't happen overnight, read #4.

6. I can see the future.

7. Wanna know how?

8. I read about Hitler.

 

That is all.

 

1. How is he a turncoat? Is it because he didn't follow partisan lines, which are not supposed to exist in the high court?

2. No, and no one smart has said it is.

3. Ok, point?

4. The federal government has a constitutional right to tax. Are you ok with the government's rights being taken away? That would make you a hypocrite.

5. Socialism and communism are forms of government which cannot function under the American form of a democratic republic. Throw around the correct terms when you try this. We would have to have a fundamental shift in government, far more than erosion of, often perceived, rights, to change to socialism or communism.

6. No you can't.

7. No, because you cannot see the future.

8. Good job, so have I. I happen to have a degree in history and it does not allow me to see the future. As much as everyone wants to believe it, history does not repeat itself. There are common threads, but it's not as black and white as people make it.

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My favorite result of the conservative uprising against the ACA is that when it was crafted and framed by the conservative think tank The Heritage Foundation 20 years ago it appealed to conservatives in the fact that it removed emergency room freeloaders from the government teet and forced them to have some "skin in the game". Now it is a socialist facist communist overreach by a Manchurian candidate who looks like a darker Hitler

 

When a mandate to buy a service from private, competing, for-profit entities is called "socialism"... we clearly need to invest in our schools.

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Glad this held up.

 

Our company: IT (~$10M annual, ~100 employees) has had our healthcare coverage go up for the past five years. Just like a previous poster. The last year was the worst with a 30% increase in premiums and benefits dropping across the board. This is with aggressive annual shopping for new plans every year. didn't matter.

 

We just did it again this June. Goes into effect July. The result?

 

Our premiums went DOWN. Way down. Coverage and benefits went UP.

 

I draw my own conclusions.

 

----------

 

As for revolution. By all means overthrow the elected government so we can all be ruled by the modern equivalent of the Feudal System: Multinational Corporations.

 

The King (president) is dead. Long live the King (billionaires).

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As for revolution. By all means overthrow the elected government so we can all be ruled by the modern equivalent of the Feudal System: Multinational Corporations.

 

The King (president) is dead. Long live the King (billionaires).

 

this guy gets it.

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Taxation without Representation was used by our Patriotic forefathers as grounds to revolt against the King across the pond. Our "king" is closer now.

 

Just so I'm clear. Your visceral reaction to a Supreme Court decision not going in a way that squares with your narrow ideology... is armed revolt... against the United States of America.

 

You believe that the duly elected legislators who passed this legislation in accordance with the congressional rules of the house and senate, signed by duly elected president of the executive branch, and upheld by a, by all counts, conservative leaning Supreme Court (with majority opinion being written by a republican nominee) is grounds for such action. All this based on legislation crafted by the Republican party in the 1980s?

 

Do I have that right?

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sure, i accept obamacare gov't insurance. from 12-12:30pm---and you can see my physician assistant. if you have a problem that warrants surgery, maybe you'll get a chance to talk to me. sorry, that's the way its going to be.

 

sad, sad day for physicians

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iwishiwascool, i don't think they are listening to you. :masturboy:

 

Isn't that the truth. The reality is that people prefer to surround themselves with those that will echo their own preconceived notions. I think the fundamental plank of a vibrant democracy is the ability to have constrictive dialogue without resorting to the ad-hominem arguments and bumper sticker slogans.

 

If your argument is valid, it will stand up to the questions I ask. If mine is valid it will do the same. In the context of the conversation we both might learn something that gives insight on the arrival to a defined perspective.

 

I'm like 3 cocktails in waiting to argue, I'm three sips from being a pushover.

 

Time for a refill.

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Glad this held up.

 

Our company: IT (~$10M annual, ~100 employees) has had our healthcare coverage go up for the past five years. Just like a previous poster. The last year was the worst with a 30% increase in premiums and benefits dropping across the board. This is with aggressive annual shopping for new plans every year. didn't matter.

 

We just did it again this June. Goes into effect July. The result?

 

Our premiums went DOWN. Way down. Coverage and benefits went UP.

 

I draw my own conclusions.

 

----------

 

As for revolution. By all means overthrow the elected government so we can all be ruled by the modern equivalent of the Feudal System: Multinational Corporations.

 

The King (president) is dead. Long live the King (billionaires).

 

So how did you get reductions. We just redid our insurance (less then 2 weeks ago) been looking for months. The numbers I posted were the smallest increase.

Your company is much larger then ours with only 10 employees. So it just must be a fluke?

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sure, i accept obamacare gov't insurance. from 12-12:30pm---and you can see my physician assistant. if you have a problem that warrants surgery, maybe you'll get a chance to talk to me. sorry, that's the way its going to be.

 

sad, sad day for physicians

 

So as a result of the judgement, you are planning on rationing care based on one's ability to pay. How is this different from the way your practice operates now?

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Glad this held up.

 

 

We just did it again this June. Goes into effect July. The result?

 

Our premiums went DOWN. Way down. Coverage and benefits went UP.

 

I draw my own conclusions

 

You more than likely dropped a few people that posed extremely high risk or had known conditions that drove prices high. They could have passed away, or changed jobs or a number of things.

 

Our insurance went up this year. It has nothing to do with "obamacare". It had to do with the people covered by our policy.

 

A black cat could have crossed your path the day your insurance premiums dropped....

That cat had an equivalent bearing to your new rates as this bill did...... Absolutely none

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Just so I'm clear. Your visceral reaction to a Supreme Court decision not going in a way that squares with your narrow ideology... is armed revolt... against the United States of America.

 

You believe that the duly elected legislators who passed this legislation in accordance with the congressional rules of the house and senate, signed by duly elected president of the executive branch, and upheld by a, by all counts, conservative leaning Supreme Court (with majority opinion being written by a republican nominee) is grounds for such action. All this based on legislation crafted by the Republican party in the 1980s?

 

Do I have that right?

 

Although I'm sure he's not really loading pmags as we speak in preparation of his attempt to revolt, his point is valid.

 

The Tea Act procedurally went through the Parliament of Great Britain. That didnt make it "right" though.

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So as a result of the judgement, you are planning on rationing care based on one's ability to pay. How is this different from the way your practice operates now?

 

i work in a non-profit hospital. i see equal parts medicare, medicaid, private insurance, and even people with nothing at all. if the bill truly becomes a reality, and medicare payments are cut, i will have to ration all the lower paying plans and save room for better paying private insurance. not saying i won't take care of those in dire need---fractures, etc. but if you need an elective procedure, and i can fill the surgical time with a better plan--that's what's going to happen. it is what it is. plenty of practices have already stopped accepting medicare

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Although I'm sure he's not really loading pmags as we speak in preparation of his attempt to revolt, his point is valid.

 

The Tea Act procedurally went through the Parliament of Great Britain. That didnt make it "right" though.

 

Standing left of center, I had to google "pmags"

 

The Tea Act went through without the direct representation within said Parliament (I'm drunk enough to consider smoking one now).

 

You and I likely voted in the 2008/2010 election. As a result of this legal and fair election we are constituents of a democratically elected representation to stand for our geographical and national interests in their respective elected bodies. Just because you don't like who other people elected does not mean you or I do not, in fact, have representation.

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Standing left of center, I had to google "pmags"

 

The Tea Act went through without the direct representation within said Parliament (I'm drunk enough to consider smoking one now).

 

You and I likely voted in the 2008/2010 election. As a result of this legal and fair election we are constituents of a democratically elected representation to stand for our geographical and national interests in their respective elected bodies. Just because you don't like who other people elected does not mean you or I do not, in fact, have representation.

 

:lol:

 

For purely arguments sake, we could start an entire thread on the flawed system that we call "fair elections"

 

Ask Al Gore about the archaic Electoral College system.

Or research what "open primaries" have done in ending real potential runners campaigns.

Not to mention the "crazy" ideas like what groups like Acorn or the like have done to get "their" president in the office.

 

Combine that with the fact that the average American can name more NFL players than Senators or Congressmen and you start to realize that what we consider a "fair election system" is little more than an illusion to let us sleep better.

 

I'm really not as far out as my post would suggest. Just throwing the opposite side of the argument at you to MAYBE bring you more to the center (where I would really consider myself)

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and in 4 years end up unable to find a job that is relevant to your field at all, do something about it.

 

I am doing something about it. Their college funds are well in motion and they won't likely have any loans. Wife and I have worked hard to pay off the house and have no debt and have been investing and saving for a long while. My kids are going to grow up knowing how to do the same for theirs.

 

In terms of a job, that is also in motion. You're situation is no different that mine. Finding a very good job isn't about what you know, it never has been. It's about who you know. My son is well aware of that and even at age 9 knows that everything we do is attached in some way to who we know.

 

Our leaders didn't act poorly*, they acted greedily, but so did we.

 

I'm not sure I follow about "so did we."

 

Greed is defined as An excessive desire to acquire or possess more than what one needs or deserves, especially with respect to material wealth:

 

Who determines what "we" or I need? Certainly not you nor anyone else, that I can assure you. ie. cetainly not some socialistic group that supports Obama and his socialistic care for everyone through handout ways.

 

This is America and a Capitalistic society, not a socialistic one. A country in which I'm empathetic and supportive of others, but only those that support themselves. I'm not one for Gov't driven healthcare and paying for the entire country to buy health insurance so that they can get lower quality healthcare, wait in line for it and pay those that deliver it peanuts.

 

I lived in Toronto for 2 years and know what this system will deliver. It sucks.

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