El Karacho1647545492 Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 While I'm by no means a die-hard NCAA Football fan, I'm glad they got the sanctions they did. A lot of people will cry "but it hurts those who were in no way involved! You're punishing innocent people!", and to an extent, I agree. However, I also will say that it doesn't matter, there are more important things to consider. It's unfortunate that these young athletes have to pay for the sins of their coaches and admins, but the more important message the NCAA sent is that if your school is clearly incapable of putting its priorities in line, you will not have success and we will make sure of that. In covering up Sandusky's transgressions, PSU coaches and admins made the integrity of football program their top priority. If they could so easily turn a blind eye to victims of child abuse for the sake of one man, how can anyone be certain that, as an accredited institute of higher learning, they would put the concerns of academia over football? It is for this reason that I fully support the draconian measures taken by the NCAA; they have gone the step beyond "lack of institutional control" to speak to a university like they are a child, in effect giving a warning to all other NCAA schools, and said "if you can't play responsibly with your football program, you won't have one." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rustlestiltskin Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 So what's the penalty they received??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTQ B4U Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 I agree and think they got off easy. They knew what was going on and as shocking as it is in one breath, I'm not surprised in the other as I'm a huge believer that you follow the money and in the case of Pen State Football, we're talking HUGE Buck$. Bullshit to the leadership for not doing anything. Payback is a bitch. I just wish Paterno didn't die so soon so he could suffer a bit. I really hope the cause of it all gets his ass reemed in jail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LJ Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 I am 100% against the penalties levied by the NCAA. It is outside the scope of their bylaws, even as admitted by the president of the NCAA. PSU going along with whatever they say is nothing but bad news for the future of college sports. It sets a precedent that the NCAA can punish programs not only for bylaw violations, but also whatever the hell else they want to punish programs for. It should have been left to the DoE and DoJ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Karacho1647545492 Posted July 23, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 (edited) So what's the penalty they received??? 80 Scholarships, 4 year bowl ban (meaning all current players will be able to transfer without sitting a year), $60million fine. essentially a death penalty. You can't recover from that kind of scholarship loss. EDIT: wrong about sanctions. 40-65 scholarships, also vacating all wins since 1998 Edited July 23, 2012 by El Karacho Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Karacho1647545492 Posted July 23, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 I am 100% against the penalties levied by the NCAA. It is outside the scope of their bylaws, even as admitted by the president of the NCAA. PSU going along with whatever they say is nothing but bad news for the future of college sports. It sets a precedent that the NCAA can punish programs not only for bylaw violations, but also whatever the hell else they want to punish programs for. It should have been left to the DoE and DoJ I would've preferred the NCAA just kick PSU out of the organization, but that truly would be unfair to all the other student athletes in the university who were not part of a program that put football ahead of academia, the law, and moral behavior. I think this is a decent compromise until DOJ gets ahold of it. I think every admin who covered it up should spend the rest of their lives in prison. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LJ Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 I would've preferred the NCAA just kick PSU out of the organization, but that truly would be unfair to all the other student athletes in the university who were not part of a program that put sports ahead of academia, the law, and moral behavior. I think this is a decent compromise until DOJ gets ahold of it. I think every admin who covered it up should spend the rest of their lives in prison. The NCAA acted outside of their bylaws. It's total BS to me. This is a DoE and DOJ issue. Not an NCAA issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LJ Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 It also sets the precedent that the NCAA can act on whatever they want. The NCAA is there to enforce their bylaws. This fell outside the realm of their bylaws, but they acted anyway. With PSU saying that they would not appeal any decision, that basically means the NCAA now has free reign to do whatever the fuck they want moving forward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bicranium Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 The NCAA acted outside of their bylaws. It's total BS to me. This is a DoE and DOJ issue. Not an NCAA issue. I was pretty much on this wagon until the Freeh report came out and it was very obvious that what was done was done to protect the football program's reputation and keep JoePa in power long enough to get the wins record and that the people in charge of making the decision to cover it up were directly in charge of the football program. The only thing I think that is wrong with the penalties is the date where the vacation of wins began. PSU couldn't really have done anything more in 1998. The proper authorities were notified, investigated and no charges were filed. 2001 is when the vacation of wins should have started because the incident never made it out of the PSU circle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bicranium Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 It also sets the precedent that the NCAA can act on whatever they want. The NCAA is there to enforce their bylaws. This fell outside the realm of their bylaws, but they acted anyway. With PSU saying that they would not appeal any decision, that basically means the NCAA now has free reign to do whatever the fuck they want moving forward. But look at what sets this precedent... a child rape scandal that goes back at least 14 years. If something as awful as this happens again then, by all means NCAA, do your worst. I don't see this power that was granted to Emmert in this situation being used very often if ever again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LJ Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 But look at what sets this precedent... a child rape scandal that goes back at least 14 years. If something as awful as this happens again then, by all means NCAA, do your worst. I don't see this power that was granted to Emmert in this situation being used very often if ever again. I disagree. It's a case for the DoJ and DoE. I'm sure there are bylaw violations in there, but they are not worthy of this penalty. The DoE will punish the proper areas of the institution. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bicranium Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 I remember some terminology being used very frequently with regards to OSU and Tressel and they threw the term "ethical code of conduct violations" around a TON with regards to Tressel not reporting stuff immediately. I think there were some pretty strong "ethical code of conduct violations" with regards to JoePa, the university president, the athletic director, members of the board of trustees, etc., etc. I think what they really ended up citing here were violations of the NCAA's "constitution" whatever the hell that is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LJ Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 I remember some terminology being used very frequently with regards to OSU and Tressel and they threw the term "ethical code of conduct violations" around a TON with regards to Tressel not reporting stuff immediately. I think there were some pretty strong "ethical code of conduct violations" with regards to JoePa, the university president, the athletic director, members of the board of trustees, etc., etc. I think what they really ended up citing here were violations of the NCAA's "constitution" whatever the hell that is. To use a term the NCAA coined, how can this not represent a Lack of Institutional Control? Because it doesn't -- at least not in the NCAA sense. It is a case of a university having too much control. It is a case of a massive abuse of power with horrific consequences, and the perpetrators of that abuse of power deserve jail time. It is not a case of broken NCAA bylaws, though. Read more: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/writers/andy_staples/07/02/penn-state-jerry-sandusky-ncaa/index.html#ixzz21SGVY3hv 2. This is not the NCAA's job. My friend, colleague and eating machine Andy Staples eloquently pointed this out earlier this month: The NCAA exists to enforce NCAA rules. Often, the NCAA doesn't even do that, either through willful disregard, a good-old-administrators network, understaffing or a lack of subpoena power. But when NCAA rules are broken, it is the NCAA's job to determine a penalty. If the NCAA doesn't do that, nobody will. This is different. Laws were broken. Most of the key perpetrators are either in jail (Jerry Sandusky); in danger of going to jail (former athletic director Tim Curley, former vice president Gary Schultz, and possibly former president Graham Spanier, though Spanier has not been charged); or dead (Paterno). Former assistant coach Mike McQueary, who witnessed Sandusky assaulting one boy and reported it to his bosses, will probably lose his career. They will all be forever associated with this scandal. NCAA sanctions are largely symbolic -- they are supposed to embarrass a university. Well, in the public's mind, Penn State will mean "child rape scandal" for many years. I think the school is pretty well covered on the public-embarrassment front. Read more: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/writers/michael_rosenberg/07/19/penn-state-death-penalty/index.html#ixzz21SGK4C8v @schadjoe: NCAA experts keep saying the PSU situation is outside NCAA bylaws and the Emmert doesn't presently have autonomy to level penalties @schadjoe: The NCAA is exploring all options including unprecedented ones to due uniqueness of PSU case . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmwohio Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SinisterSS Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 I remember some terminology being used very frequently with regards to OSU and Tressel and they threw the term "ethical code of conduct violations" around a TON with regards to Tressel not reporting stuff immediately. I think there were some pretty strong "ethical code of conduct violations" with regards to JoePa, the university president, the athletic director, members of the board of trustees, etc., etc. I think what they really ended up citing here were violations of the NCAA's "constitution" whatever the hell that is. I was at last years OSU/PSU game, PSU fans were wearing t-shirts saying "Legend" on the front with JoePa's face and the back with Tressels sweater vest saying "Liar", oh the irony there, I wish I could see those fans now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bicranium Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 I was at last years OSU/PSU game, PSU fans were wearing t-shirts saying "Legend" on the front with JoePa's face and the back with Tressels sweater vest saying "Liar", oh the irony there, I wish I could see those fans now. That's another reason this is so satisfying to me now. I mean, Mike McQuery was still sending out letters late last year to recruits boasting the fact that PSU was one of 2 D1 institutions left who had never been a part of an NCAA investigation. Their fans couldn't have been happier to watch OSU dragged through the mud over some discounted tattoos. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SinisterSS Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 To use a term the NCAA coined, how can this not represent a Lack of Institutional Control? Because it doesn't -- at least not in the NCAA sense. It is a case of a university having too much control. It is a case of a massive abuse of power with horrific consequences, and the perpetrators of that abuse of power deserve jail time. It is not a case of broken NCAA bylaws, though. Read more: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/writers/andy_staples/07/02/penn-state-jerry-sandusky-ncaa/index.html#ixzz21SGVY3hv Read more: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/writers/michael_rosenberg/07/19/penn-state-death-penalty/index.html#ixzz21SGK4C8v @schadjoe: NCAA experts keep saying the PSU situation is outside NCAA bylaws and the Emmert doesn't presently have autonomy to level penalties @schadjoe: The NCAA is exploring all options including unprecedented ones to due uniqueness of PSU case . I see this getting dragged out with multiple lawsuits Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LJ Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 I see this getting dragged out with multiple lawsuits PSU said they would accept any punishment with no appeal. They basically sold out to the NCAA in hopes to move forward. That's the only reason the NCAA could come down so confidently with this type of punishment so soon, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wagner Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 That's another reason this is so satisfying to me now. I mean, Mike McQuery was still sending out letters late last year to recruits boasting the fact that PSU was one of 2 D1 institutions left who had never been a part of an NCAA investigation. Their fans couldn't have been happier to watch OSU dragged through the mud over some discounted tattoos. I bet you 5 wood nickles that the biased fucks at ESPN and SI will not spend the amount of time at PSU as they did here trying to dig deeper. NCAA, ESPN and SI LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bicranium Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 They don't/won't have to. PSU/child rape will not be out of the news for several more years due to civil suits and the like. And PSU just got raped hard by the NCAA. All the digging being done by SI/ESPN into OSU was because 1) the story was so small and they wanted it to be bigger and 2) because the NCAA was investigating it and that takes forever. It was almost 1 year exactly from the date of the first TatGate press conference to the day OSU's sanctions were announced. For a while now people have been wondering what if anything the NCAA could/would do to PSU and kinda avoided it out of respect for the larger/more tragic story which of course was the fact that so many kids' lives were ruined by those in charge at PSU. Then all of a sudden... BOOM. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LJ Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 Had Penn State not wanted to play ball, Emmert was not authorized to unilaterally impose punishments.— John Infante (@John_Infante) July 23, 2012 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hahn Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 LJ, i dont see how you think the NCAA is acting out of line on this. This is an NCAA issue for the simple fact that it involved NCAA coaches and facilities. If anything, the punishment wasnt even that bad, granted theres not alot else that can be done considering one guy is dead and ones off to prison. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LJ Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 LJ, i dont see how you think the NCAA is acting out of line on this. This is an NCAA issue for the simple fact that it involved NCAA coaches and facilities. If anything, the punishment wasnt even that bad, granted theres not alot else that can be done considering one guy is dead and ones off to prison. Because there were no NCAA bylaws broken. See post above yours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
10phone2 Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 isn't lack of institutional control part of the bylaws? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LJ Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 isn't lack of institutional control part of the bylaws? Nope. Lack of institutional control would mean that they are running amok against the bylaws. If I was wrong, this Had Penn State not wanted to play ball, Emmert was not authorized to unilaterally impose punishments Would not have been the case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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