El Karacho1647545492 Posted February 1, 2016 Report Share Posted February 1, 2016 A couple more pieces of advice concerning Wrangler buying: tops: Where you can try to buy one that has both tops. The hardtops are shockingly expensive if you have to buy them separately. My YJ top is still $500 in decent shape and those are 20 years old now. The TJ tops run between $500 and $1500 depending on condition and I can't even imagine what an LJ hardtop sells for because I haven't seen one for sale in a long time. Hardtops just make winter more bearable. I know plenty of people who do winter with a soft top only, but I don't - the hardtop just keeps heat in and rain and snow out better. Doors: I always say try to get full hard doors if you can too because TJ hard doors run $500-$800 a set, but there are places that make an upper hard door bolt on for the half doors that makes this less of a priority. Half doors are usually pretty cheap and easy to find so it is always better to get the full doors if you can, but it shouldn't be a deal breaker. If you want to run without doors in the summer, I can recommend some motorcycle mirrors that will bolt on to the stock hinge so you can still be legal. I use a stock pair off an old shovelhead harley that I bought at a swap meet for $5 years ago (DOT legal) but there are easier ones to find now. Lifts: My personal preference is don't look at any jeep with over 2" lift. Stock ride height is ideal. After 2" lift you are talking about 35" tires or bigger and those tires are really expensive to replace. Also there are a lot of other things that need to be upgraded and most jeeps are usually someone's continual project. I can gaurantee you that on 95% of all the lifted jeeps out there the speedometer is useless. Body lift: should be no more than 1" and you have to make sure that any lines that pass to the body have been extended. The last thing you want is for your kid to be driving and the suspension unloads and pulls a brake line out of the master cylinder. otherwise these are pretty safe, usually done just to fit big tires and most of the mechanical stuff remains stock and functioning properly. With a TJ this usually means a 31-32" tire and those aren't any more expensive than the 30" ones the Rubicon comes with stock. Suspension lift: not all kits are created equal so it is important to understand the brand of lift and who installed it. You are going to want to see extended lines, proper front end geometry, upgraded shocks, and a slip yoke eliminator at the bare minimum. Tires are usually in the 32"-35" range which can get pricey when you get to the 35" sizes. fortunately most TJs don't require gearing upgrades for lifts this size (if they have the 3.73 rubicon/tow package gears). for any lifted jeep, make sure a high lift jack is included or you get one after purchase right away. Make sure you drive the thing and listen for any creaks or clanks. Jeep springs naturally creak a little, but you don't want to hear anything else flexing. Also jack it up and let the axle dangle and look for any lines or hoses that are pulled tight. don't worry about the speedo being off...there are plenty of places that sell gears and correction boxes cheap but most jeep guys are too lazy to fix it. My YJ runs 30" tires up from 26" stock (0" lift) and the speedo is way off and has been for a decade or more. It's a jeep thing. This guy knows his shit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HUMBLER1647545517 Posted February 1, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2016 //\\ Werd! SO how terrible will it be if I end up with an 09 Rubicon? Will I really regret that motor if I maintain it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Karacho1647545492 Posted February 1, 2016 Report Share Posted February 1, 2016 //\\ Werd! SO how terrible will it be if I end up with an 09 Rubicon? Will I really regret that motor if I maintain it? Drive it first. It's a bit of a torqueless wonder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zeitgeist57 Posted February 1, 2016 Report Share Posted February 1, 2016 I drove a 2012 4dr Sport (stripper) with the 3.8L and honestly was very disappointed with how trucky and gutless the engine was, even with a stick. Drove a 2013 Rubicon with leather (Katzskin aftermarket kit), stick, and the 3.6L Pentastar and it was like night and day. The suspension and chassis felt more solid, the acceleration was noticeably quicker and the passing-power was a lot stronger. Granted, it's the difference in a $28k and $42k Jeep at the time... I think the Rubicon should hold is value the best out of any JK Wrangler, but dat 210hp :no:, especially in an automatic...:barf: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geeto67 Posted February 1, 2016 Report Share Posted February 1, 2016 not terrible. If it is a real rubicon then at least you have the good suspension and good axles. The electronic sway bar disconnect is a problem on the JKs but there are kits to fix/convert it. Be fore-warned a melted electronic sway bar disconnect can cause a no-start in the jeep because of the body harness design. There are little stupid things like this in the JKs that give the mechanical stuff a bad rap unnecessarily. Let me be a little more clear: The 3.8L EGH engine isn't a bad engine per-se. It just isn't a jeep engine. It powered all chrysler mini-vans from 1994 to 2010, as well as the Pacifica cross over, and the VW routan. It's been around for over 25 years now and it's proven pretty dependable. but dependable doesn't = fun. When you drive a jeep wrangler there are some basics you expect, Torque, lightness, and horrible fuel mileage. The 3.8 makes 237 ft lbs peak torque at 4000 rpm vs the old inline 4.0L which made the same 237 ft/lbs peak torque at 3200rpm. All this in a truck that is almost 1000lbs heavier. What that means is you are on the gas more often just to go slower, and if you wheel, you are going to have to put your foot deeper in to get up the more challenging stuff. Horrible fuel mileage is the one thing where this engine is more jeep than the inline. My old YJ still gets 16mpg city and 19 mpg highway even after twenty years and 140K miles. It's light so that helps. every TJ I have driven returns about the same, esp the last ones (2004-2006) with the crack prone emissions friendly head. Most of the guys I know with 3.8 JKs report a 14-15 mpg around town and 17-18mpg real world highway. Yes I know this engine is more efficient in the mini-vans but keep in mind a wrangler is aerodynamically a brick and even the Routan is more aero-shaped than it. If you have never driven any kind of jeep before I don't know that you'll notice. But to jeep people, who already mostly drive like johnny on the gas, it feels like working harder to do less. My suggestion is, drive it. See if you like it. I didn't, my father didn't, most of my hard core buddies don't, but those are all obnoxiously jaded jeep people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HUMBLER1647545517 Posted February 1, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2016 With him being a new driver, underpowered isn't a terrible thing especially if it holds value. I assume there are fixes for the lack of horsepower down the road? I do know literally nothing about jeeps or their motors. Thank you for the info. IF this 09 doesn't pan out then back to the board, let me know if you see anything more out there! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodRed Posted February 1, 2016 Report Share Posted February 1, 2016 The 3.8L is also well known to consume oil, so keep a very close eye on it if you go with a JK with that engine. It isn't uncommon for them to consume a quart every 1,000-3,000 miles. Don't forget, if gas mileage is a concern, the 2 door JK will get 1-3 mpg more than the 4 door model and that goes for both engines, 3.8 or 3.6. I DD a 2013 2-door with the 3.6L and automatic. Mixed driving I get about 19-21 mpg. On long highway trips, I have seen as high as 26 mpg. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geeto67 Posted February 1, 2016 Report Share Posted February 1, 2016 With him being a new driver, underpowered isn't a terrible thing especially if it holds value. I assume there are fixes for the lack of horsepower down the road? I do know literally nothing about jeeps or their motors. Thank you for the info. IF this 09 doesn't pan out then back to the board, let me know if you see anything more out there! there isn't much for the 3.8L. Cold air (lol), ignition, a throttle mod for the electronic throttles, headers/exhaust, and ECU chips. you aren't talking about big power gains - I doubt doing all of the above will net over 100hp. it is not recommended that the 3.8L be super/turbo charged. 505 Performance has a stroker kit to 4.1L that fixes all the oil consumption engine problems as well. Here is a good read on it: http://www.fourwheeler.com/how-to/engine/1411-building-a-stroked-jeep-38l-v6-jk-bumping/ Compare this to the 4.0L which is not unheard of people putting turbos on 100K mile engines. There are also complete stroker kits for pretty cheap, headers, cheap injector upgrades (mustang), etc... The aftermarket for the 4.0L is huge. Jeep's spec is 1 qt per 1000 miles for the 3.8L. Anything under that they won't do anything. Over that....who knows. There are a number of issues that contribute to this from a PCV valve seal to an oil spec for cold weather emissions testing (US 3.8L run 5w20, the same engine everywhere else runs 10w30), carbon build-up, and even a few units in 2008 that had their piston rings installed upside down. Most of the oil consumption shows up between 70K and 100K miles (although some happen earlier). Remember to ask about consumption and if it sounds high...pass. This is not exclusive to the wrangler by the way, pacificas and town and country owners have the same issues. most of these issues were worked out by 09, but it still never hurts to ask. of greater concern are that some will spin bearings. This happens if you overheat the 3.8L at all. The bearing shape is not great and if the bearing area heats past tolerance the bearing will shift and block the oil passage - starving the bearing which then proceeds to spin/seize. switching to a 5w30 or 10w30 is supposed to help prevent this as well as the oil consumption issue but fuck me if I know why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HUMBLER1647545517 Posted February 1, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2016 How these things hold their value is incredible. Thoughts on this one at 16,900? http://www.subaruofkingsautomall.com/used/Jeep/2006-Jeep-Wrangler-cincinnati-oh-8b3faaae0a0e0ae704465759ce21a9f1.htm?searchDepth=2:3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geeto67 Posted February 1, 2016 Report Share Posted February 1, 2016 How these things hold their value is incredible. Thoughts on this one at 16,900? http://www.subaruofkingsautomall.com/used/Jeep/2006-Jeep-Wrangler-cincinnati-oh-8b3faaae0a0e0ae704465759ce21a9f1.htm?searchDepth=2:3 Looks like it has about a 2" lift, Rancho 5000s, and bushwaker flat flares. huge tires too in a good brand. Looks like someone spent the money. Go drive it and see how it handles, make sure it doesn't wander all over the road. two shortcuts people often take with these lifts are not correcting the steering arm and no SYE. make sure it has both. I'd rather have this one but your son doesn't drive stick: http://www.subaruofkingsautomall.com/used/Jeep/2005-Jeep-Wrangler-cincinnati-oh-c91f714f0a0e0a170a2315f83a7ea90d.htm Most common areas for Jeeps to rust are in the front fenders over the wheel arches (check behind that the flares are not hiding this) and the floor pans. get underneath and check over it. Jeep galvanized these bodies but it isn't german galvanizing like on a Porsche 911 - they will still rust. also make sure you run the vin and verify it is a real rubicon. lots of people just slap the decals on the hood and with the lift you can't tell from the suspension pieces. It does have the axle lock so that is a positive sign. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Karacho1647545492 Posted February 1, 2016 Report Share Posted February 1, 2016 How these things hold their value is incredible. Thoughts on this one at 16,900? http://www.subaruofkingsautomall.com/used/Jeep/2006-Jeep-Wrangler-cincinnati-oh-8b3faaae0a0e0ae704465759ce21a9f1.htm?searchDepth=2:3 Looks like a beast, the post above mine is solid. If he's there, ask for Buzzy Gaz. Old school car salesman but not in a bad way, he'll take good care of you. I know he does used cars in the Kings automall I just don't remember which store. And yeah, his name is Buzzy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bad324 Posted February 2, 2016 Report Share Posted February 2, 2016 Looks like a beast, the post above mine is solid. If he's there, ask for Buzzy Gaz. Old school car salesman but not in a bad way, he'll take good care of you. I know he does used cars in the Kings automall I just don't remember which store. And yeah, his name is Buzzy. Buzzy is awesome! Never bought a car from him but he used to own the bar we frequented back on UC's campus and he's a straight shooter for sure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HUMBLER1647545517 Posted February 4, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 4, 2016 If you make an appt to see a car you would think the salesperson would be smart enough to go make sure the thing was running. I assume it was just a dead battery, who knows but no sale on that 06. Had several rust spots and interior was pretty crappy for $17K! Search continues... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geeto67 Posted February 4, 2016 Report Share Posted February 4, 2016 If you make an appt to see a car you would think the salesperson would be smart enough to go make sure the thing was running. I assume it was just a dead battery, who knows but no sale on that 06. Had several rust spots and interior was pretty crappy for $17K! Search continues... The sad part is someone will buy it at that price. People are retarded for Rubicons. keep looking there are still good cars out there, most likely as a private sale. Just don't be too picky about things like color and tires. I know you said no red but this is amazingly clean: http://cincinnati.craigslist.org/ctd/5431937533.html this one is also pretty nice: http://fortwayne.craigslist.org/cto/5420087106.html a bit far, but really really clean: http://pittsburgh.craigslist.org/ctd/5399978614.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Karacho1647545492 Posted February 4, 2016 Report Share Posted February 4, 2016 Buzzy is awesome! Never bought a car from him but he used to own the bar we frequented back on UC's campus and he's a straight shooter for sure The first time I met him I thought he was straight out of Kurt Russell's "Used Cars". Got to know the guy over time in the FIAT world, hung out with him during a training weekend in Atlanta and realized the guy is a hoot to be around. He'll tell you like it is, doesn't cut corners and doesn't know the meaning of bullshit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HUMBLER1647545517 Posted February 11, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 11, 2016 Picked up an 07 Unlimited Sahara. Hope it treats us well. Thanks again for all of the advice! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geeto67 Posted February 11, 2016 Report Share Posted February 11, 2016 Pics or it didn't happen.....lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iwashmycar Posted February 11, 2016 Report Share Posted February 11, 2016 x2!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HUMBLER1647545517 Posted February 19, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 Sorry, been waiting for these pics to post... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigOxley Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 jesus, i wish my parents are nice. my first car in 1996 was a hand-me-down 1987 camry with a bad 2nd gear synchro, which eventually made it a 1st->3rd gear car. props for being a dadbro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iwashmycar Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 x2. Lucky guy. Looks very clean too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geeto67 Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 nice jeep! good luck with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HUMBLER1647545517 Posted February 19, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 Thank you, it is super clean so I hope it treats us well. He's spoiled but is deserving...so far... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Karacho1647545492 Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 jesus, i wish my parents are nice. my first car in 1996 was a hand-me-down 1987 camry with a bad 2nd gear synchro, which eventually made it a 1st->3rd gear car. props for being a dadbro I'm with you. How are you supposed to build character if you don't have to learn to get laid in a tiny cramped POS? Any teenager can pull some strange with a Jeep like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HUMBLER1647545517 Posted February 19, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 Well that thought had not occurred to me...;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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