Political dumpster fire Part III Greg and Kerry Vs CR

[greg1647545532]

The entire voter ID opposition is stupid as fuck. OMG do we even need to play that game anymore? STFU to anyone who thinks that it's some type of hindering of a person's rights to see that they get up and get an ID. JESUS FUCKING CHRIST

 

Well on the one hand Kerry posted links to 5 sources and took the time to explain his position. On the other hand, you used a rolleye smiley and said fuck a bunch.

 

Guess the truth is somewhere in the middle.

 

Let me ask you Tim, what would make you change your mind on this or any other topic?

[Geeto67]

they is anyone you wish to put as his opposition. yes, people at the FBI, DOJ, Dems, Repubs, etc. Nothing that happened happened as a result of just one person, organization or party but in the end, they didn't bring the big man down.

 

you sure you don't want to add the bilderberg group, the Shadow government, or the New World Order to that list?

 

nothing new to see here and you know it. gov't corruption has been rampant for decades if not longer and you know it. the LOL moment Friday was that everyone against Trump including the media just spilled the bucket of corruption on themselves.......again. it's no longer needed to even point it out. They failed at winning the election and they failed at getting him pinned down with "collusion" Hopefully that's the last of their over-use of that stupid word.

 

yes but not everything you dislike is automatically government corruption. Also, while corruption is unethical, not everything that is corruption is illegal. Sounds like you are just cynical and say "well if everyone is corrupt then I might as well have someone who is corrupt in my favor". You are entitled to that position, but some of us like to hold those in power to higher standards and expectations.

 

Good. Too bad those that oppose him will continue to say "this is just the end of the beginning"......OMG what a sham they are trying to lead.

 

People can say what they want, it only matters what they can prove. I say let them try. The Republican party certainly tried with Obama. And you know what, if it turns out to be nothing then the american people win. If it turns into something, then the system works and the american people win. The people only lose if nobody tries and therefore holds the president accountable. I'm all for trying - it's good for America!

 

 

I have no problem with them stating that. Where I have a problem is 2yrs of total bullshit and lies and trying to play that things were pretty fucking obvious. We pay and elect these dumb ass reality TV Stars? Oh wait.....

 

 

Obvious to whom? those who were so happy to look the other way because their team won? eh...the investigation needed to happen. tough titty you don't like it but you can't claim the moral high ground of it being lies where the most common charge tied to this investigation stems from lying and cover up on the part of trumps team.

[CRed05]

The entire voter ID opposition is stupid as fuck. OMG do we even need to play that game anymore? STFU to anyone who thinks that it's some type of hindering of a person's rights to see that they get up and get an ID. JESUS FUCKING CHRIST

 

Seriously.

 

I'd take it a step further and spray your hands with that invisible photosensitive ink that other countries use.

[Geeto67]

Seriously.

 

Again, prove that it does more good than harm.

[zeitgeist57]

Seriously.

 

I'd take it a step further and spray your hands with that invisible photosensitive ink that other countries use.

 

"invisible"???

 

 

:gabe:

[CRed05]

Again, prove that it does more good than harm.

 

The only negative to requiring an ID is that it costs money, and not everyone can afford an ID. Well, if you're that piss poor and worthless that you can get by without an ID, chances are you're already on some kind of government assistance program, and an ID might as well be provided for you by the tax payers anyway.

 

So now we've prevented/lessened the chances of voter fraud and Johnny Poorpants and Suzy Lazybutt now has an ID. Pretty sure it is law that if you don't have an ID, you cannot get a job, so perhaps there is their motivation to get one now.

[CRed05]

"invisible"???

 

 

:gabe:

 

It is in South Africa...only shows up under a black light.

[Geeto67]

Serious Question: Do you think every American citizen has a right to vote?

 

The only negative to requiring an ID is that it costs money, and not everyone can afford an ID.

 

It's a factor but it is not the only negative. Due to years of mistrust with voter suppression, just having strict ID requirements means lower voter turn out. Let's add in the fact that these are administered by the state, and usually marginally trained volunteers and you will have a problem.

 

Well, if you're that piss poor and worthless that you can get by without an ID,

 

You are a terrible human being. For the record that's 11% of the population that doesn't have ID.

 

chances are you're already on some kind of government assistance program, and an ID might as well be provided for you by the tax payers anyway.

 

That's not how government assistance works. Furthermore every single ID requirement bill isn't coming with funding for people to get those ID's, specifically because those who are proposing it don't want those voters to turn out.

 

 

So now we've prevented/lessened the chances of voter fraud

the chances that weren't there to begin with? Please prove this point with actual statistics. What fraud do you think this actually prevents that isn't already prevented by the existing requirements.

 

 

and Johnny Poorpants and Suzy Lazybutt now has an ID.

 

how? you still haven't provided for them to get it through any government funding. No voter ID bill is proposing to pay for the poor to get voter ID. Also you are still a horrible human being.

 

 

Pretty sure it is law that if you don't have an ID, you cannot get a job, so perhaps there is their motivation to get one now.

 

You can be pretty sure, but you would be wrong. All you need to do is to prove your identity which is not the same as a specific ID card. There are no less than 21 different documents you can produce to prove your identity for a job, many of them as simple as a voter registration card, a homeland security authorization to work, Native American Tribal documents, social security card, etc...none of these things are considered a "traditional ID"

 

Again, requiring a specific voter ID is not the same as proving your identity.

 

Here is a list of all the voter identification requirements by state, please point to me the one that doesn't require you to prove your identity:

 

https://ballotpedia.org/Voter_identification_laws_by_state

 

Keep in mind not providing ID at the polls is not the same thing as not proving identity - NY for example requires you to prove identity at registration and then verifies your identity before you vote. If you show up and your registration is not verified, they will ask you to prove who you are.

 

here are the ways states with non-ID requirements verify you are who you say you are on voting day (in addition to registration):

http://www.ncsl.org/research/elections-and-campaigns/voter-verification-without-id-documents.aspx

[TTQ B4U]

you sure you don't want to add the bilderberg group, the Shadow government, or the New World Order to that list?

 

no need, enough cooks making that shit stew already.

 

yes but not everything you dislike is automatically government corruption. Also, while corruption is unethical, not everything that is corruption is illegal. Sounds like you are just cynical and say "well if everyone is corrupt then I might as well have someone who is corrupt in my favor". You are entitled to that position, but some of us like to hold those in power to higher standards and expectations.

You make several assumptions in here. Can't help you work through that. In terms of standards and expectations, I am more of holding people to the same standards and expectations. No need to discriminate. Hilary and Billy were good for the dems, then they shouldn't be bitching when Trump rolls in. His voters knew what he was when they voted for him. His opponents hate that. I remember the day the Billy Bush tape thing broke as I was in Cleveland with a few people smirking in joy as if it going to crush him. I LOL'd as I could see how totally out of touch they were with his base. The irony is that so were those running against him.

 

People can say what they want, it only matters what they can prove.

except there was so much fodder and BS involved here that I don't expect our legislators to promote.

 

the investigation needed to happen.

No it didn't. The public and many officials were spoofed into putting it in motion. Had they known the entire thing was a bunch of horse shit made up from a group of haters we could have saved a lot of resources. I have no doubt the unraveling of that BS will continue and will eventually lead to more people getting called on the carpet.

 

tough titty you don't like it but you can't claim the moral high ground of it being lies where the most common charge tied to this investigation stems from lying and cover up on the part of trumps team.

Trump has no apologies to make nor high ground to claim. He can stand firm on the ground he had from the day he won. The only moral ground that's moving is under the feet of those that failed at their hoax. Hopefully they feel as humiliated as they look.

[TTQ B4U]

Serious Question: Do you think every American citizen has a right to vote?

 

a right yes but like having kids, perhaps not everyone should. IMO if I don't know anything about the candidate or the issues, I don't vote on it.

 

just having strict ID requirements means lower voter turn out. Let's add in the fact that these are administered by the state, and usually marginally trained volunteers and you will have a problem.

fix the problems in administering it then. to do otherwise and cry foul is irresponsible.

 

You are a terrible human being. For the record that's 11% of the population that doesn't have ID.

that 11% of the population needs to do better. seriously, if they are letting themselves down so low to the point that they cry victim about not having an ID and can't help themselves get one, then they should voluntarily not pull the lever on any issue/candidate. Have our expectations of our fellow citizens hit zero and we're good with that? I say no. it's ridiculous that we're even arguing this...

 

That's not how government assistance works. Furthermore every single ID requirement bill isn't coming with funding for people to get those ID's, specifically because those who are proposing it don't want those voters to turn out.

anyone who can't afford and ID or a condom is a liar. stop the senseless excuses and help people help themselves already. WTF is wrong with people....

[Geeto67]

 

fix the problems in administering it then. to do otherwise and cry foul is irresponsible.

 

What problem specifically? as I have said before (and provided links) - at the ballot voter fraud is rare.

 

that 11% of the population needs to do better. seriously, if they are letting themselves down so low to the point that they cry victim about not having an ID and can't help themselves get one, then they should voluntarily not pull the lever on any issue/candidate. Have our expectations of our fellow citizens hit zero and we're good with that? I say no. it's ridiculous that we're even arguing this...

 

You understand that in addition to the poor, this includes the elderly, the physically disabled, and the highly functioning mentally disabled who have not been declared mentally incompetent by a court.

 

You say that everyone has a right to vote....but these are not the statements of someone who believes it.

 

The existing voting laws in most states still require proof of identity, and are somewhat accessible to almost everyone (Georgia, Indiana, Kansas, Mississippi, North Carolina, Tennessee, Virginia being the exceptions where it is much more difficult to vote). I think proving your identity is an expectation greater than zero and has done a pretty good job of keeping voter fraud at bay.

 

Increasing the requirement of ID doesn't improve security, and only makes it harder for vulnerable people to vote. Why do you want to make it harder for people to exercise their right?

 

If it is proven not to decrease an already low fraud rate, and it is proven to have a much larger disproportionate negative impact, whats the point in doing it? Tell me Tim, if it hurts Americans and doesn't help prevent voter fraud - why are you so gung-ho for it?

 

Is it because the people who are disenfranchised don't vote for your team?

 

WTF is wrong with people....

I ask myself that question literally every time I read something you write.

[cdk 4219]

Some, mostly lawyers lack any form of common sense, and also run the country. Why would you want to prove that the people voting for the elected officials have a vested interest in this country? Sounds pretty common sense to me, but not to some. These are the same people who will get outraged about another country meddling, but are perfectly good with non US citizens casting their ballot for the officials that assist them with the money we pay in taxes.

 

If you are in the US, you should have an ID that definitively proves who you are, and when you are voting there shouldn’t be any questions as to who you are. This is just common sense that has been muddied by people who make confusion their livelihood.

[Geeto67]

Some, mostly lawyers lack any form of common sense, and also run the country. Why would you want to prove that the people voting for the elected officials have a vested interest in this country? Sounds pretty common sense to me, but not to some. These are the same people who will get outraged about another country meddling, but are perfectly good with non US citizens casting their ballot for the officials that assist them with the money we pay in taxes.

 

Except all states already ask the voters to prove they are eligible (and therefore have a "vested" interest). Why ask them to prove it in a harder way that doesn't add to combating voter fraud?

 

I should add here that there is nothing in the constitution requiring an individual to be a citizen to vote in a federal election, and for a long time (~200 years) legal resident aliens could vote in federal elections. It wasn't until 1996 (Illegal Immigration Reform and Immigrant Responsibility Act of 1996) that citizenship became a requirement in voter eligibility in federal elections.

 

If you are in the US, you should have an ID that definitively proves who you are, and when you are voting there shouldn’t be any questions as to who you are. This is just common sense that has been muddied by people who make confusion their livelihood.

 

When it comes to voting, there are already no questions as to who you are as every state has some method of proving identity. What do you think making it harder for some people to vote will add?

 

Also, "should" is not the law. Just because you think everyone should have a physical ID, or a specific voter ID, doesn't mean they are required to. As long as they can prove their identity what's wrong with them having access to voting?

 

I should add - why do you hate freedom bro? As long as you are able to prove your identity, what's wrong with having the freedom to do that in a way different than a specific government issued ID?

[greg1647545532]

Fucking commies forgot what America is all about. Freedom, man. Voter ID is another anti-libertarian movement.

[CRed05]

Serious Question: Do you think every American citizen has a right to vote?

 

Yes, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't have to prove you are that citizen who you say you are. I also happen to think every American citizen has the right to enter the United States again when they left it, but you still need a passport to say you are that person.

 

Due to years of mistrust with voter suppression, just having strict ID requirements means lower voter turn out.

 

Well, that's their choice. You can lead a horse to water...

 

Let's add in the fact that these are administered by the state, and usually marginally trained volunteers and you will have a problem.

 

It's 2019, we have tech that allows people to scan or swipe an ID.

 

You are a terrible human being. For the record that's 11% of the population that doesn't have ID.

 

And from what I've heard or see on here, you're a sanctimonious fatshit lawyer who likes to throw insults on the internet and then goes and cries/hides in their house when someone calls them out about it.

 

That's 11% of the population who would get an ID if it was provided to them.

 

That's not how government assistance works. Furthermore every single ID requirement bill isn't coming with funding for people to get those ID's, specifically because those who are proposing it don't want those voters to turn out.

 

I'm not talking about previous bills, I'm coming up with my own suggestions, thinking out loud, to what I think would be a good solution...for fun. Unless any Washington politicians lurk this forum

 

 

the chances that weren't there to begin with? Please prove this point with actual statistics. What fraud do you think this actually prevents that isn't already prevented by the existing requirements.

 

Voter fraud is low in the US, but its not 0. There are plenty of other more pressing issues, but it's still an issue.

 

 

how? you still haven't provided for them to get it through any government funding. No voter ID bill is proposing to pay for the poor to get voter ID. Also you are still a horrible human being.

 

As I said, I'm proposing this bill.

 

Still? Damn, I was really trying to prove to you what I wonderful person I am.

 

I'm proposing a new bill. As you would know, 33% of the US is obese. That's 3 times the amount of people who don't have IDs. My bill will introduce a one time tax on all fat fucks, where they have to pay 100% tax on any regular Tuesday night's dinner. After it pays for everyone's IDs, there should be enough cash left over to fill all the potholes too.

 

Fucking fatty.

 

You can be pretty sure, but you would be wrong. All you need to do is to prove your identity which is not the same as a specific ID card. There are no less than 21 different documents you can produce to prove your identity for a job, many of them as simple as a voter registration card, a homeland security authorization to work, Native American Tribal documents, social security card, etc...none of these things are considered a "traditional ID"

 

No, I said you are required to have ID to get a job. The other bullshit you tacked on there.

[TTQ B4U]

What problem specifically?

 

I don't know, you're the one who said " Let's add in the fact that these are administered by the state, and usually marginally trained volunteers and you will have a problem." I simply said fix the problem.

 

You understand that in addition to the poor, this includes the elderly, the physically disabled, and the highly functioning mentally disabled who have not been declared mentally incompetent by a court.

So the above are totally incapable of getting an ID? Cop-out bullshit talking point. Not even close to reality. Anyone who says they can't get one is lying or not trying.

 

You say that everyone has a right to vote....but these are not the statements of someone who believes it.

The existing voting laws in most states still require proof of identity....I think proving your identity is an expectation greater than zero and has done a pretty good job of keeping voter fraud at bay.

If a fellow American can't prove their identity and conduct such a minimal ask then they are doing themselves an injustice. It takes skill and/or will do most things, they need to work on one or the other or perhaps both. That's not too much to ask of anyone for even something this easy. The problem today is no one wants to put in any effort and if anyone requires even a basic hint beyond having a pulse and warm breath snowflakes cry foul. LOL at society!

 

Tell me Tim, if it hurts Americans and doesn't help prevent voter fraud - why are you so gung-ho for it?

Let me just say Kerry, since you like injecting our names after we get-going, that if such a simple task of societal life such as getting a basic form of ID too much for someone to handle or accomplish to exercise such an important right then is it really others who are making it difficult or is it they themselves that are the real hurdle here?

 

Is it because the people who are disenfranchised don't vote for your team?

you assume, infer and try to put words in the mouths of others way more than someone who takes the time you do measuring the words you type should. It's inefficient and beneath you. Edited March 26, 2019 by TTQ B4U

[cdk 4219]

It’s not beneath him, that is who he is and what he does. Reasonable people can say that they were wrong about things, like me about ID being a law, but Geeto will argue and change the course of argument or goal post. It’s pompous arrogance he learned from New York , not really his fault.

[greg1647545532]

Y'all aren't even making an effort at trying to change Geeto's mind, though.

 

Hey Geeto, what would it take to change your mind on voter ID? Don't worry, I'll answer for you: evidence. Same here.

 

If someone presented factual evidence that in person voter fraud was a problem, and that voter ID would solve it, Kerry would change his mind in a heartbeat. Same here. I guarantee it.

 

But none of you have bothered to find this evidence. Instead you just rant like Fox News grandpas about how obvious it is that your viewpoint is correct and how everyone needs to get off your lawn.

[greg1647545532]

Make an effort people, this is the laziest form of arguing you can do. Have some pride in your posts. Geeto has presented evidence to support his position and you think he's arrived at that position without the evidence anyway.

[Geeto67]

"Fox news grandpas" is the name of my Sammy Hagar Cover Band.

 

That is all.

[Mace1647545504]

All you need to do to get some kind of id is present the papers indicated by the state.

Why can't this be done?

To get my compliant drivers licenses her is what i need:

Full legal name

Date of birth

Legal presence in the US

Social Security number

Ohio street address – TWO documents, from different sources, proving Ohio street address that are listed on the Acceptable Document List are required for proof of Ohio residency.

 

Here's what's needed for an ID card:

ull legal name

Date of birth

Social Security number (if assigned)

Legal presence

Ohio residency

 

The major common issue will be legal presence .

So the question is what's the big deal...get your docs together and go to your local bmv

[Geeto67]

All you need to do to get some kind of id is present the papers indicated by the state.

Why can't this be done?

To get my compliant drivers licenses her is what i need:

Full legal name

Date of birth

Legal presence in the US

Social Security number

Ohio street address – TWO documents, from different sources, proving Ohio street address that are listed on the Acceptable Document List are required for proof of Ohio residency.

 

Here's what's needed for an ID card:

ull legal name

Date of birth

Social Security number (if assigned)

Legal presence

Ohio residency

 

The major common issue will be legal presence .

So the question is what's the big deal...get your docs together and go to your local bmv

 

 

Ok so all you need to do is take your same docs to the polling place and prove your identity, what's the big deal? Why are you adding another step that literally adds nothing beneficial to the process and hurts 11% of the population?

[Mace1647545504]

Because the polling station is for voting...there are lines of division....

why not take my drivers license to my local police station and renew it..because that's not where that action takes place

 

How does that step hurt that 11% of the population..if they can take it to the polling place they can take it to the bmv...it's 6 days a week

[greg1647545532]

You're right, Mace, it's not a huge burden and I don't think voter ID laws are resulting in millions of lost votes. But it's still a solution in search of a problem. You could argue that it's not a huge burden to make everyone bring a pickle to the polls, and you'd be right, but why would you?

[wagner]

I'm going to make this obvious so some people don't get things twisted...

 

***THIS IS A JOKE LIKE DONALD TRUMP, I JUST THINK ITS FUNNY TO SEE PEOPLE FREAKING OUT OVER THIS REPORT. IN NO WAY IS THIS MY SUPPORT FOR DONALD J TRUMP, HIS INSANE TWEETS, BAD FAKE TAN, OR QUESTIONABLE CHOICES IN PRON STARS TO WREK****