CoronaVirus

[BuckeyeROC]

Not sure if I should be really giving my opinion on this because of 2 reasons, 1. I have an auto-immune disease so I feel that people should keep their ass in their home and 2. I have a job that allows me to work from home so I'm not feeling the economic pinch yet. But I'm having a hard time understand why people are all bitching about their jobs because they are to be getting the stimulus check that is more than my mortgage and utility costs AND getting unemployment so from an outside prospective it feels like people just want to complain but again, I'm not quite in that situation since I can work from home and I'm extremely high risk of dying if I catch it. I think we've been doing a DECENT at best job at staying at home as the few times that I have ventured out for the grocery store or something necessary I've seen WAY too many people out and about. Can anyone that has a different prospective chime in and help me understand the other side of the coin. My thoughts, Stimulus check of 4 people in a family is over 3k plus unemployment and if it's 12 bucks an hour that check will be just shy of 2k before taxes so that's 5k in a month, how are people not able to live off of that?

 

 

I completely understand what they want to do by flattening the curve to buy time to prepare for the peak and work on possible treatments. And I agree with a lot of what they are doing to slow the spread. Also, as a small business owner, I believe I have a decent understanding of the economic impact and concerns of many people and hope you can understand the economic concerns that some may have.

 

Due to the nature of our service business, the quarantine has brought our company's income down to almost zero. Not only do I have concerns for my ability to take care of my family and pay my bills, but I also have legitimate concerns for every single one of our people trying to provide for their families. It's my job to find them work, and it's almost impossible to do that right now. Since this has hit, we've tried going into different markets, tried offering our services to "essential" businesses, etc. We are also experimenting with how to conduct our business in completely different ways. For anything even close to what we normally do, there is NO WORK right now. NONE.

 

We have no idea how long this will last. Given the nature of our business, even after the "all clear" is given (whenever that is), it might still be several months or longer until we can start doing our work again.

 

Also, this is a business that has taken us over 20 years to build from nothing to get to the point we were before COVID hit. We have over 20 years of personal and financial sacrifices, blood, sweat, and tears to turn it into something that can provide for the dozens of our workers' families. Again, we are a small service business. Thankfully, we have saved up our own reserves and the Paycheck Protection Program (PPP) is in place. I can tell you the PPP alone would not be enough for our business to survive for the length that this will impact us. We are fortunate to have money saved up. We'll be able to provide 100% of our people's salaries for months to come, even without PPP. Again, the biggest thing is we do not know WHEN our specific industry will be able to start up again. We will definitely take longer than most.

 

Also, as far as unemployment and things like the PPP, we WILL have to pay that all back as tax payers at some point. It's much needed at this point and will keep many people afloat and prevent some possibly much bigger social issues that might occur when millions of people are actually starving and such. But we will be paying that back as tax payers later on, which will also impact the economy down the road.

 

Again, I'm not on anyone's "side" here. The fact is that both the medical and economic concerns are very real and very valid. This pandemic could have been much worse, I'm glad precautions were taken. Also, at some point, we are going to have to phase more people back into the work force. The global economy will be severely impacted by this and there will be a ripple effect into almost every corner of the global economy. Some businesses and jobs WILL be lost. The longer this goes on, the more businesses and jobs will be lost. At some point, the decisions made WILL be a balancing act between the economy, jobs, businesses, and lives. It's just the hand we've been dealt as a society and the people in charge will have to make those tough choices at some point.

[Tractor]

Not disagreeing, just stating my family seems to prefer I stay alive. At least that's what they tell me for now.:gabe:

 

I understand, believe me I don't actually want to die, I've been fighting an illness very hard the last couple years and was maybe getting better. So far doctors can't really diagnose me, but think its autoimmune. This whole thing is very frustrating as if trying to run a business as a sick person wasn't hard enough now most of the jobs I've been doing have cancelled and I'm kinda pissed that a lot of us will be lucky to not be financially ruined on the other side of this.

 

This "crisis" makes the third one that really effected me, Dot Com, Housing bubble, and now the coronavirus.

[greg1647545532]

This "crisis" makes the third one that really effected me, Dot Com, Housing bubble, and now the coronavirus.

 

Damn, I didn't realize the stripper inspecting industry was so volatile. :)

[greg1647545532]

I completely understand what they want to do by flattening the curve to buy time to prepare for the peak and work on possible treatments. And I agree with a lot of what they are doing to slow the spread. Also, as a small business owner, I believe I have a decent understanding of the economic impact and concerns of many people and hope you can understand the economic concerns that some may have.

 

Due to the nature of our service business, the quarantine has brought our company's income down to almost zero. Not only do I have concerns for my ability to take care of my family and pay my bills, but I also have legitimate concerns for every single one of our people trying to provide for their families. It's my job to find them work, and it's almost impossible to do that right now. Since this has hit, we've tried going into different markets, tried offering our services to "essential" businesses, etc. We are also experimenting with how to conduct our business in completely different ways. For anything even close to what we normally do, there is NO WORK right now. NONE.

 

We have no idea how long this will last. Given the nature of our business, even after the "all clear" is given (whenever that is), it might still be several months or longer until we can start doing our work again.

 

Also, this is a business that has taken us over 20 years to build from nothing to get to the point we were before COVID hit. We have over 20 years of personal and financial sacrifices, blood, sweat, and tears to turn it into something that can provide for the dozens of our workers' families. Again, we are a small service business. Thankfully, we have saved up our own reserves and the Paycheck Protection Program (PPP) is in place. I can tell you the PPP alone would not be enough for our business to survive for the length that this will impact us. We are fortunate to have money saved up. We'll be able to provide 100% of our people's salaries for months to come, even without PPP. Again, the biggest thing is we do not know WHEN our specific industry will be able to start up again. We will definitely take longer than most.

 

Also, as far as unemployment and things like the PPP, we WILL have to pay that all back as tax payers at some point. It's much needed at this point and will keep many people afloat and prevent some possibly much bigger social issues that might occur when millions of people are actually starving and such. But we will be paying that back as tax payers later on, which will also impact the economy down the road.

 

Again, I'm not on anyone's "side" here. The fact is that both the medical and economic concerns are very real and very valid. This pandemic could have been much worse, I'm glad precautions were taken. Also, at some point, we are going to have to phase more people back into the work force. The global economy will be severely impacted by this and there will be a ripple effect into almost every corner of the global economy. Some businesses and jobs WILL be lost. The longer this goes on, the more businesses and jobs will be lost. At some point, the decisions made WILL be a balancing act between the economy, jobs, businesses, and lives. It's just the hand we've been dealt as a society and the people in charge will have to make those tough choices at some point.

 

Well said. I'm not watching the daily updates live anymore but just following along with the real-time updates that u/PeaceIsSoftcoreWar has been posting on reddit. Seems like the governor directly addressed some of the concerns that have popped up in this thread in the last couple of days. These are not exacts quotes but paraphrased (from that link):

 

There's a lot of discussion right now throughout the country about models and estimates. When changes happen we let you know. That means that we give out information as we get it. That can lead to changes in estimates that may appear to come out of nowhere. The models and estimates changed because of what you were willing to do in order to protect each other. Our modelers did not expect that Ohioans would comply with our orders as well as they did. Their model was built on a compliance level that was lower than the actual value. Even if our estimates change, people are still dying and we need to understand just how terrible that is for everyone who knew them. That is why we have to keep protecting each other.

 

Our team is working very hard to figure out how to get back to normal. It's not going to be like flipping a switch. It's also still a work in progress. We'll tell you what we have in the coming week. We're working just as hard to come back as we were coming in.

 

Every morning, I get the new numbers for our state. The deaths are terrible but they are a lagging indicator. Hospitalizations, while lagging as well, are very important. We do a five day average to see how large of a change is occurring. Right now they are still going up but we are very optimistic at this point.

 

I have full faith that DeWine is doing everything he can to balance the needs of the medical community and those currently out of work. I think we just need to give his team time to see how the next week or so shakes out.

 

It's funny, a week ago I asked my wife if she'd vote for DeWine after all this (I consider myself a left-leaning libertarian, she's a tree-hugging liberal). She said, "Well, it depends on who he's running against," and I agreed. Every day that goes by is solidifying my support for him. He really is sticking by his principles through all of this.

[Tractor]

Damn, I didn't realize the stripper inspecting industry was so volatile. :)

 

Its those horny IT guys and bankers, the strippers are really hurting right now. Also if you have applied for the SBA's disaster loan you'll notice that "adult" industry is excluded from the process.

[Otis Nice]

I do have an immune disease and am going into medical places to do work, I am trying to limit it, but my family still needs money and to be honest if I catch it and die then "life insurance for the win". I guess I'm crazy, but I'm also doing the best I can for my family.

 

I respect anyone willing to do what it takes for their family. The other side of things is you could potentially carry it to someone who doesn't feel the same way. To put it into perspective say you're doing all you can to keep you and yours healthy and provided for, which is obv respectable, then someone goes out to do whatever they want or to provide for theirs and because of their actions you or someone you know and love dies. Where does that leave you?

 

Anyone going out that doesn't absolutely have to is risking infecting and possibly killing someone whether they know them or not.

 

It's a tough situation.

[zeitgeist57]

Everyone make way for Tim...he's hopped up on Hydroxychloroquine restarting the economy by calling on clients that are still shut down.

[zeitgeist57]

Sorry if I sound frustrated...I'm working with clients on their 940s, 941s, W-3s to remedy exception errors from their SBA applications for PPP. The gubmint is flying a plane that's still being built.

[greg1647545532]

The gubmint is flying a plane that's still being built.

 

 

:lol:

[Otis Nice]

...I'm working with clients on their 940s, 941s, W-3s...

 

Are...are those all German cars?

[zeitgeist57]

https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2020/04/07/825479416/new-yorks-coronavirus-deaths-may-level-off-soon-when-might-your-state-s-peak

 

https://time.com/collection/coronavirus-heroes/5816890/amy-acton-ohio-coronavirus/?fbclid=IwAR0cfUtdTibOHbAhguwFDEtPDLcELWMcRhxZzb0DBAkOPYGnajBUWjJVbnY

 

If you look at THE DATA, current suggestions place our peak on Easter, with other states later this month. If you want a date, I'll be happy waiting until the end of May and then hopefully the weight of getting back to work more clearly outweighs the need to shelter-in-place. Any longer on the quarantine and I'll understand....but complain as well.

[Furloaf]

Study in Germany of a town suggested 15% of the pop had antibodies already. This implies quite a bit more than the testing gave. Could be other variables but leads me to believe the virus isn't all that bad on it's own towards the population as whole.

 

Still means need mitigate it so hospitals do not get overrun and people die from other things that normally wouldn't, etc. But means we may not have to keep the measure up for as long as some are saying.

[gillbot]

Study in Germany of a town suggested 15% of the pop had antibodies already. This implies quite a bit more than the testing gave. Could be other variables but leads me to believe the virus isn't all that bad on it's own towards the population as whole.

 

Still means need mitigate it so hospitals do not get overrun and people die from other things that normally wouldn't, etc. But means we may not have to keep the measure up for as long as some are saying.

 

Link?

[Furloaf]

Link?

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/04/09/many-people-may-already-have-immunity-coronavirus-german-study/

[gillbot]

I take all the stuff I see with a grain of salt. The health care is aggressive because they are trying to keep people safe, I get that. Others are downplaying everything because they want the economy to restart and get going again. I just with there were more facts and some middle ground out there.

[greg1647545532]

It's a real study done by real epidemiologists, so while it hasn't been peer reviewed it does offer a promising glimpse into the possible. Of course, Germans have free health care and aren't as fat or unhealthy as Americans so it's unlikely that the .37% death rate will hold true everywhere, but promising nonetheless.

[Furloaf]

I take all the stuff I see with a grain of salt. The health care is aggressive because they are trying to keep people safe, I get that. Others are downplaying everything because they want the economy to restart and get going again. I just with there were more facts and some middle ground out there.

 

Yeah, more infection testing being done and hopefully mass antibody testing soon is greatly needed. Lack of info is bad.

[Otis Nice]

Lack of info? Have y'all not been on Facebook this entire time? Everything you need to know is right there.

[Mace1647545504]

so the report doesn't exist??

 

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2020/apr/9/pentagon-says-covid-report-cited-abc-doesnt-exist/?utm_source=Boomtrain&utm_medium=manual&utm_campaign=evening&utm_term=evening&utm_content=evening&bt_ee=PzT%2F%2Bz%2F2%2BZ0A2QINRBUjLQQ4PWsP7%2FHRLB0zXZIn5TaeadqOc7%2FBJuJpYsbhYVjZ&bt_ts=1586463011586

[spankis]

The comments at the bottom of that article are.... something.

[Brandon]

Stanford is assuming they have some herd immunity and hypothesize that the virus was in California much earlier then predicted. Which potentially could explain lower counts.

 

Like in Germany they took a 2500 person sample to simulate information in santa clara. Eager for the results.

 

Testing is the only way forward, and tons of it. Bill gates wants to essentially issue vaccination digital certs and testing certs to track folks. While I like this idea to actually just quarantine the sick, there could be far reaching implications. Even if this looks to be less of and impact at the moment, that flattened curve is just at bay right now, the transmission rates are the same as they were in February...We are just borrowing time, unless some of this data shows a lot more antibodies out in the population which is the best news to short term v shaped recovery vs a protracted u shaped tail.

 

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/us-begins-blood-tests-coronavirus-immunity-reports-052340457.html

 

SBA PPP program is moving the goal posts daily, its fun to watch. Its also interesting to ever assume they would be able to process all these loans based on their annual thresholds. Nice thought on the program, but bad execution thus far, par for the course. And funny enough I read it before applying and you could see a lot of scenarios where IF things are opened back up in july that many could* come out on top...And some other speculative scenario I thought up like these guys...https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-arcadia-returns-ex/exclusive-wall-street-firm-dangled-up-to-175-returns-to-investors-using-us-aid-programs-idUSKCN21R1DV

[gillbot]

Yeah, more infection testing being done and hopefully mass antibody testing soon is greatly needed. Lack of info is bad.

I think generally everyone wants to get going again and that can be jumpstarted with testing.

Lack of info? Have y'all not been on Facebook this entire time? Everything you need to know is right there.

I don’t have a Facebook. So no.

[Mallard]

I think the actions we've taken are necessary and were the right move. But I think they should start talking about what the plans are going forward. I get that people are getting restless, especially in areas that haven't seen hospitals overloaded, but that means the stay-at-home orders worked to some extent.

 

With no end in sight (no treatment, no vaccine for 12-18 months, it's not going away in warm weather, etc) they need to start rolling out a plan for loosening restrictions. What indicators are we using to manage this?

 

This should be along the lines of how much PPE we have, how many empty beds/ventilators there are, how much anesthesia hospitals have, requiring people to weak masks, what services will open up first, what's still going to be restricted, etc.

 

 

 

Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk

[gillbot]

Agreed. If people get too restless they will throw caution to the wind and we’ll have another surge.

 

Edit: not to mention we’ll have overzealous employers forcing people back to work too soon.

[greg1647545532]

On the AF Reserve side of my life, all drill and annual tour activity has been postponed until June 4th at the earliest. I haven't shaved since March 8th, I'm going to have a mighty coronabeard by the time I have to go back. If I stick it out this will be the longest I've ever gone without shaving.