CoronaVirus

[BuckeyeROC]

being in the entertainment industry we are seeing some pretty alarming things coming.

 

I do think by the fall they will allow smaller gatherings (concerts/shows for less than 2500 cap or so I think). But I would be surprised if they allow arena tours to go out. I have 1 arena tour that was scheduled for April-May that got moved to Late Sept-early Nov. Im worried that one wont go on. That alone is 10's of millions in lost revenue for 1 single business.

 

Keeping my fingers crossed though..

 

I feel for you. OSU football alone would be around a $62 million loss just from home game ticket sales. That supports the rest of the Athletic Dept. there.

[wagner]

I don't think that's a fair characterization. There are hospital systems that are completely overwhelmed. There's still a massive shortage of PPE and testing. That's real world data, not propaganda.

 

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So my friends that are in the medical field that are being laid off because where they are isn't "overwhelmed" are lying? Others that are dealing with the same thing are just making it up to be cool?

 

Now, there are pockets that are completely overwhelmed and that is a documented fact. Look at good old NYC as that example.

 

So yes, there are some systems that are overwhelmed, but this propaganda that the media is pushing doesn't add up for ALL areas.

[xlr8tn]

So my friends that are in the medical field that are being laid off because where they are isn't "overwhelmed" are lying? Others that are dealing with the same thing are just making it up to be cool?

 

Now, there are pockets that are completely overwhelmed and that is a documented fact. Look at good old NYC as that example.

 

So yes, there are some systems that are overwhelmed, but this propaganda that the media is pushing doesn't add up for ALL areas.

 

Without the shutdown though those overwhelmed pockets would be much larger. That's what's getting lost here...the mitigation is doing exactly what is was supposed to do. Make it look like it wasn't needed. Ask NY, Louisiana, michigan, etc etc if they wish they would've locked down harder and earlier.

[greg1647545532]

So my friends that are in the medical field that are being laid off because where they are isn't "overwhelmed" are lying? Others that are dealing with the same thing are just making it up to be cool?

 

I have a friend who's an allergist (MD), I have a friend who manages a pediatric practice, I have a friend who's a pediatric nurse. The doctor's business is basically dead, the pediatric practice is basically dead, the nurse has had her hours cut to almost nothing. Why? Because those are all non-essential services. Nobody wants to bring their kid to the pediatrician for the sniffles right now, nor does that practice WANT anyone bringing their kid in unless it's serious because they have to treat everyone who walks through the door like a COVID-19 patient. The fewer clients they see right now, the better for them, the better for the clients, the better for society.

 

I ALSO have a friend who's an ER doc at Riverside. His kids have barely seen him in weeks. He's a walking zombie.

 

COVID-19 hasn't caused a run on boob jobs, whether or not you're getting laid off in the medical field right now kinda depends on whether or not you're actually involved in the COVID-19 battle.

 

Now, there are pockets that are completely overwhelmed and that is a documented fact. Look at good old NYC as that example.

 

So yes, there are some systems that are overwhelmed, but this propaganda that the media is pushing doesn't add up for ALL areas.

 

Christ, again with "media propaganda."

 

DeWine and Acton say that we (Ohio) are running low on PPE, they say that we don't have enough tests. They say that it looks like we've kept the surge under our capacity but that we have to be vigilant.

 

That's it. From the source. Direct. I'm not sure why you think media propaganda is brainwashing everyone who listens to our leadership directly. There's literally no media involved.

[spankis]

Without the shutdown though those overwhelmed pockets would be much larger. That's what's getting lost here...the mitigation is doing exactly what is was supposed to do. Make it look like it wasn't needed. Ask NY, Louisiana, michigan, etc etc if they wish they would've locked down harder and earlier.

 

This, exactly this. I'm furloughed for 2 weeks this month. I'm losing paychecks, it's affecting me financially, and I'm ALL FOR the action's taken by our state gov't right now. My wife is a medical professional, she's not furloughed or laid off, but she's in a hospital wearing a mask and goggles all day every day. She is also ALL FOR where we are right now with our gov't's approach.

 

"Reasonable, logical, sane commentary etc."

 

+1 to all of this. Thanks.

[wagner]

I have a friend who's an allergist (MD), I have a friend who manages a pediatric practice, I have a friend who's a pediatric nurse. The doctor's business is basically dead, the pediatric practice is basically dead, the nurse has had her hours cut to almost nothing.

 

I also have a friend who's an ER doc at Riverside. His kids have barely seen him in weeks. He's a walking zombie.

 

COVID-19 hasn't caused a run on boob jobs, whether or not you're getting laid off in the medical field right now kinda depends on whether or not you're actually involved in the COVID-19 battle.

 

 

 

Christ, again with "media propaganda."

 

DeWine and Acton say that we (Ohio) are running low on PPE, they say that we don't have enough tests. They say that it looks like we've kept the surge under our capacity but that we have to be vigilant.

 

That's it. From the source. Direct. I'm not sure why you think media propaganda is brainwashing everyone who listens to our leadership directly. There's literally no media involved.

 

Did I say that the facts being presented by DeWine and Acton are propaganda? Here's a hint, I didn't.

 

It's your "cable news" networks and other outlets that just kick out the jams of bullshit trying to push the panic along. I pointed out on social media how CBS used the EXACT SAME file footage about all the hospital deaths in Italy and the United States. When they got called out on it they said it was a "mistake".

 

I can tell you for a fact that at least 2 people looked at that story and the footage before it was pushed out, they don't care, it's about getting viewers.

 

The fact is that this is bad in some areas and not as bad in others. The news is just pushing the panic along to keep people glued to the TV. I refuse to watch that bullshit. I get my info from the DeWine updates and go about my day.

 

It's going to be very interesting to see how much this country is changed after all of this is said and done. Maybe people will start to use common sense for an extended amount of time...

[greg1647545532]

Wagner, you said:

 

"You've got people on one side screaming the sky is falling and we have to take these extreme measures."

 

DeWine and Acton are saying we need to take these extreme measures. You characterize that as them "screaming that the sky is falling," yet you say that's not propaganda.

 

Square that, please. Leave cable news out of this. Is our governor pushing propaganda?

[Mallard]

So my friends that are in the medical field that are being laid off because where they are isn't "overwhelmed" are lying? Others that are dealing with the same thing are just making it up to be cool?

 

 

 

Now, there are pockets that are completely overwhelmed and that is a documented fact. Look at good old NYC as that example.

 

 

 

So yes, there are some systems that are overwhelmed, but this propaganda that the media is pushing doesn't add up for ALL areas.

I'll second what Greg said. It depends on what they do in the medical field. Dentists, pediatricians, plastic surgeons, allergist, etc are having a rough time. Pulminologists, ER docs, nurses, etc in places around the country are completely overwhelmed, and if they are in a place that's not they can easily get a job in place that is. (Wasn't it earlier in this thread where someone said Seattle was willing for pay like $5000 per week for nurses to come there for several weeks?

 

"Real data" includes the whole picture, not just a few empty hospitals in area thats not hit hard or only hospitals in areas that are hit hard.

 

The shortage of PPE, personnel, testing, ventilators, and hospital beds is a major issue. The PPE, personnel, testing, and ventilator issues are a problem whether you're in a hard hit area or not. The bed shortage could easily be a problem elsewhere if this spreads.

 

For example, the Detroit area has been hit really hard, but northern MI is not. However, there was an outbreak that started as ~4 to 6 people in a northern MI city that has crippled their hospital. It's now up to 24 cases (that includes hospital staff and EMT's) in that county but it all started from one person who went on an international trip and returned home. The facilities up there are only prepared to stabilize patients for transfer to a larger hospital in one of the major cities.

 

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[wagner]

Wagner, you said:

 

"You've got people on one side screaming the sky is falling and we have to take these extreme measures."

 

DeWine and Acton are saying we need to take these extreme measures. You characterize that as them "screaming that the sky is falling," yet you say that's not propaganda.

 

Square that, please. Leave cable news out of this. Is our governor pushing propaganda?

 

Again, did I say they were? No, you're putting that in there to frame your "argument"

 

The governor isn't pushing propaganda, he's stating facts from the data that has been given to him. They are putting it out there in a thoughtful way.

 

Meanwhile the media churned out stories about massive body counts and so on. When you mix that in with the actual facts that it's no happening people are going to queston what's going on and get pissed.

 

That has now led us to where we are, people don't want to believe what DeWine is saying because of the over hype that happend.

 

So, just so we are 200% clear and you can't put any words in my mouth:

 

DeWine = good facts and logic.

General media = trash

[greg1647545532]

Take a look at your own words then, man. Someone can easily construe you saying "You've got people on one side screaming the sky is falling and we have to take these extreme measures" as to mean you don't think those extreme measures are necessary, or that anyone who's in favor of extreme measures thinks the sky is falling. Do you see that now? You're saying that wasn't your intent, that you agree with DeWine that these extreme measures are necessary. Be more careful in the future.

 

Say something like, "There are reasonable people basing their decisions on facts and putting [information] out there in a thoughtful way who say that these extreme measures are necessary, and then you've got people on the other side who...." Is that an accurate statement of your position?

 

If "the sky is falling" people are saying the exact same thing as the reasonable people like DeWine, and the other side isn't agreeing with the reasonable people like DeWine, maybe your beef isn't really with the sky is falling crowd.

[wagner]

Take a look at your own words then, man. Someone can easily construe you saying "You've got people on one side screaming the sky is falling and we have to take these extreme measures" as to mean you don't think those extreme measures are necessary, or that anyone who's in favor of extreme measures thinks the sky is falling. Do you see that now? You're saying that wasn't your intent, that you agree with DeWine that these extreme measures are necessary. Be more careful in the future.

 

Say something like, "There are reasonable people basing their decisions on facts and putting [information] out there in a thoughtful way who say that these extreme measures are necessary, and then you've got people on the other side who...." Is that an accurate statement of your position?

 

If "the sky is falling" people are saying the exact same thing as the reasonable people like DeWine, and the other side isn't agreeing with the reasonable people like DeWine, maybe your beef isn't really with the sky is falling crowd.

 

There is a difference between the sky is falling people and DeWine's facts in my opinion.

 

- Sky is falling people are parroting the junk being pushed by different outlets whether it's true or not. An example would be the alleged mass graves of New York. I've got a few sky is falling people in my social circles that post things they are told and believe is the truth.

 

- DeWine and his followers (like me) look at the real facts and see things are bad, but not as bad as they COULD HAVE been.

 

Where the real train wreck starts is when you have the optics of the truth get jacked up because people can't see there are problems outside of their little world. So that's why you have people in areas where the outbreak is that bad getting pissed because the big doom and gloom never happened.

 

It's a great case study in media optics, manipulation, and how things are presented. Meanwhile you have China trying to hide what actually happened...

 

At first I thought DeWine was being a nut job, now it looks like he really was the smartest person in the room. After seeing things fully unfold what he said needed to be done and what was done matched up, this led to a more positive outcome.

[wagner]

I'd be interested to see what medical professionals have to say about these temporary hospitals and navy ships not getting used.

 

From a project manager's standpoint if certain hospitals are overwhelmed why didn't the medical professionals move some of the load to these other locations to free up resources?

 

The PPE shortage is another interesting issue that shows a global problem. The very country we use for cheap manufacturing of these products was ground zero for the shit show. Maybe that needs to be looked at because we all know this situation is going to happen again.

[Mallard]

From a project manager's standpoint if certain hospitals are overwhelmed why didn't the medical professionals move some of the load to these other locations to free up resources?

 

 

Very early on in MI they coordinated load sharing between hospitals and closed one hospital ER in Detroit for anything except COVID patients. As Henry Ford and Beaumont got loaded up they started transferring patients to other hospitals that had capacity. They also converted TCF Hall (formerly COBO - where the Detorit Auto Show is held) into a field hospital, but I'm not sure how heavily that's loaded. This is something I think our state handled very well early on, but the hospitals in the thick of it are still stressed heavily.

 

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[xlr8tn]

I think everyone's thoughts are valid.....I'm not one to come down on an opinion even when it doesn't agree with mine. I will say that it terrifies me these days that my wife has to go work at the hospital. Healthcare workers comprise 20% of our states cases. To me that's absurd....the people that should be the most prepared and the most protected should not represent 20%. That's what forms my opinion....I don't watch national news because it's been garbage for years. I'm concerned for my family's safety and my own safety. The more people don't respect this thing the longer it lasts and the longer my family is in danger. I grew up poor....not having money doesn't scare me....losing someone in my family does.

[greg1647545532]

There is a difference between the sky is falling people and DeWine's facts in my opinion.

 

- Sky is falling people are parroting the junk being pushed by different outlets whether it's true or not. An example would be the alleged mass graves of New York. I've got a few sky is falling people in my social circles that post things they are told and believe is the truth.

 

OK but let's pretend we're all on Gilligan's island, you're the skipper. The professor says that a storm is coming and we'll all die of exposure if we don't build a shelter. Gilligan starts losing his shit because he doesn't want to die. But building a shelter is hard work, so Thurston Howell's dumb ass convinces Marryanne and Ginger and his whore wife that the storm won't be so bad, and building a shelter is dangerous anyway what with the hammers and all. So you vote, 4 to 3 and no shelter gets built. Everyone dies.

 

Now you're at the pearly gates and you slap Gilligan on the back of the head like the skipper does and say, "If you hadn't gotten so hysterical this wouldn't have happened."

 

For some reason your knee-jerk reaction isn't to be upset with the Thurston Howells that are peddling misinformation, distrust, and bad-faith arguments, but the Gilligans and whatever "media" you think are responsible for the Gilligans.

 

For every "sky is falling" pundit I can guarantee you I can find an equally moronic Sean Hannity segment where he says everything is fine and this is all overblown. We can all agree that pundits are jackasses, but why not direct more ire towards the jackasses who are actively working to undermine an effort which you yourself consider necessary? I can brush off the sky is falling crowd, I have a lot harder time brushing off the "this'll all go away in April when it gets warmer" crowd.

 

At first I thought DeWine was being a nut job, now it looks like he really was the smartest person in the room. After seeing things fully unfold what he said needed to be done and what was done matched up, this led to a more positive outcome.

 

DeWine wasn't the smartest guy in the room, he just made the (IMHO) minimal effort of actually listening to scientists. It's a pretty low bar for politicians to meet and yet he's one of the few who did. I give him more credit for how he's handled everything afterwards (he really has been stellar, I know I've said it before), but that initial step of listening to the fucking scientists should have been what every functioning adult did.

 

Did you know that there are STILL 7 states that haven't issued lockdown orders? I didn't. Guess what letter is after their respective governor's names. It's crazy how much Republicans hate scientists.

 

The PPE shortage is another interesting issue that shows a global problem. The very country we use for cheap manufacturing of these products was ground zero for the shit show. Maybe that needs to be looked at because we all know this situation is going to happen again.

 

The PPE situation is not going to be solved by the free market -- no company is going to stockpile PPE for a hypothetical payday every 100 years, and no company is going to be able to compete on a global scale with China without some kind of price fixing. It's a problem that requires a competent government to solve. I hope we all keep that in mind when we're exercising our right to hold our elected officials accountable.

[gillbot]

I think everyone's thoughts are valid.....I'm not one to come down on an opinion even when it doesn't agree with mine. I will say that it terrifies me these days that my wife has to go work at the hospital. Healthcare workers comprise 20% of our states cases. To me that's absurd....the people that should be the most prepared and the most protected should not represent 20%. That's what forms my opinion....I don't watch national news because it's been garbage for years. I'm concerned for my family's safety and my own safety. The more people don't respect this thing the longer it lasts and the longer my family is in danger. I grew up poor....not having money doesn't scare me....losing someone in my family does.

 

I feel for you, and we are in a similar boat. I’d rather have my family safe, money doesn’t mean shit if they aren’t safe. I’m not afraid to be poor or work my way out of that hole again.

[wagner]

OK but let's pretend we're all on Gilligan's island, you're the skipper. The professor says that a storm is coming and we'll all die of exposure if we don't build a shelter. Gilligan starts losing his shit because he doesn't want to die. But building a shelter is hard work, so Thurston Howell's dumb ass convinces Marryanne and Ginger and his whore wife that the storm won't be so bad, and building a shelter is dangerous anyway what with the hammers and all. So you vote, 4 to 3 and no shelter gets built. Everyone dies.

 

Now you're at the pearly gates and you slap Gilligan on the back of the head like the skipper does and say, "If you hadn't gotten so hysterical this wouldn't have happened."

 

For some reason your knee-jerk reaction isn't to be upset with the Thurston Howells that are peddling misinformation, distrust, and bad-faith arguments, but the Gilligans and whatever "media" you think are responsible for the Gilligans.

 

For every "sky is falling" pundit I can guarantee you I can find an equally moronic Sean Hannity segment where he says everything is fine and this is all overblown. We can all agree that pundits are jackasses, but why not direct more ire towards the jackasses who are actively working to undermine an effort which you yourself consider necessary? I can brush off the sky is falling crowd, I have a lot harder time brushing off the "this'll all go away in April when it gets warmer" crowd.

 

 

 

DeWine wasn't the smartest guy in the room, he just made the (IMHO) minimal effort of actually listening to scientists. It's a pretty low bar for politicians to meet and yet he's one of the few who did. I give him more credit for how he's handled everything afterwards (he really has been stellar, I know I've said it before), but that initial step of listening to the fucking scientists should have been what every functioning adult did.

 

Did you know that there are STILL 7 states that haven't issued lockdown orders? I didn't. Guess what letter is after their respective governor's names. It's crazy how much Republicans hate scientists.

 

 

 

The PPE situation is not going to be solved by the free market -- no company is going to stockpile PPE for a hypothetical payday every 100 years, and no company is going to be able to compete on a global scale with China without some kind of price fixing. It's a problem that requires a competent government to solve. I hope we all keep that in mind when we're exercising our right to hold our elected officials accountable.

 

I brush off the "everything is fine people" just like the sky is falling people, neither group have a clue. Mire ire is equal for both groups and I judge people based on which group they follow.

 

Elected officials are going to do what will keep them in office, that's always been the case and will continue to be the case.

 

I read an article in Forbes that talked about how companies are trying to spread their supply chain out more to mitigate future disruptions. China doesn't play fair so it's hard to compete with how they operate, that was explained in the article as well.

[Otis Nice]

Elected officials are going to do what will keep them in office, that's always been the case and will continue to be the case.

 

This, IMHO, is one of the biggest problems with our country (historically) as well as the media.

[BuckeyeROC]

I received the draft of the CDC/FEMA plan. They call for a phasing in approach starting May 1 and having most areas and things open with precautions in place by June. However, with "hot spots" still shelter in place as needed. Some say it's too optimistic, but I hope it's about right.

[Versluis]

I received the draft of the CDC/FEMA plan. They call for a phasing in approach starting May 1 and having most areas and things open with precautions in place by June. However, with "hot spots" still shelter in place as needed. Some say it's too optimistic, but I hope it's about right.

 

I sure hope that is true. As mentioned above, I am in the medical field and have been directly affected as there is no elective cases. A Hospital outside of PA is starting certain cases today depending on the patients risk factors to COVID. Hopefully in the next couple of weeks we will start to hear the plan to be rolled out.

[wagner]

I received the draft of the CDC/FEMA plan. They call for a phasing in approach starting May 1 and having most areas and things open with precautions in place by June. However, with "hot spots" still shelter in place as needed. Some say it's too optimistic, but I hope it's about right.

 

I saw someone share a news story from a non-accredited outlet that Chris Fowler said College Football won't happen this fall. I didn't share that because I looked around and couldn't see it on any real websites so take that for what it's worth.

 

Then you have stuff like this

 

https://www.mercurynews.com/2020/04/14/governor-newsom-mass-gatherings-not-in-the-cards-when-california-lockdown-is-lifted/

[Mace1647545504]

But some of the mayors and governors with Ds behind their name let everything go to hell in 2 of the most populated states and look at the results.

[BuckeyeROC]

I saw someone share a news story from a non-accredited outlet that Chris Fowler said College Football won't happen this fall. I didn't share that because I looked around and couldn't see it on any real websites so take that for what it's worth.

 

Then you have stuff like this

 

https://www.mercurynews.com/2020/04/14/governor-newsom-mass-gatherings-not-in-the-cards-when-california-lockdown-is-lifted/

 

There is no official decision, but again, I can't imagine they will let THAT many people get together in a few months. OSU ticket office/Athletic Dept. is having major discussions.

[Exodus]

There is no official decision, but again, I can't imagine they will let THAT many people get together in a few months. OSU ticket office/Athletic Dept. is having major discussions.

I'm expecting my company to limit in person meeting sizes when we all get back in the office as well as limit travel.

[Mace1647545504]

My wife is saying her company is talking about having an A and B group to go in on alternating weeks, while the other works from home. This would go on for an undefined amount of time. This idea would keep the contact at a minimum.

I'll bet they have to do some kind of preventative before they go in to assure no one going in is sick.