Is this serious?

[Mallard]

This is something I have been wondering about. I'm assuming the "oldest" new vehicles are typically first in line to get the semiconductors as they come in, no? If it gets to the point where there's a ton of new vehicles that are actually a year (or more) old by the time they are complete, dealers can't realistically expect to sell them at their original MSRP, can they? I mean I guess if demand still outweighs supply they can do whatever they want.

I would agree. Lot rot is always a concern. I always remember a story from years ago where this happened to a bunch of Chrysler Crossfire's. I would think they'd stick to first in, first out at these lots.

 

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[2 Sweet]

You answered your own question there, but i've seen many people go in and put down payments on a car waiting for delivery because they are afraid it's only going to get worse so they want to "lock in" at the right now price. Dealerships are playing it up too.

 

Yeah, I guess I'm still holding out hope for a good deal on a leftover '21 truck next summer, but I'm not holding my breath.

[gillbot]

Yeah, I guess I'm still holding out hope for a good deal on a leftover '21 truck next summer, but I'm not holding my breath.

 

Even if things went magically "back to normal" right now, I think it would take a year or two for the panic to die off. Add the BS with the news pumping everything up, it's gonna WAY take longer. We were looking to replace my wife's DD but I think that fucker will rot and fall apart now before we replace it. I know of people that are paying WAY over MSRP for cars now because they fear "it'll get worse" and they keep spouting shortages as the cause for concern. Manufacturers are seeing this "panic buying" and they are soaking it up, why start producing in mass if you can make more profit with less right now?

[Mallard]

Yeah, I guess I'm still holding out hope for a good deal on a leftover '21 truck next summer, but I'm not holding my breath.

I'm hoping that when they have to dump a bunch of cars that have been sitting for a long time that they offer some super cheap leases to get them on the road. I wouldn't mind a Chevy Bolt as a cheap commuter and just before the stop-sale you could get them for $107/month...now they've been sitting another ~6 months.

 

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[BuckeyeROC]

I'm hoping that when they have to dump a bunch of cars that have been sitting for a long time that they offer some super cheap leases to get them on the road. I wouldn't mind a Chevy Bolt as a cheap commuter and just before the stop-sale you could get them for $107/month...now they've been sitting another ~6 months.

 

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I'd love to think we could score some cheap deals on new cars when things open up more, but I just can't see manufacturers being stupid enough to flood the market and tank prices. Also, I could realistically see the manufacturers convincing the govt to buy/bailout all those nasty ICE cars they made and can't flood the market with to really push EVs.

[Not Brian]

Lord Trump will save us in 2024

[STEVE-O]

This is something I have been wondering about. I'm assuming the "oldest" new vehicles are typically first in line to get the semiconductors as they come in, no? If it gets to the point where there's a ton of new vehicles that are actually a year (or more) old by the time they are complete, dealers can't realistically expect to sell them at their original MSRP, can they? I mean I guess if demand still outweighs supply they can do whatever they want.

 

You answered your own question there, but i've seen many people go in and put down payments on a car waiting for delivery because they are afraid it's only going to get worse so they want to "lock in" at the right now price. Dealerships are playing it up too.

 

 

nailed it,

 

Almost all our new vehicles are pre sold before they even hit the lot. Been like this for almost 6 months now. There is no way IF they get a bunch of "new" vehicles there will be any deals out there to be had. People are happy to pay sticker price for vehicles right now as that is a "deal" in this market.

 

When I see these wholesale values drop back under sticker price then I believe the market will start to adjust but we are a decent amount of time away from that.

 

Just for a rough example a 2022 Toyota 4runner trd pro stickers lets say at 55k after tax you will be let say 60k otd, used ones are listed and selling for 70+

again options and color change this but it shows you where we all stand.

 

IF you can FIND and new vehicle that is not already sold that you like, buy it because chances are in 1-1.5 maybe 2 years?? you will still sell it for the sticker price.

[Jewtoys]

I passed on an '04 911 Turbo Cab, X50 6-speed triple-black for $38k with just under 100k miles last year during COVID...

 

Ragerts.

 

I still want to put my bits in a vice, from passing on a built 930 for 30k roughly 7-8 years ago.

 

Since I’ve watched them continue to creep, thinking the market will eventually flop…….

 

 

Now you can’t buy anything, unless you’re willing to pay silly prices. I bought a new motorcycle 2 months ago, that I can sell for more than was paid from the dealer.

 

I hate it here!

[zeitgeist57]

Interesting point I was hearing from a dealership:

 

On the new side, dealers are looking to get and push out whatever allocation they can get from the OEMs, whether it's got chips or not, start/stop or doesn't, console wireless phone disabled, AFM disabled they're going to sell it. Dealer makes $$$$$

 

When the OEM provides a list of vehicles they've sold that don't have chips that now they DO have the chips/components for, the owners bring cars back for warranty work. Dealer makes $$

 

The PROBLEM for the industry is going to be downstream, when used-car dealers are getting these things from normie owners or auctions where the Monroney (window sticker) says "Wireless Phone Charging" and there's a dead space under the console. Does a used buyer find out that wireless charging doesn't work and go back to the used dealer? Is there a lawsuit they can file with GM? Can some dum-dum go after Vroom/Carvana/CarMax for warranty work?

 

That'll be an interesting result of this supply-chain issue...

[gillbot]

I'm kicking myself for not jumping on a new vehicle for the wife at the beginning of COVID when dealerships were doing anything to keep people interested in shopping. Passed on a number of good "delivery deals" because I just didn't want to move on it right then. Hindsight though right? Could have bought, kept her current then sold it now for more than it's really worth in this market.

[Mallard]

Interesting point I was hearing from a dealership:

 

On the new side, dealers are looking to get and push out whatever allocation they can get from the OEMs, whether it's got chips or not, start/stop or doesn't, console wireless phone disabled, AFM disabled they're going to sell it. Dealer makes $$$$$

 

When the OEM provides a list of vehicles they've sold that don't have chips that now they DO have the chips/components for, the owners bring cars back for warranty work. Dealer makes $$

 

The PROBLEM for the industry is going to be downstream, when used-car dealers are getting these things from normie owners or auctions where the Monroney (window sticker) says "Wireless Phone Charging" and there's a dead space under the console. Does a used buyer find out that wireless charging doesn't work and go back to the used dealer? Is there a lawsuit they can file with GM? Can some dum-dum go after Vroom/Carvana/CarMax for warranty work?

 

That'll be an interesting result of this supply-chain issue...

I didn't think anyone was selling a vehicle without a feature then retrofitting under warranty. The Monroney should be modified/accurate for what was delivered.

 

This will be a disaster for the used market though, as features that typically come on a specific trim level will be missing. GM just got rid of seat heaters on a bunch of cars, so if you had a Blazer built earlier this year you might have it, but if it was built in November or later tough luck. Jeep had air suspensions restricted earlier on the Grand Cherokee, not sure if it's been added back.

 

Dealers are desperate for cars. My neighbor at my cabin sells Chevy's and throughout the summer they had single digit inventory. She still sold ~26-35 cars per month though. Just like was said earlier, they're sold before they get off the truck.

 

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[STEVE-O]

Interesting point I was hearing from a dealership:

 

 

The PROBLEM for the industry is going to be downstream, when used-car dealers are getting these things from normie owners or auctions where the Monroney (window sticker) says "Wireless Phone Charging" and there's a dead space under the console. Does a used buyer find out that wireless charging doesn't work and go back to the used dealer? Is there a lawsuit they can file with GM? Can some dum-dum go after Vroom/Carvana/CarMax for warranty work?

 

That'll be an interesting result of this supply-chain issue...

 

I can't say 100% but I can probably say 99% of window stickers at any used lot have in small print that the sticker might not be accurate and you have to verify the options.

 

for instance it used to be jeeps would come factory with both hard and soft tops but rarely did you get both on the used side, so this small print on the used window sticker covered you for any issues such as that.

 

Also similar they do this to cover themselves to as if the vehicle had say aftermarket wheels or such the like that was not the Original manufacturer equipment.

[zeitgeist57]

Dealers are desperate for cars. My neighbor at my cabin sells Chevy's and throughout the summer they had single digit inventory. She still sold ~26-35 cars per month though. Just like was said earlier, they're sold before they get off the truck.

 

Agreed. Most dealers I talk to have more salespeople than cars on the lot.

[BuckeyeROC]

Agreed. Most dealers I talk to have more salespeople than cars on the lot.

 

But still making record profits.

[Turbs3000]

Interesting point I was hearing from a dealership:

 

On the new side, dealers are looking to get and push out whatever allocation they can get from the OEMs, whether it's got chips or not, start/stop or doesn't, console wireless phone disabled, AFM disabled they're going to sell it. Dealer makes $$$$$

 

When the OEM provides a list of vehicles they've sold that don't have chips that now they DO have the chips/components for, the owners bring cars back for warranty work. Dealer makes $$

 

The PROBLEM for the industry is going to be downstream, when used-car dealers are getting these things from normie owners or auctions where the Monroney (window sticker) says "Wireless Phone Charging" and there's a dead space under the console. Does a used buyer find out that wireless charging doesn't work and go back to the used dealer? Is there a lawsuit they can file with GM? Can some dum-dum go after Vroom/Carvana/CarMax for warranty work?

 

That'll be an interesting result of this supply-chain issue...

Chevy came to us and said they would give us 500 off per truck for the loss of heated seats, the came back and said just kidding you can have $50 and just bring the trucks back in after 2022Q2 and we will install the missing module. I get it but F them for flipping options on and off to fit their needs and preorders be damned.

I also love seeing Ford's in the system that the build date and warranty start date are 6mo from each other... We had/have 100s that spent time in fields.

The other thing we see is a ton of warranty issues on new trucks, absolutely through the roof. Even a bunch of stupid stuff like Laramies showing up with 1 black mirror and 1 white mirror.

Personally, I dont think oems will artificially throttle production ever. what I think you'll see a lot more of in 2022 is dealers flexing on new prices on orders. As oems push for build to order and prioritize it and as capacity rises to match it. Dealers will look to bank as many confirmed orders as they can.

 

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[Geeto67]

So...is there an upside to all of this?

 

Like in 2024 will it be easier to find "special order" cars with interesting options in the used market because the dealers were so sold out people had to order rather than take what was on the lot?

[Fiji ST]

 

When the OEM provides a list of vehicles they've sold that don't have chips that now they DO have the chips/components for, the owners bring cars back for warranty work. Dealer makes $$.

 

Which OEM is selling unfinished vehicles?