smashweights Posted October 24, 2009 Report Share Posted October 24, 2009 the other night on the news, they were talking about how the H1N1 vaccine was out and pretty blatantly said, albeit indirectly, "if you're not getting the vaccine you're essentially going to be a contributor to the spread of the disease and the death of others." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Likwid Posted October 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 25, 2009 the other night on the news, they were talking about how the H1N1 vaccine was out and pretty blatantly said, albeit indirectly, "if you're not getting the vaccine you're essentially going to be a contributor to the spread of the disease and the death of others."I agree with that, non-vaccinated people serve as a transport/target for biologicals.On another note, the Swine Flu = Fluhttp://www.thebestpageintheuniverse.net/c.cgi?u=swine_flu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReconRat Posted October 25, 2009 Report Share Posted October 25, 2009 the other night on the news, they were talking about how the H1N1 vaccine was out and pretty blatantly said, albeit indirectly, "if you're not getting the vaccine you're essentially going to be a contributor to the spread of the disease and the death of others."Hard to say what the outcome would be. It's possible that vaccinated people wouldn't stay home, if they got sick. That would spread it faster. The virus doesn't much care if you have the vaccination or not. It will still find a host in all people. Or spread without Humans as the host or as a co-host. Viruses mutate on demand, as required, in order to survive. It's even possible that the vaccination would promote a rapid mutation of the virus into something even more deadly to Humans. There's really no way of telling. Viruses have been around a lot longer than Humans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jporter29 Posted October 25, 2009 Report Share Posted October 25, 2009 I will be one 1 say I am a fan of the flu shot. I got one the day before the public had access to them this year only cause I work in a pharmacy and am exposed to all this crap going around and then some. Not to mention we have a 5 year old with severe allergies and asthma so if he gets sick he has no choice but to go to the hospital. So I think vaccinations are a good thing. If or when we get our H1N1 vaccine at work you better damn well believe im getting one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kosmo Posted October 25, 2009 Report Share Posted October 25, 2009 medicine has changed quite a bit in 91 years... peoples' fears are unrealistic and largey unrealistic.+1 zillion.......this thing blown out of proportion......only one thing is to be blamed for this.......... "MEDIA"......... assholes....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jporter12 Posted October 25, 2009 Report Share Posted October 25, 2009 Hard to say what the outcome would be. It's possible that vaccinated people wouldn't stay home, if they got sick. That would spread it faster. The virus doesn't much care if you have the vaccination or not. It will still find a host in all people. Or spread without Humans as the host or as a co-host. Viruses mutate on demand, as required, in order to survive. It's even possible that the vaccination would promote a rapid mutation of the virus into something even more deadly to Humans. There's really no way of telling. Viruses have been around a lot longer than Humans.See, this is what I have heard. I'm wondering if the virus has mutated faster due to so many being vaccinated? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jporter12 Posted October 25, 2009 Report Share Posted October 25, 2009 I will be one 1 say I am a fan of the flu shot. I got one the day before the public had access to them this year only cause I work in a pharmacy and am exposed to all this crap going around and then some. Not to mention we have a 5 year old with severe allergies and asthma so if he gets sick he has no choice but to go to the hospital. So I think vaccinations are a good thing. If or when we get our H1N1 vaccine at work you better damn well believe im getting one.I don't wanna hear it, now go grab me another water.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jporter29 Posted October 25, 2009 Report Share Posted October 25, 2009 Jporter12 bite me when you arent infected any longer and get your own water! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jporter12 Posted October 25, 2009 Report Share Posted October 25, 2009 Jporter12 bite me when you arent infected any longer and get your own water! Still contagious, and I don't want to infect any of the kids! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kawi kid Posted October 25, 2009 Report Share Posted October 25, 2009 Jporter12 bite me when you arent infected any longer and get your own water! Still contagious, and I don't want to infect any of the kids! i think this is the first marrital dispute i have ever encountered online Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chevysoldier Posted October 25, 2009 Report Share Posted October 25, 2009 See, this is what I have heard. I'm wondering if the virus has mutated faster due to so many being vaccinated?I don't wanna hear it, now go grab me another water....Jporter12 bite me when you arent infected any longer and get your own water! Still contagious, and I don't want to infect any of the kids! Wouldn't cell phones, or yelling be more effective? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jporter12 Posted October 25, 2009 Report Share Posted October 25, 2009 Wouldn't cell phones, or yelling be more effective? Would it be funny to the rest of you that way? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kawi kid Posted October 25, 2009 Report Share Posted October 25, 2009 Would it be funny to the rest of you that way? NO and i love it this way Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chevysoldier Posted October 25, 2009 Report Share Posted October 25, 2009 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smashweights Posted October 25, 2009 Report Share Posted October 25, 2009 was handwashing even a medically required practice in 1918? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kosmo Posted October 25, 2009 Report Share Posted October 25, 2009 (edited) I will little disagree, viruses do not mutate on demand, they mutate random. They also do not have the urge to survive as they are dead outside the host anyway, piece of protein. It's just the random mutated viruses get selected which evade the antibodies generated by the vaccine. The same way the antibiotic resistant bacteria develops. Many of the vaccines you get as a child is good for the rest of your life, because these viruses don't mutate that much, that's how smallpox have been eradicated. Why not influenza or HIV ? Cause their faulty enzyme mutate them so often that vacinnes do not work as the antibody generated by them fail to recognize the mutated virus.Particularly for influenza the genome is RNA and the genome synthesizing enzyme RNA polymerase is faulty to incorporate random mutations in their genetic material. This sometimes confers the ability of the virus to jump their original pool avian, swine, human to another and things get messy as it is not the same flu virus we get infected with. Our regular flu virus get mutated all the time so you need a vaccine every year, but this H1N1 is not a regular human flu virus. It's original pool was avian/swine and some mutations confers it the ability to infect humans now. The H1N1 as it is now will not kill you and it's symptoms are the same as regular flu.....so why the SCARE ??????It's because the scientists have seen the regular flu viruses for years and they know that they can't mutate to become deadly. Now for H1N1, it is a new virus whose natural host was not humans but pigs so the scientists do not know how possible mutations will affect the humans. It has not done anything yet but there is a possibility and that's the hype. And....many may be mad.........are CDC and we virologist looking for more limelight and grant money for research....Now everyone recalls 1918 flu pandemic which was also H1N1 type A Influenza virus. Most often overlooked how the people died. 1. The virus caused massive infection worldwide compared to normal flu.2. The flu caused lung lining (epithelia) thinning/inflamation (same as regular flu)3. All the people died due to bronchial pneumonia caused by secondary infection by bacteria as there was no antibiotics available....It's NOT going to happen now.So the status of H1N1 is like cold war era nuclear arms race right now, why take chances.If you want a peace of mind get the shot...no harm and the placebo have a huge positive effect on your daily life.Cartoon of an Influenza virusHA = H (1 for swine flu)NA = N (1 for swine flu)I work with the structure of the M2 shown in red the red box.Here is the atomic structure of it. Edited October 25, 2009 by Kosmo typo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kawi kid Posted October 25, 2009 Report Share Posted October 25, 2009 I will little disagree, viruses do not mutate on demand, they mutate random. They also do not have the urge to survive as they are dead outside the host anyway, piece of protein. It's just the random mutated viruses get selected which evade the antibodies generated by the vaccine. The same way the antibiotic resistant bacteria develops. Many of the vaccines you get as a child is good for the rest of your life, because these viruses don't mutate that much, that's how smallpox have been eradicated. Why not influenza or HIV ? Cause their faulty enzyme mutate them so often that vacinnes do not work as the antibody generated by them fail to recognize the mutated virus.Particularly for influenza the genome is RNA and the genome synthesizing enzyme RNA polymerase is faulty to incorporate random mutations in their genetic material. This sometimes confers the ability of the to virus jump their original pool avian, swine, human to another and things get messy as it is not the same flu virus we get infected with. Our regular flu virus get mutated all the time so you need a vaccine every year, but this H1N1 is not a regular human flu virus. It's original pool was avian/swine and some mutations confers it the ability to infect humans now. The H1N1 as it is now will not kill you and it's symptoms are the same as regular flu.....so why the SCARE ??????It's because the scientists have seen the regular flu viruses for years and they know that they can't mutate to become deadly. Now for H1N1, it is a new virus whose natural host was not humans but pigs so the scientists do not know how possible mutations will affect the humans. It has not done anything yet but there is a possibility and that's the hype. And....many may be mad.........are CDC and we virologist looking for more limelight and grant money for research....Now everyone recalls 1918 flu pandemic which was also H1N1 type A Influenza virus. Most often overlook how the people died. 1. The virus caused massive infection worldwide compared to normal flu.2. The flu caused lung lining (epithelia) thinning/inflamation (same as regular flu)3. All the people died due to bronchial pneumonia caused by secondary infection by bacteria as there was no antibiotics available....It's NOT going to happen now.So the status of H1N1 is like cold war era nuclear arms race right now, why take chances.If you want a peace of mind get the shot...no harm and the placebo have a huge positive effect on your daily life.I work with the structure of the M@ i trust this guy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Likwid Posted October 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 25, 2009 i trust this guy His reply was too long not to trust. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kawi kid Posted October 25, 2009 Report Share Posted October 25, 2009 His reply was too long not to trust. and he is a mad scientist.............. no really Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smashweights Posted October 25, 2009 Report Share Posted October 25, 2009 http://www.cnn.com/2009/HEALTH/10/24/h1n1.obama/index.htmldont worry it's officially a pandemic. maybe obama and H1N1 can have a beer together and sort this whole pandemic, end of the world thing together. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReconRat Posted October 25, 2009 Report Share Posted October 25, 2009 (edited) Yes Kosmo, that's all true. But it appears to me that viruses do not randomly just die out all that often. They do seem to mutate and survive.Virology isn't my chosen field, so I believe you.edit: Oh, and just to make people worry more. Antibiotics work great unless:1. You can't get the antibiotics quick enough.2. They run out of antibiotics.3. The bacteria becomes resistant. Edited October 25, 2009 by ReconRat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gixxie750 Posted October 25, 2009 Report Share Posted October 25, 2009 All i know for sure is this thing can spread super easy! My whole family has it!!! I have it kicked,but my son is on round 2 now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kawi kid Posted October 25, 2009 Report Share Posted October 25, 2009 dont worry it's officially a pandemic. maybe obama and H1N1 can have a beer together and sort this whole pandemic, end of the world thing together. lulz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReconRat Posted October 25, 2009 Report Share Posted October 25, 2009 All i know for sure is this thing can spread super easy! My whole family has it!!! I have it kicked,but my son is on round 2 now.That's scary right there. The CDC said it wouldn't spread that easy... oopsThey had said it would be a 1 in 10 to 1 in 20 chance of catching it from a family member.Apparently I had something like it when I was a kid, so I won't catch this one. Dunno, wait and see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kosmo Posted October 25, 2009 Report Share Posted October 25, 2009 Yes Kosmo, that's all true. But it appears to me that viruses do not randomly just die out all that often. They do seem to mutate and survive.Virology isn't my chosen field, so I believe you.edit: Oh, and just to make people worry more. Antibiotics work great unless:1. You can't get the antibiotics quick enough.2. They run out of antibiotics.3. The bacteria becomes resistant.Totally agree Tom........just a short note how the virus mutation works.....say for our H1N1....The piglet had a flu, the virus replicates in the pig cells (mainly lung epithelial cells) and it's faulty genome synthesizing machinery is causing billions of mutations in that pigs cell. So, that single pig has billions of the same virus but yhey are of different in genetic makeup. Some will not even replicate and die out, others will. Now the pig sneezes drops saliva on so many different surfaces in the barn....fine. The viruses on this surfaces are apparently dead and just a piece of complex glycoprotein. After two years Christopher Robin touches one of this surface which had the billions of virusus in a dust particle.....then scratches his nose. They get into the mucosal membrane of the nose by mechanical transmission. They float around and find a cell....this is where it jumps back to life, it fuses with the cell and start replicating. This is for the first time a strain of pig flu virus, which was mutated long back and dormant, infected a human. This is the first and only H1N1 out of those billions of dormant viruses which due to mutations got the ability to jump from pig to infect humans. The rest of the viruses were also transmitted by the kid but they will just simply not replicate in humans due to their different genetic makeup except the H1N1.Just as a last note. Bacteria are million times larger than viruses and they are alive outside a living cell as well unlike viruses. Antibiotic resistant strains develops as well the same way due to random mutations and natural selection of the survival of the fittest. Now with 4th and 5th generation antibiotics it will not be hard to outsmart them..but overconfidence is not a goodthing........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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