New Erik Buell Interview

[InyaAzz]

Here

Looks like Buell had a water cooled enginer back in 98..ready to go! Harley took it, changed it, and stuck it in the VRod. Nice.

Edited January 28, 2010 by InyaAzz

[Disclaimer]

Hmmm, wasn't as dramatic or nasty as I thought it would be.

[InyaAzz]

I think he wants to tell more...but his hands (and tongue) are tied by his NDA.

I see there is a new Buell race bike....the 1190RR. Two have been sold...but mums the word so far.

[35RFTW]

Actually Harley had one ready to go in the 70's and backed out. Google the Nova Project. DOHC and water cooled. Shot down then too, but more because of the transfer of HD to AMC back and forth.

[InyaAzz]

I think the thing that pisses me off more than anything, is the fact that Buell had a water cooled engine ready to go, and HD took it, 'cruiserfied' it, and stuck it in the VRod. Then, they tell Buell to sit tight, they can get their engine back when HD is done with it. And by the time HD is done with it, it's totally unworkable for a sport bike. Wow. That explains a lot...explains why they stuck with the air cooled crap for so long..it was the only engine they had complete control over.

[Ryan_c_F]

I f*cking hate Harley.

I'll never ride one as long as I live.

[Tpoppa]

I think the thing that pisses me off more than anything, is the fact that Buell had a water cooled engine ready to go, and HD took it, 'cruiserfied' it, and stuck it in the VRod. Then, they tell Buell to sit tight, they can get their engine back when HD is done with it. And by the time HD is done with it, it's totally unworkable for a sport bike. Wow. That explains a lot...explains why they stuck with the air cooled crap for so long..it was the only engine they had complete control over.

Some Buell insiders post on Badweb. It had been suggested for awhile that the Vrod motor was originally a Buell project that HD took over. From what I have read, it sems that it was a 'hostile' takeover, with HD execs feeling that Buell should not have a more capable motor than HD.

Buell funded & developed the 1125 motor directly with Rotax. HD authorized the development but was not involved. It has also been suggested that when the new HD CEO came aboard (Wandell) that a few HD execs that were anti-Buell/Sportbike were pissed off about Buell working with Rotax pushed for Buell to be discontinued. Who knows what was actually said...

Anyway, that was a good read. He seems quite cordial, but I'd bet he is furious about quite a few decisions made by HD. Erik is a racer at heart, seems like he builds street bikes so he has money to build race bikes.

[InyaAzz]

+1. Never knew that until this interview. Very interesting. I like the XB platform.. air cooled' date=' and everything. I would like to view into a crystal ball that could show Buell right now if they had the freedom to do what Erik wanted to do with that V-Rod engine.[/quote']

I love my XB9, very under rated, like you said before. I shouldn't have said 'air cooled crap'. Buell did an awesome job with the Sportster engine, considering what they had to work with. What I meant to say is basically what you said....Buell had enormous potential. I think Erik said that what we've seen from Buell is only about 10% of where he wants them to be.

Some Buell insiders post on Badweb. It had been suggested for awhile that the Vrod motor was originally a Buell project that HD took over. From what I have read, it sems that it was a 'hostile' takeover, with HD execs feeling that Buell should not have a more capable motor than HD.

Buell funded & developed the 1125 motor directly with Rotax. HD authorized the development but was not involved. It has also been suggested that when the new HD CEO came aboard (Wandell) that a few HD execs that were anti-Buell/Sportbike were pissed off about Buell working with Rotax pushed for Buell to be discontinued. Who knows what was actually said...

Anyway, that was a good read. He seems quite cordial, but I'd bet he is furious about quite a few decisions made by HD. Erik is a racer at heart, seems like he builds street bikes so he has money to build race bikes.

I think...very tactfully, Erik confirmed everything you've said above. I agree...I bet he's fuming inside. And I don't care what HD says...if they wanted to sell Buell, they could have. Anything is possible. If you ask me, they don't want Buell getting anywhere NEAR their potential with another company. A strong and fast Buell bike, post HD. would reflect badly on them. They'll let Erik race...cause you won't see those bikes on the street. And at the end of the non compete agreement, they're hoping it will be a distant memory.

Fuck em. Fuck em all!

[redkow97]

i'd be curious to see how their non-compete is worded.

traditionally, it has to be a reasonable amount of time (around 3 years), a reasonable geographic restriction (no idea what that would be for a company that sells internationally), and there has to be convincing evidence that Buell's competition would ACTUALLY harm H-D as far as profits.

Buell himself claimed that their typical buyer was '10 years younger than the typical HD buyer, and getting younger.'

there's no way HD could make even the smallest argument that sportbike sales cannibalize cruiser sales...

[Tpoppa]

Buell sold 98% to HD and retained 2%. It's been suggested that the 2% includes patents and other IP.

The motorcycle market is shit now anyway, so a 3 year non-compete might not be all bad. He has 3 years to continue R&D for 'race only' bikes. Hopefully, http://www.erikbuellracing.com/ makes enough to pay the bills. I wouldn't be surprised if he is involved with a new American Sportbike by 2013 or 2014.

Personally, I would love to see Erik develop an American Sport Tourer and pull some sales from those HD touring-glide-models.

btw, HOG stock was over $70, now under $23 and projected to go even lower. Well done FAGS!

[redkow97]

Irrelevant. HD can crush Erik Buell with litigation costs.

valid enough point' date=' but how'd that work out for Monster Energy and the "Vermonster" beer guy?

HD certainly has a loyal following, but it's also a pretty 'patriotic' crowd. I don't think they'd like HD holding down another American company. How many HD riders have been down-sized in the last 2 years? the idea of HD [i']keeping 190 people out of work claiming 'competition' might strike a nerve...

[Fonzie]

Cornfused.....

I thought it was accepted common knowledge Porche built the vRod motor. :???:

I even remember seeing a Discovery Channel/TLC special about the building of it however many years ago

[zx0neFouR]

Buell has failed me for the last time

[Tpoppa]

If you needed another reason to hate Harley.

This information was widely speculated, but not made public until recently, much to the dismay of Harley. HD had a chance in increase their bottom line for the year and save American jobs in the process...

I would love to see the business case for the shuttering of Buell. The financial benefits from a tax write off are no where near the benefits that would have resulted from selling the Buell division.

With that sort of financial ahem 'expertise' it's no surprise HD stock is below $23/share, down from $70.

[InyaAzz]

Grrrrrr

[RFM]

The Twinks.... That's all I can say. At a time when there was a good V-Twin alternative, the program is cut. Though not a superbike, it was a capable bike. Harley will not get another cent from me, and I have owned two of their bikes. A past customer- lost for good.

[alienpi]

Buell would have been better off being sold at a dealer such as Competition Accessories that sells other innovative brands such as Suzuki, Yamaha, Kawasaki, Honda, and Yamaha. There seemed to be a lot of undeserved disdain for Buell at many of the HD dealers.

The people that buy Buells aren't in the Harley shop looking at cruisers and magically get turned into a sport bike rider. The Buell riders seem to be the ones that are used to the non-HD shops, because in order to get any real equipment that's where they have to go. (I don't recall seeing any RF1000s at the few HD shops that I've visited.)