Arizona set to ban state affirmative action programs

[Uncle Punk]

I was going to take him in a whole different direction but carry on Garrett.

I love me the affirmative action bitches, it's what makes me work, so I can afford the finer things in life.

[cg2112]

Nope I need you to call my black friends and tell them they are not allowed to be successful because their kroger sucked. It's not black white it's rich poor. Your assumption that blacks need help is ignorant and displays your lack of faith in them.

That's one of the dumbest things I've ever read in here.

It has nothing to do with faith in blacks. It has everything to do with the advantages that white people have, right now, simply by being white.

It's not about blacks being less capable. I certainly don't believe that blacks are less capable. I do believe, however, that whites have more advantage just by being white.

Despite your claim that blacks ruin their own neighborhoods, the fact of the matter is that inner cities get less money for education and infrastructure. As a result, many black students are less prepared for college and employment than whites with similar economic conditions.

And that doesn't address the fact that white families are far, far more likely to have wealth than black families, again, giving whites advantage when it comes to resources (whites typically have much more wealth than blacks of the same income level - 10 times higher, in fact - maybe because they spend so much on rims?). White families, even in the middle class, have had many generations to build wealth, something blacks have not had, and the gap in wealth is only getting wider. It's quadrupled in the last 30 years.

Then there's simply institutional racism that gives whites an advantage. The unemployment rate for blacks is twice as high as it is for whites. I suppose you could argue that in the same way that blacks ruin their own neighborhoods, they don't try to find jobs - but it's also true of black college graduates. The unemployment rate for black college graduates is twice as high as white graduates. And with a job, a black employee typically earns significantly less than whites for the same job - which blacks are much less likely to get if they have a black sounding name on their resume.

Capability has nothing to do with it. Blacks are just as capable as whites, but it's foolish to claim that whites don't have an advantage just by being white. I don't necessarily think that blacks need help, which is why I don't support the sort of affirmative action that exists today. I think the system needs help, because the system, right now, treats whites better than it treats blacks. I'm not saying that you should make an extra effort to hire black people. I'm saying that by the time the average black person is interviewing for a job, he should have the same opportunity and advantages as the average white person competing for the same job. Right now, that simply is not the case.

Edited November 6, 2010 by cg2112

[shittygsxr]

I will personally walk you around the med ctr and you can tell this to all of the black nurses and doctors. Or you can tell the nurses that earn 80k and just got here from Africa a couple years ago. I am sure they will laugh in your face. This is a real offer.

That's one of the dumbest things I've ever read in here.

It has nothing to do with faith in blacks. It has everything to do with the advantages that white people have, right now, simply by being white.

It's not about blacks being less capable. I certainly don't believe that blacks are less capable. I do believe, however, that whites have more advantage just by being white.

Despite your claim that blacks ruin their own neighborhoods, the fact of the matter is that inner cities get less money for education and infrastructure. As a result, many black students are less prepared for college and employment than whites with similar economic conditions.

And that doesn't address the fact that white families are far, far more likely to have wealth than black families, again, giving whites advantage when it comes to resources (whites typically have much more wealth than blacks of the same income level - 10 times higher, in fact - maybe because they spend so much on rims?). White families, even in the middle class, have had many generations to build wealth, something blacks have not had, and the gap in wealth is only getting wider. It's quadrupled in the last 30 years.

Then there's simply institutional racism that gives whites an advantage. The unemployment rate for blacks is twice as high as it is for whites. I suppose you could argue that in the same way that blacks ruin their own neighborhoods, they don't try to find jobs - but it's also true of black college graduates. The unemployment rate for black college graduates is twice as high as white graduates. And with a job, a black employee typically earns significantly less than whites for the same job - which blacks are much less likely to get if they have a black sounding name on their resume.

Capability has nothing to do with it. Blacks are just as capable as whites, but it's foolish to claim that whites don't have an advantage just by being white. I don't necessarily think that blacks need help, which is why I don't support the sort of affirmative action that exists today. I think the system needs help, because the system, right now, treats whites better than it treats blacks. I'm not saying that you should make an extra effort to hire black people. I'm saying that by the time the average black person is interviewing for a job, he should have the same opportunity and advantages as the average white person competing for the same job. Right now, that simply is not the case.

[drew95gt]

Hiring should be based on education and/or experience...end of story. Race should have no part of it.

[cg2112]

I will personally walk you around the med ctr and you can tell this to all of the black nurses and doctors. Or you can tell the nurses that earn 80k and just got here from Africa a couple years ago. I am sure they will laugh in your face. This is a real offer.

You think because you know some successful black people that there's a level playing field? What does the fact that you know some black people have to do with anything?

Recognizing that whites have an advantage over black by virtue of being white doesn't mean that blacks cannot be successful.

The fact of the matter is, only 4% of doctors (and nurses, for that matter) are black, which is odd, given that 13% of the population is black. Maybe most blacks are just too tired after destroying their own neighborhoods to pursue a career in medicine?

Also, what medical center are we talking about? Are they hiring in IT? I only ask because if your black nurses are making $80K a year after just a couple of years, despite the fact that RN's with years of experience earn around $75K on the high end, I can't imagine how much they'd overpay an engineer with 15 years of experience!

[Cypress]

is gettin' thick in here. Please continue with the shananagans (dispite them actually changing minds and going anywhere).

[Disclaimer]

This is what I get for only reading the first page when this thread was started.... I missed all the good stuff.

*I like affirmative action because it keeps my white male rump employed since I'm confident in my skill set. What is the company gonna do? Fire me and let all the quota-fillers try to do my job? Good luck.

*This paragraph was a joke.

Seriously though, I'm gonna be Switzerland here and agree that the best qualified candidates should fill positions, but there are some inherent systematic/institutional issues that sometimes hinder a class of people (not just blacks, there are poor whites too) from stepping up to their potential, which sets that class of people at a disadvantage, but nothing they shouldn't be able to overcome with all the other social programs we have and good mentoring.

[Cheech]

AZ is the shit.

It's about time someone stepped up to do this shit. I missed out on becoming a Cincinnati Police Officer about 3-4 years ago due to this shit. I scored a 94% on my test and got through most of everything else, only to lose out on some spots to guys/women that scored in the mid-high 80's. What a fucking joke. If my life is on the line, I want the next best covering my ass...don't care if you're white, black, yellow, brown, or fucking purple.

I haven't met you in the flesh yet, but with as much reactionary jingoistic stuff you post on here, if you were anything like that in real life I shudder to think at the type of cop you would be.

[Disclaimer]

Black Male Students Doing Worse Than Bad

Among the findings of the new report from the Council of the Great City Schools, as summarized in the NYT today:

• "Only 12 percent of black fourth-grade boys are proficient in reading, compared with 38 percent of white boys, and only 12 percent of black eighth-grade boys are proficient in math, compared with 44 percent of white boys."
  
• Also, young white male students who are in poverty do as well as young black male students who are not in poverty.
  
• "In high school, African-American boys drop out at nearly twice the rate of white boys, and their SAT scores are on average 104 points lower."
  
• Only 5% of college students in 2008 were black men. At the same time, black men were incarcerated more than any other demographic group—at 6.5 times the rate of white males.
  

Re-ignition -- flame on ORDN, flame on.

[max power]

Shouldnt that read Anglo-American or Euro-American boys?

[shittygsxr]

The NBA is racist because there are more black players than white. I will be boycotting the NBA until this issue is corrected.

[max power]

The NBA is racist because there are more black players than white. I will be boycotting the NBA until this issue is corrected.

:lol:Hockey too. I'm not watching NHL until they get some Mexican-Americans involved.

[shittygsxr]

I am also boycotting Rap, BET, and all Tyler Perry movies because of the lack of whites

At first I thought maybe I never was good in basketball because my mother never encouraged me to practice or play, but now I know it is because the NBA is full of racists.

I also thought I did well in school because my mother encouraged me to do well and if I didnt listen to her "encouragement" she would whoop my ass, turns out it was because I am white (end sarcasm)

[cg2112]

There's actually something to that. Not that the NBA or the NHL are racist exactly, but it really comes down to economics. Blacks are poorer than whites, and live mostly in urban areas. Basketball is cheap and played in the city. Hockey, on the other hand, is expensive and typically played in more rural areas (not to mention places that can afford a rink).