May just get Mag rims

[attackpainter]

Youre wanting to earn an ama pro card and youre saying you cant sort out issues with suspension? Dont waste any money on wheels. If Superstock and supersport guys can run em why cant you?

Listen to lizard. Get on some quality rubber and evaluate them with your tire guy. Get to know somone with a suspension service like T-man or John at ctr.

At club level theres absolutley no need for those wheels.

[owndjoo]

chris, do whatever you want buddy. it's all about what makes you happy. you've been ridin for a while and have plenty of experience, if you dont see yourself getting a lot better then why not add some bling and make the bike what you want. i'd love to be able to put some marchesinis on my gixxer for the sb/fx stuff, but i cant afford that stuff, bout the same price as buildin my motor, and the motor will make me a lot faster. do what you want and have fun with it, you seem to see it as a hobby so just have fun. not everyone is out there trying to make a career out of racing

[Moto-Brian]

chris, do whatever you want buddy. it's all about what makes you happy. you've been ridin for a while and have plenty of experience, if you dont see yourself getting a lot better then why not add some bling and make the bike what you want. i'd love to be able to put some marchesinis on my gixxer for the sb/fx stuff, but i cant afford that stuff, bout the same price as buildin my motor, and the motor will make me a lot faster. do what you want and have fun with it, you seem to see it as a hobby so just have fun. not everyone is out there trying to make a career out of racing

Got to see your motor over at Reuben's house last week. The head looked really good!!!

[flounder]

Got to see your motor over at Reuben's house last week. The head looked really good!!!

Could it have looked worse then stock... Seriously though..

Dipshit..:D:D

[Moto-Brian]

Could it have looked worse then stock... Seriously though..

Dipshit..:D:D

Well, considering that the HP it had before the tear down and the fact he had enough carbon build-up to coat a house, I thought I'd let him know it looked really good to validate the money he spent.

Cock smoker...:flingpoo:

[owndjoo]

lol, yea they said it made like 95hp before the tear down!! makes me feel really good about the times i was runnin at mid-o. can't wait for the final numbers and to get on that beast

[yotaman88210]

Damn, thats exciting. Now you might not be able to wave as you fly past me... u may be going to fast! ha

[flounder]

lol, yea they said it made like 95hp before the tear down!! makes me feel really good about the times i was runnin at mid-o. can't wait for the final numbers and to get on that beast

wow... AMA here comes Drew. This year will be fun.

[Chrisoh]

I was looking at Schwantz school, but only weekend i have open to do it on his schedule is June 30 July 1st.

Well I got the rear spring changed down at Talladega (rear sag was 20mm more then it needed to be) and the front felt more responsive mid corner.

So i guess 20mm of change in sag will negate the feel of the difference in tire size.

Can't complain about the bridgestones though. The still feel controllable once I started to pic it up.

Yeah Drew you will probably pick up a good second or more at Mid OH with 25 more HP.

[owndjoo]

i've had the same problem with my setup, although my forks had 44mm of sag and my shock 17mm when we checked at the end of the year at mid-o. so now that i've got the motor, it's time to get the suspension actually set up right so i dont end up on my head! lol oh and brian, i'm considering a 190 pirelli again this year, i guess i should talk to reuben about that, eh?

[Chrisoh]

i've had the same problem with my setup, although my forks had 44mm of sag and my shock 17mm when we checked at the end of the year at mid-o. so now that i've got the motor, it's time to get the suspension actually set up right so i dont end up on my head! lol oh and brian, i'm considering a 190 pirelli again this year, i guess i should talk to reuben about that, eh?

Yeah I had 51mm total sag in the rear and my front was good around 30mm.

I may see if I can get Carr to order me a longer inlet for the Ohlins, since as it stands I can't add any Rear Ride height since it is at the limit now.

[Moto-Brian]

i've had the same problem with my setup, although my forks had 44mm of sag and my shock 17mm when we checked at the end of the year at mid-o. so now that i've got the motor, it's time to get the suspension actually set up right so i dont end up on my head! lol oh and brian, i'm considering a 190 pirelli again this year, i guess i should talk to reuben about that, eh?

Yeah, talk it over with him. I think it is an either you like it or you don't deal with a 600...

Rub is trying to get his buddy's R6 down there. Orient built his motor and he got to dyno it at a shop that is well known for having a good dyno set-up. Indy's deal is they don't have the upgrade to compensate for these new FI units...

Reuben thinks the dyno shows about 10 hp less than what it really is. So, your bike was probably at 105 in real numbers... I heard he got 108 the last run and with some race gas, it'll pull more. Add 10 and you'll be at the 120ish with race gas. Very respectable...

Of course, don't ask Reuben what his ZX6R had last year or what his 07 has stock!!!

[Moto-Brian]

i've had the same problem with my setup, although my forks had 44mm of sag and my shock 17mm when we checked at the end of the year at mid-o.

Yeah, you need your suspenders set, too. I'd run it by Reuben when you pick teh bike up and see if they will set your sag numbers as a baseline before the season... Did we set it at 32 or 35mm? I can't remember... It should be around 35mm front and rear or so... All I remember is it was a mess and we were shocked it was so damn stiff!!!

[Todd#43]

Yeah I had 51mm total sag in the rear and my front was good around 30mm.

I may see if I can get Carr to order me a longer inlet for the Ohlins, since as it stands I can't add any Rear Ride height since it is at the limit now.

We always ran 38-42mm of rider sag up front, and 10mm of static sag on the rear. It really seemed to be a pretty good base line set up to work from. I can't recall ever changing the sag to get things more comfortable. Typically it was a compression or rebound adjustment to get the timing right.

Geometry is another story. Maybe you should get the bike measured and set up with a base line set up to start with. Rake, trail, swingarm slope are all related - mucking about with one will change the others. Also, your 1000 has adjustable SA pivots so you have a shit load of options. All of that can just confuse you if you're not starting out from a "known" set of numbers.

[flounder]

All I remember is it was a mess and we were shocked it was so damn stiff!!!

I have a feeling Im going to learn what stiff is like with the 1.0's that are in my forks this year.

Of course Im probably not good enough to notice it.............

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YET.

But for the price, I couldnt beat it and I can always just throw a .95 in 1 fork and keep the 1.0 in the other... assuming I ever need it which I doubt.

[Chrisoh]

We always ran 38-42mm of rider sag up front, and 10mm of static sag on the rear. It really seemed to be a pretty good base line set up to work from. I can't recall ever changing the sag to get things more comfortable. Typically it was a compression or rebound adjustment to get the timing right.

Geometry is another story. Maybe you should get the bike measured and set up with a base line set up to start with. Rake, trail, swingarm slope are all related - mucking about with one will change the others. Also, your 1000 has adjustable SA pivots so you have a shit load of options. All of that can just confuse you if you're not starting out from a "known" set of numbers.

I had my 600 set to 6 mm static sag when I moved to the 475 spring.

Rueben put in the Swingarm Offsets, but I hadn't ridden it hard with it the other way. Right now I just need to ride it and not make any changes. Now I am at 35mm total Sag rear.

[Moto-Brian]

We always ran 38-42mm of rider sag up front, and 10mm of static sag on the rear. It really seemed to be a pretty good base line set up to work from. I can't recall ever changing the sag to get things more comfortable. Typically it was a compression or rebound adjustment to get the timing right.

Geometry is another story. Maybe you should get the bike measured and set up with a base line set up to start with. Rake, trail, swingarm slope are all related - mucking about with one will change the others. Also, your 1000 has adjustable SA pivots so you have a shit load of options. All of that can just confuse you if you're not starting out from a "known" set of numbers.

I really like 35-38mm sag anymore, as well... I think anything less than 35 is kinda going the wrong way... I might be wrong, though. Just my personal feelings on what I like.

[Moto-Brian]

I have a feeling Im going to learn what stiff is like with the 1.0's that are in my forks this year.

Of course Im probably not good enough to notice it.............

.

.

.

.

.

.

.

.

.

YET.

But for the price, I couldnt beat it and I can always just throw a .95 in 1 fork and keep the 1.0 in the other... assuming I ever need it which I doubt.

Your weight is a border line deal. I think it is too stiff a spring, as well... BUT, you and I can trade a spring each and get a .97 rate...

[flounder]

Your weight is a border line deal. I think it is too stiff a spring, as well... BUT, you and I can trade a spring each and get a .97 rate...

Good Point... never thought of that.. Only time will tell..

[Todd#43]

I had my 600 set to 6 mm static sag when I moved to the 475 spring.

Rueben put in the Swingarm Offsets, but I hadn't ridden it hard with it the other way. Right now I just need to ride it and not make any changes. Now I am at 35mm total Sag rear.

6mm doesnt seem like enough. A lot of it is a "personal" thing, but I prefer a little "softer" setting - especially at tracks like Nelson. If the front is bottoming out I can typically change that with a click or two of compression. I like the rear a little softer as well. It just feels better to me.

If you have the swingarm offsets in or out it doesnt really make a difference, especially if you dont know where your geometry is to start with. Once you have a base line, you can change elements based on what the bike is or isnt doing. If you dont know where it is, you really dont know what raising the rear will do to your rake and trail, etc. Make sense?

A lot of people think geometry and suspension set up are bullshit, but I know different from my own experience. I dropped 12 seconds in one season at Nelson (high 20's to mid teens) just by learning more about how the chassis and suspension work. Magnesium rims wont do that for ya.

[Moto-Brian]

6mm doesnt seem like enough. A lot of it is a "personal" thing, but I prefer a little "softer" setting - especially at tracks like Nelson. If the front is bottoming out I can typically change that with a click or two of compression. I like the rear a little softer as well. It just feels better to me.

If you have the swingarm offsets in or out it doesnt really make a difference, especially if you dont know where your geometry is to start with. Once you have a base line, you can change elements based on what the bike is or isnt doing. If you dont know where it is, you really dont know what raising the rear will do to your rake and trail, etc. Make sense?

A lot of people think geometry and suspension set up are bullshit, but I know different from my own experience. I dropped 12 seconds in one season at Nelson (high 20's to mid teens) just by learning more about how the chassis and suspension work. Magnesium rims wont do that for ya.

I usually do about 10mm... I think Chris needs to focus on suspension set-up on PROPER tires and quit saying the Bridgestones are fine. They aren't. They are a great track day tire or entry level race tire, but not what I would use on a GSXR1000 at ANY level.

If you want to get better, get aquainted with how suspension works. Maybe Todd will validate, but I think suspension outweighs about anything else...

The ability to change pivot points is useless unless you know what it will/can do. Again, basics are much better than bling. At this point, you have the best of everything and the lowest regarded tire... Spend the extra $50-$100 a set like I've been saying and focus on set-up. You'll get faster as a result of proper set-up and tires than fancy wheels and components...

But, like Drew said - do what you feel is best for you. If you have the cash to drop on wheels, do it. I'd just suggest doing the tires and learning suspension set-up techniques and learning what your suspension is doing...

[Todd#43]

I usually do about 10mm... I think Chris needs to focus on suspension set-up on PROPER tires and quit saying the Bridgestones are fine. They aren't. They are a great track day tire or entry level race tire, but not what I would use on a GSXR1000 at ANY level.

If you want to get better, get aquainted with how suspension works. Maybe Todd will validate, but I think suspension outweighs about anything else...

The ability to change pivot points is useless unless you know what it will/can do. Again, basics are much better than bling. At this point, you have the best of everything and the lowest regarded tire... Spend the extra $50-$100 a set like I've been saying and focus on set-up. You'll get faster as a result of proper set-up and tires than fancy wheels and components...

But, like Drew said - do what you feel is best for you. If you have the cash to drop on wheels, do it. I'd just suggest doing the tires and learning suspension set-up techniques and learning what your suspension is doing...

I think you can set a bike up for whatever tires you want to run. Is the Bridgestone the best tire for that bike? I dunno, I do know that a lot of guys seem to like them on the smaller bikes. That being said, different tires may offer better grip, different profiles, etc. I know I started on Michelins and when I went to MPH I made the switch to Dunlops. To me, the difference was dramatic. Turn in was much more linear where the Michelins made the bike feel like it was "falling" into the corner. We had tons and tons of setup data and a relationship with Dunlop, so it was better for me. I also felt more comfortable on the Dunlops, and that made a big difference as well.

Without a doubt the chassis set up (suspension and geometry) is the most critical element of turning fast, consistent, comfortable laps. If you haven't taken the time to understand it or figure it out you're really missing out. No doubt about it.

[owndjoo]

i've got 1.0's in the forks right now and no idea what the rear spring is. i'm def. gonna try to get a baseline setup before i bring the thing home. suspension also depends on your style. brian jumped on my bike and said it was crazy loose, but to me it never moves unless i'm on the rear brake slidin it in. Everyone has a dif. style and therefore the so called magic numbers dont work for everyone. i like to slide the bike into and out of corners, it's the mxer in me i guess. other people want the thing to be on rails and never wiggle. some people brake hard up and down and throw it in while others like to trail the brakes to apex. all require different setups

[Moto-Brian]

i've got 1.0's in the forks right now and no idea what the rear spring is. i'm def. gonna try to get a baseline setup before i bring the thing home. suspension also depends on your style. brian jumped on my bike and said it was crazy loose, but to me it never moves unless i'm on the rear brake slidin it in. Everyone has a dif. style and therefore the so called magic numbers dont work for everyone. i like to slide the bike into and out of corners, it's the mxer in me i guess. other people want the thing to be on rails and never wiggle. some people brake hard up and down and throw it in while others like to trail the brakes to apex. all require different setups

You better watch it there kiddo... Talk like that is going to have people thinking you're growing up!! You feeling alright?

[Todd#43]

i've got 1.0's in the forks right now and no idea what the rear spring is. i'm def. gonna try to get a baseline setup before i bring the thing home. suspension also depends on your style. brian jumped on my bike and said it was crazy loose, but to me it never moves unless i'm on the rear brake slidin it in. Everyone has a dif. style and therefore the so called magic numbers dont work for everyone. i like to slide the bike into and out of corners, it's the mxer in me i guess. other people want the thing to be on rails and never wiggle. some people brake hard up and down and throw it in while others like to trail the brakes to apex. all require different setups

I'll agree that there is no "magic number" that works for everyone. However, those "magic numbers" give you a starting point, and a frame of reference for every adjustment you make. If you don't know where you're starting, how do you know where to go?

There are two ways to do it:

1. Listen to your buddy that runs 6mm of static sag in the rear, the other guy that dropped his forks 2.0mm into the top tree, the dude that pitted next to you that's raised the rear 12.0mm, and that internet post on gixxer.com that said "you have to use the 2.5mm offset swing arm pivots". Ride the bike, and make adjustments to everything you can, every time you pit, and HOPE that you get something that works.
   
2. Take your bike to a shop that specializes in chassis set up and geometry. Have them measure your bike and set it up to a set of known set of values. Ride the bike, and make small changes, one at a time based on the feedback you're getting while you're on the track.

I've tried both, and for my money I'll pick #2 every time. It may cost more (about the price of a power commander and a custom map), but the time it takes to get a good set up underneath you is much shorter, plus you'll learn a lot more about how your bike works in the process.