Steve Butters Posted December 16, 2012 Report Share Posted December 16, 2012 (edited) anyone have any advice or tips for separating a cylinder head from the block? its a sohc engine, so using compression to blow it off wont workall the bolts are out (triple checked, and im following alldata step by step)....i tried prying on the point they mentioned in the manual and that i saw people on youtube doing and its just dead stuck to the head....even snapped a screw driveri put some accessory bolts back in and lifted on them with all my strength and i actually started to lift the entire motor and the head still wont separatetried beating on it with a rubber mallet...nothingis there a trick to this?http://s286.photobucket.com/albums/ll112/tbutera2112/?action=view¤t=20121216_180915.mp4 Edited December 16, 2012 by Steve Butters Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsxr1000bill Posted December 16, 2012 Report Share Posted December 16, 2012 Can of gas and a pack of matches!Good luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scruit Posted December 16, 2012 Report Share Posted December 16, 2012 Pry it with something bigger than a screwdriver. Heads usually have a pry point cast into them...What kind of car/engine? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simplysix Posted December 16, 2012 Report Share Posted December 16, 2012 Pry it with something bigger than a screwdriver. Heads usually have a pry point cast into them...What kind of car/engine?I was thinking the opposite but I could be wrong. I thought you were never supposed to pry anywhere because of the potential for damaging the mating surfaces, Espicially when dealing with an aluminum block or head. But like I said, I could be wrong Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Butters Posted December 16, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 16, 2012 ive been over it over and over again....theres no bolts holding it....it just wont come off the dowels...theres 10 head bolts and all 10 are removed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Butters Posted December 16, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 16, 2012 its a 97 saturn sc1....1.9L i think? 1.8 maybe...idkand i wasnt prying on a mating surface, just a casting mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scruit Posted December 16, 2012 Report Share Posted December 16, 2012 Probably galled/siezed on the dowels. Bigger hammer?Any way to use C4? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
standout Posted December 16, 2012 Report Share Posted December 16, 2012 Are u planning on having the head milled at a machine shop? Out of the hundreds of engines I've torn apart I have never had a head stuck on a block that bad. If u are having the head checked and milled then a few scratches from separating with a screwdriver or pry bar won't matter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Butters Posted December 16, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 16, 2012 (edited) no just gasket replace....budget repairsjust re-read alldata instructions and i made sure i hit every step....i dont know what is going on....its like its just stuck on there....i can lift the whole engine by the head and the weight of the engine wont even pop it out of the dowels Edited December 16, 2012 by Steve Butters Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vf1000ride Posted December 17, 2012 Report Share Posted December 17, 2012 Something I have done in the past. Remove camshaft so you can be absolutely sure all the valves are closed. Put all the sparkplugs back in and then crank the engine with the starter. The combustion chamber pressure should be able to pop the head up and off the block dowel pins.As a very big warning. Do not try this if there is any anti freeze or water in any of the cylinders, or if any of the valves can't be confirmed as fully closed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gixxus Christ! Posted December 17, 2012 Report Share Posted December 17, 2012 I thought my 750 head was seized on the dowels when I was taking it apart, turns out there were some screws down underneath the cam towers you had to remove oil seals to even see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
obesityrules Posted December 17, 2012 Report Share Posted December 17, 2012 do you have a hoist? you could remount the engine, chain up the head, and lift it until you can tell the hoist is pulling on the head. then take the biggest dead blow you can find and hammer the snot out of the head. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gump Posted December 17, 2012 Report Share Posted December 17, 2012 (edited) Try different pry points? A screwdriver is not beefy enough. I normally use thick stiff chisels to pry or wedge and pound. Be careful wedging and pounding between the block and head though. Sometimes there's a spot that won't damage anything. Or piece of hard wood and a actual hammer and pound/ tap up in a pattern. Edited December 17, 2012 by Gump Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Butters Posted December 17, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 17, 2012 Something I have done in the past. Remove camshaft so you can be absolutely sure all the valves are closed. Put all the sparkplugs back in and then crank the engine with the starter. The combustion chamber pressure should be able to pop the head up and off the block dowel pins.As a very big warning. Do not try this if there is any anti freeze or water in any of the cylinders, or if any of the valves can't be confirmed as fully closed.There's water in cylinder 4... This motor is a complete nasty mess... Sludge everywhere from the coolant oil milkshake I thought my 750 head was seized on the dowels when I was taking it apart, turns out there were some screws down underneath the cam towers you had to remove oil seals to even see.No other head bolts... Alldata confirmeddo you have a hoist? you could remount the engine, chain up the head, and lift it until you can tell the hoist is pulling on the head. then take the biggest dead blow you can find and hammer the snot out of the head.No hoist .. If I had one I'd put engine mount back on and hoist the head off letting weight of the car do the work lol Try different pry points? A screwdriver is not beefy enough. I normally use thick stiff chisels to pry or wedge and pound. Be careful wedging and pounding between the block and head though. Sometimes there's a spot that won't damage anything. Or piece of hard wood and a actual hammer and pound/ tap up in a pattern.I was using screwdriver with a cheater bar and it will lift the whole engine... Will using something more stiff make a difference? I thought I was at maximum prying force once the engine lifts up I think I'll try the block of wood and hammer thoughWon't have time again until Tuesday... So all suggestions until then are appreciated Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ducati guy Posted December 17, 2012 Report Share Posted December 17, 2012 Ever take into consideration that all data could be wrong? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scruit Posted December 17, 2012 Report Share Posted December 17, 2012 Hammer a chisel or prybar in there - will produce more separation force than prying. As you have shown, there is a limit to the force you can apply. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Butters Posted December 17, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 17, 2012 Ever take into consideration that all data could be wrong?Yes. That's why I re checked it 10 times... There's only so many places to look for head bolts on a 4 cylinder.... The car has 10 head bolts and I removed 10...I'd show you a picture but I'm already home Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gump Posted December 17, 2012 Report Share Posted December 17, 2012 Is the exhaust and intake off? Serious note, you said you lifted the motor up prying. Your not using the business end of leverage then. Go the other direction. And you usually need quick jerks. A slow lift is not as persuading. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scruit Posted December 17, 2012 Report Share Posted December 17, 2012 And you usually need quick jerks. Never underestimate the appeal of a quick jerk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gixxus Christ! Posted December 17, 2012 Report Share Posted December 17, 2012 I wouldn't think a seized dowel would be able to.resist so much force. I'm still voting for you missed some bolts. Manuals can be wrong. Have you pulled the cam towers off? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marlboro man Posted December 17, 2012 Report Share Posted December 17, 2012 get some starting fluid fill spark plug holes put spark plugs back in make shore the valves are all closed make the spark plugs spark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReconRat Posted December 17, 2012 Report Share Posted December 17, 2012 (edited) Found a guy on line on a Honda forum that said he used a chisel and tapped at the SC1 head gasket to get it started.That's pretty much the way I've always done it if the ton of dead hammer blows didn't work.edit: I've often used a wood chisel, since it's got an angle I think works better.I don't pry with it, I just break the gasket.Don't break tool steel, it goes off like a gun shot.I got the head off finally yesterday. I took a fairly thin chisel andpicked a spot where I could hammer it (more like wedge it) into aspot where it wouldn't affect the head/block seal, and then once Igot it in I pryed it open by hitting the chisel downward.http://www.hondacarforum.com/honda-3/23126-d16-cylinder-head-stuck-block.html Edited December 17, 2012 by ReconRat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Butters Posted December 17, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 17, 2012 Is the exhaust and intake off? Serious note, you said you lifted the motor up prying. Your not using the business end of leverage then. Go the other direction. And you usually need quick jerks. A slow lift is not as persuading.The intake is still on... This head actually gets removed with intake and exhaust manifolds still attached... I disconnected exhaust already before I read alldata and the Saturn forums and realized it wasn't necessary I am positive I didn't miss any bolts Talked to someone who did one and said he had same problem with same motor and had to hammer a chisel in it.. Really didn't want to do that but I guess I'll try it and just be careful Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Butters Posted December 18, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 18, 2012 Stuck an actual pry bar in the corner and tapped it in and it popped right off.. Didn't even have to pry.. Wasted several hours because I was too cheap to just buy a pry bar lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gixxus Christ! Posted December 18, 2012 Report Share Posted December 18, 2012 Well thank god that's over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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