Scruit Posted March 2, 2014 Report Share Posted March 2, 2014 Didn't see this one discussed yet. http://youtu.be/q-_4Bv8JcSY The cop was off-duty but working security in full uniform at a hotel. He was called to help a taxi driver that reported being assaulted by a passenger. That passenger, an off-duty fireman celebrating his wedding, ran when the officer arrived. The cop caught up with the man and tried to arrest him. The video picks up from that point. Discuss... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scruit Posted March 2, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 2, 2014 When I try to figure it out I look at all the individual decisions that contribute to the situation as a whole, and determine if each decision was made in good faith. The key decisions on the part if the dead man were: - Was he right to physically fight with the taxi driver? - Was he right to run from the cop? - Was he right to resist arrest? - Was he right to "ground and pound" the cop? As far as the cop goes: - Was he right to perform police duties off-duty? (the taxi thing) - Was he right to chase the man when he ran? - Was he right to try to arrest the man when he caught up with him? - Could he have used another method of effecting the arrest, such as tasing the man? - Was he right to shoot while he was being grounded and pounded? And a personal question: Amongst all the screaming about too-frequent taser use, could thus be an example of the cop not wanting to tase the man because he knew he was being filmed and knew he would be vilified for it, thereby losing control of the arrest and having to shoot to save himself? Also not noted in the video, the cop was only semi-conscious when he shot the man, bystanders said he was in-and-out of consciousness while awaiting the ambulances. Helps clarify how much danger he was in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadTrainDriver Posted March 2, 2014 Report Share Posted March 2, 2014 There is no such thing as an "off duty" police officer.They have the right(and the duty) to enforce the law at any time. From what the video showed(and just based on that evidence alone), I fully support the cops decision to use deadly force. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadTrainDriver Posted March 2, 2014 Report Share Posted March 2, 2014 Just watched again...and I don't see a taser. Do you see one, Scruit? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redkow97 Posted March 2, 2014 Report Share Posted March 2, 2014 You're asking questions for a jury who WILL have all the facts. All the cop is going to have to say is "he reached for my firearm," and he'll walk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redkow97 Posted March 2, 2014 Report Share Posted March 2, 2014 P.s. voluntary intoxication is not a valid defense to theft, obstruction of official business (fleeing), or resisting arrest. I won't go so far as to say that the guy deserved to be shot, but he put himself in the situation, and then made it a lot worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scruit Posted March 2, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 2, 2014 Just watched again...and I don't see a taser.Do you see one, Scruit?I didn't see one. Just wondering if the rash of videos of cops tasing people then getting put through the wringer for it is going to result in fewer cops using tasers, resulting in them getting into fights that they may lose, and having to shoot the subject. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scruit Posted March 2, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 2, 2014 You're asking questions for a jury who WILL have all the facts. All the cop is going to have to say is "he reached for my firearm," and he'll walk.The video would disprove such a claim. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redkow97 Posted March 2, 2014 Report Share Posted March 2, 2014 I don't know about that. The video doesn't show both sides of the officer's body. The guy may have reached for his gun. I freely admit I'm speculating as to what he'll say, but I think a jury would believe him if that was his sworn testimony. Especially if he has a good record as far as NOT using his firearm unless it was clearly necessary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rsvRidr Posted March 2, 2014 Report Share Posted March 2, 2014 Case had been closed a couple weeks ago. Grand jury did not indict http://fox4kc.com/2014/02/25/cell-phone-video-shows-final-moments-of-confrontation-between-bruno-and-hubbard/ sent from a treestand on the back forty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scruit Posted March 3, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 I know this was "resolved". Just wondering what folks here think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rsvRidr Posted March 3, 2014 Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 No worries, not sure if you were aware of the outcome. A person(who's daytime job is a firefighter) became voluntarily intoxicated then decides to assault a cab driver over the fare. When a uniformed officer arrives to assist/resolve the incident, the intoxicated individual flees, failing to comply with the lawful order of a law enforcement officer.Then when detained by the officer and during the attempt to subdue him/take him into custody, the intoxicated man resists his lawful arrest, gains control of the officer and assaults him. Officer shoots suspect to stop his aggression as he was in fear for his life. Unfortunate outcome but more importantly,a series of poor decisions by a drunk man that ended with him losing his life and forever changing the life of the officer and his family. Suspect being a off duty fireman plays no role except for headlines. The officer appears to lose control of the situation when he stops trying to detain him and converse with the people taking the video and yelling questions at him. He let his guard down and allows the suspect to gain control. sent from a treestand on the back forty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedytriple Posted March 3, 2014 Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 Not trying to start anything but from the video he was hit what three maybe four times before he discharged his weapon? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scruit Posted March 3, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 Not trying to start anything but from the video he was hit what three maybe four times before he discharged his weapon? Enough to knock him partially unconscious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scruit Posted March 3, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 No worries, not sure if you were aware of the outcome.A person(who's daytime job is a firefighter) became voluntarily intoxicated then decides to assault a cab driver over the fare. When a uniformed officer arrives to assist/resolve the incident, the intoxicated individual flees, failing to comply with the lawful order of a law enforcement officer.Then when detained by the officer and during the attempt to subdue him/take him into custody, the intoxicated man resists his lawful arrest, gains control of the officer and assaults him. Officer shoots suspect to stop his aggression as he was in fear for his life.Unfortunate outcome but more importantly,a series of poor decisions by a drunk man that ended with him losing his life and forever changing the life of the officer and his family.Suspect being a off duty fireman plays no role except for headlines.The officer appears to lose control of the situation when he stops trying to detain him and converse with the people taking the video and yelling questions at him. He let his guard down and allows the suspect to gain control.sent from a treestand on the back forty I agree with everything said in this post. Except I'm not in a treestand. More of a breakfast bar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
okeefe01 Posted March 3, 2014 Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 I agree. The officer lost control when he lost his focus and started to talk to the bystanders. But, no matter what lead up to the final event, if the drunk guy would not have resisted arrest, it would have all ended without incident. Unfortunately, he decided not only to resist, but then he began assualting the officer. I think, regardless of the circumstance, when you have an officer on the ground hitting him in the face, you are likely to get shot. What a shame. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4DAIVI PAI2K5 Posted March 3, 2014 Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 Good shoot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magley64 Posted March 3, 2014 Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 "firefighter" is irrelevant to story... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scruit Posted March 3, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 "firefighter" is irrelevant to story...Good for ratings. Irrelevant to justice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scruit Posted March 3, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 I agree. The officer lost control when he lost his focus and started to talk to the bystanders. But, no matter what lead up to the final event, if the drunk guy would not have resisted arrest, it would have all ended without incident. Unfortunately, he decided not only to resist, but then he began assualting the officer. I think, regardless of the circumstance, when you have an officer on the ground hitting him in the face, you are likely to get shot.What a shame.Yet people still wonder why aggressive bystanders get arrested for interfering. Interference from bystanders is partly responsible for this thing going pear-shaped. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redkow97 Posted March 3, 2014 Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 police are not infallible, but they have a much harder job than most people want to give them credit for. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimTheAzn Posted March 4, 2014 Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 Soooo, if this was his wedding how did they (his friends and family) even let it get to this point? Normally the bride and groom aren't as drunk as the other people attending the wedding? Maybe that's just the weddings I've been to but I would never have let my buddy that just got married start assaulting anyone. Sent from my iPhone. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedytriple Posted March 4, 2014 Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 Why was he by himself on his wedding night in a taxi? I did not see a bride in the video trying to stop any of this? It looked like a bad situation from the start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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