zx3vfr Posted July 18, 2017 Report Share Posted July 18, 2017 http://www.reuters.com/article/us-harley-davidson-results-idUSKBN1A3126 aging baby boomers and millennials who are getting into motorcycles. More like shit shit and more shit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tpoppa Posted July 18, 2017 Report Share Posted July 18, 2017 That's what happens when you specialize in selling decorative motorcycles to old people, then release that turd of a new Street Rod in a half assed attempt to attract younger buyers. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tpoppa Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 A big problem that Harley may not be able to solve anytime soon is that a big chunk of HD owners are aging to a point where they can no longer ride and are selling their barely ridden hogs. The market is flooded with late model, low mile harleys that aren't holding their value like they used to. People that may have bought new are opting to buy cheap used bikes instead. Unfortunately for HD, a 5 year old bike is 99% the same as a new one. For many years they've chosen not to invest much in product development, and rehash basically the same models with slightly different decorations. If they do fall into financial trouble it's totally their own fault. Maybe they have something new up their sleeve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NinjaDoc Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 (edited) aging and dying customer base // crashing sales// exactly why they are sort of desperate to get into the ducati band wagon and hopefully not mess it up as well .......but overall electrics are coming for all of them 10-15 yrs down the lane/ those will start to take over. Not as costly as electronic electric cars to make and maintain / technology by then will give charge to last 300-400 mile loop which is more than most avg riders go/ and the adrenaline kick to soul which is the basic essence of motorcycling is more with such ridiculous accelerating machines but...but... safety electronic nanny profile is going to expand as well / what started as linked brakes/ abs brakes/ride modes/ traction control / cornering abs >>> 15-20 yrs down the lane it will be auto stabilized - no tip over- no high side low side - auto corner speed optimized using gps tech, etc etc Technically motorcycling used to be becoming one with the machine and pacing the world with you mind skill and machines mighty muscle. In future it will become the machine will become you and take you for a ride. Edited July 19, 2017 by NinjaDoc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qman Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 (edited) 25 minutes ago, Tpoppa said: A big problem that Harley may not be able to solve anytime soon is that a big chunk of HD owners are aging to a point where they can no longer ride and are selling their barely ridden hogs. The market is flooded with late model, low mile harleys that aren't holding their value like they used to. People that may have bought new are opting to buy cheap used bikes instead. Unfortunately for HD, a 5 year old bike is 99% the same as a new one. For many years they've chosen not to invest much in product development, and rehash basically the same models with slightly different decorations. If they do fall into financial trouble it's totally their own fault. Maybe they have something new up their sleeve Hard to believe they are hurting, since half the people around here have the bar /shield logo on them or their vehicle somewhere. Wonder how that whole electric bike project (LiveWire) is going for them? Oh...and the statement "5 year old bike is 99% the same as a new one"...a 40 year old bike is 90% the same as a new one is about right too.! Edited July 19, 2017 by Qman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tpoppa Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 Harley is one of the most stubborn backward thinking companies around, per a few insiders I've spoken with. If it wasn't for EPA regs forcing them, they'd prefer to still be using carbs over FI. I seriously doubt HD will be anywhere near the cutting edge of new motorcycle technology. I also doubt they have the in house engineering muscle to change that anytime soon. The Livewire was a Buell project (even had stock Buell parts on that bike). HD fired most of the Buell engineers that were involved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NinjaDoc Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 (edited) so far from the prototypes and stuff bmw honda yamaha seems to be heavy on electric/ autonomous R&D Edited July 19, 2017 by NinjaDoc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
what Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 They should just transition to merch and aftermarket sales only and dump the new motorcycle overhead. /shrug Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustinNck1 Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 Of course you're going to need to build less bikes when you have more competition. Harley is losing market share. There are more and more cruiser options each year. Plus, the 2nd-hand market right now is absolutely flooded with late 2000s models for dirt cheap compared to new models (Their resale value drop is starting to match other brands now). If they wanna stay relevant, they need some major reform to attract a younger demographic, which means making non-cruiser bikes that aren't a normal Harley, or even Harley branded for that matter. Of course they are stubborn, so I don't expect anything drastic coming anytime soon from them. The electric bike market does interest me though, I really looked into a Zero bike for a commuter. Some day, when the prices become more affordable, I can see myself owning one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qman Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 still say that HD should invest in building ATVs...side x sides and quads that have a big V-twin in them. All chromed up and shiny. All the redneks would take out loans. And speaking of loans, that's probably another reason HD is hurting. For a long time, (maybe still?) you could get extreeeemly long term financing thru HD Finance. Gotta believe there's a shit ton of repo's going on. Hell they even let you put accessories and clothing on the loan! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tpoppa Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 Electric bikes are interesting. Personally, I think off roading would be a better market for electric for it's current level of technology. Typically, dirt bikes and ATVs don't need as much range as a street bike, so current battery tech might be just fine.. Plus the lack of noise may open up some off roading areas that don't want the noise to scare off wildlife, etc. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustinNck1 Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 12 minutes ago, Qman said: And speaking of loans, that's probably another reason HD is hurting. For a long time, (maybe still?) you could get extreeeemly long term financing thru HD Finance. Gotta believe there's a shit ton of repo's going on. Hell they even let you put accessories and clothing on the loan! I've heard rumors of up to 7 years... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qman Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 1 hour ago, JustinNck1 said: I've heard rumors of up to 7 years... Yep...from HD site: " The APR will vary based on the applicants past credit performance and the term of the loan, which can vary from 24-84 months." I heard they used to go even further than 7! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustinNck1 Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 1 minute ago, Qman said: Yep...from HD site: " The APR will vary based on the applicants past credit performance and the term of the loan, which can vary from 24-84 months." I heard they used to go even further than 7! Oh, banks are getting crazy on financing stuff as well. I know of someone who financed a $15k RV for 12 years... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue03636 Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 2 minutes ago, JustinNck1 said: Oh, banks are getting crazy on financing stuff as well. I know of someone who financed a $15k RV for 12 years... RVs can go 30 years, they are like a home loan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustinNck1 Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 Just now, blue03636 said: RVs can go 30 years, they are like a home loan. I could see that on a new RV that's the same price as a house. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XV1000 Posted July 23, 2017 Report Share Posted July 23, 2017 On 7/19/2017 at 1:47 PM, Isaac's Papa said: That's dumb. I talked my in-laws into trading I their old RV for a brand new one after I married their only child. Cost me zero dollars and just have to wait them out. Now thats what you call "Strategy". Well played. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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