Miller Posted August 21, 2006 Report Share Posted August 21, 2006 . I will. No, go away Kylie Minogue I will You don't classify the weight class, ass Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bam Posted August 21, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 21, 2006 Desparado, what do you mean flipping a motor? I am putting a fwd setup just in the back of the car. the engine will be facing the same way as will the trans, Its just behind the driver instead of ahead. I did look at keeping the bug setup, but it wasn't work it. A performance rebuild kit to take it from 1600cc to 1915cc runs a little over $1200 in parts and only nets you 130hp/135tq, plus labor. Not to mention the whackass bolt pattern, finding good looking wheels, and the car has 4wheel drum on it now, the disc conversion is $300+ for each axle so over $600 in parts. That's over $2000 in parts I'd need to only get what I can get out of a stock modern 4cylinder engine for around $100. I pulled a complete front suspension yesterday for the rail buggy, I'll need to make mounts but it should work great, not to mention the car I pulled it off of had coilovers and performance shocks I got as well. Total cost for the entire front end including, shocks/coilovers, a-arms (upper and lower) tie rods ends, brake rotor/pad, and calipers was $8x.xx, not bad in my eyes. I also pulled the entire front subframe off another car, and including the axles, all parts mention above, and some steering components, it was around $100. The second suspension is for the rear end if I do in fast stick a 4cylinder in there. But right now, I'm holding out for a bike setup, and have had some people email me so hopefully it happens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desperado Posted August 21, 2006 Report Share Posted August 21, 2006 As far as the flipping a motor, I was refering to the guys talking about a motor adapter plate to put a 2.3 on the bug trannie. As far as the disc conversion, uhhh, it's gonna weigh 1500 lbs, the disc's really aren't necessary, but there again this ain't my project. As far as the 130 HP/ 135 tq.... you better go look at the bike tq numbers, or lack there of. I have seen guys mention 200 HP bike motors, and that's true, at 13000 RPM. When you started into this discussion, you said go-cart. This ain't a go-cart, and is going to weigh at least 3 times as much as a go cart, if not more. I would advise you to start working your numbers with torque and HP and the wieght. If nothing else, take a guess at the wieght and start plugging torque numbers into the equations for 1/4 mile times. I realize this isn't gonna be a drag car, but it will give you some idea of how it's going to preform or not preform with a given weight and torque rating of a motor. Just a thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBussman1647545507 Posted August 22, 2006 Report Share Posted August 22, 2006 bike motor realilsticly would be a good choise, in a go-kart it would be hard to not have enough power with how light it is, or else i always thought it would be good to use a geo metro/ suzuki swift power train, just drop it in and switch the shifter cables. super light, super cheap and relly readily avalible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bam Posted August 22, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 22, 2006 Desparado, thanks for the input. This isn't a go-cart, I understand, its a rail buggy but it should only weigh around 800lbs when finished with a bike setup. About 1000-1100lbs with a 4cylinder. I've researched/physically weighed my setup, just the frame weighs 203lbs, I've cut off both the front and rear suspension, so this is just the frame. I've got the new front suspension to go on tomorrow, which I'll weigh it then, but from carrying it around I'd figure both sides, complete setup including brakes no more than 100lbs. I'm guessing a bike motor/trans should weigh between 150-200lbs, right? So that puts me up to aroudn 500lbs, give or take 20lbs. The wheels I've got and judging from the weight of the tires I want should add another 150lbs, maybe less. So we're at 650lbs, only missing two seats, which I have and they weigh 12lbs a piece, so let's say 700lbs because I want to mount sliders to them, and then the rear suspension, which will be one big swingarm most likely. We'd be doing a solid rear axle with just a sprocket on it for the chain I think. **The only thing I'm not sure on how to setup up would be the rear braking system? This is what I picture: Solid rear axle, basically just a pipe, weld the hub/something with the bolt pattern I want onto each end, then put a rotor on. I'm thinking I'll need to make custom carriers for the calipers, or mounts, something. Does this sound like anything feasible? Another question would be since the brakes I'm using from the donor car are front brakes, and the rears are drums on the donor, how would I setup the ebrake to do the rears? ***I bought a 600 today, got it off a buddy for $300, its got a bent frame but the engine runs fine and its got everything I need I think. I'm going to mount this bitch on there and then if its not fast enough, hopefully all I'd need to change might be a few mounts when I step up to a 1000cc or larger. Pics to come later this week of progress. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desperado Posted August 22, 2006 Report Share Posted August 22, 2006 Solid rear axle, one the street, with all the weight in the back, in should understeer like mad. Tell you what, please let me know when you are going to put this on the road so I can stay home that day, seriously. I applaud your motovation for attempting something of this level, I honestly do. I however cringe that you are trying to 'figure out' brakes. My advice to you would be go get a copy of the Ohio Revised code, and pay perticular attention to what is legal for a braking system. The other book I would highly advise you read is The Door Slammers Chassis Book by Dave Morgan. There is a wealth of information about brake systems and the proper way to figure the multiplying forces of not only the hydraulic system, but the ratio of the pedal, meaning the length of the pedal arm, the point that the master cylinder should be from the pivot point for best braking performance. I guess the major concern I have is this. You are bloting a 600 up, and going to a 1000 if it's 'not fast enough' but BOTH of these motors are smaller than the original bug motor that was on it to begin with??? BTW, I am interested in the parts that you have 'cut off ' the chassis. And I would also be interested to hear about the motor that was on the chassis to begin with and see if its purchase-able. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bam Posted August 22, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 22, 2006 I've got 2 complete bug setups for sale. two complete front subframes with everything including brakes, suspension, wheels/tires, and two complete rear ends w/ torsion beam, trans, axles, engine, shifter box/cables, suspension, brakes, wheels/tires. I've also got about 5 extra wheels/tires if your interested as well. I've also gots tons of extra misc parts that I got with this thing, some in good shape, some not, I'll sell it for a good price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desperado Posted August 22, 2006 Report Share Posted August 22, 2006 Sounds like we need to get together and talk money. Do you have a round number that you were thinking about for this stuff? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buckeye1647545503 Posted August 24, 2006 Report Share Posted August 24, 2006 Keith people use the 2.3 a ton in the buggys and also the 2.3 came in the tempo so useng that pan and pick up should be easy enough Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron_ Posted August 24, 2006 Report Share Posted August 24, 2006 3.8 is way too heavy? what's an extra 100 or 200 pounds....when you're talking about an extra 100 HP over others at a cost of $1000 less you could get one cheap, and there's a very decent aftermarket for them very reliable i'd rather have one of those that i could abuse and replace for $200 than some exotic crotch rocket motor that i had a fortune in seems like that would be the way i'd go...and maybe just make the go-cart a bit bigger than originally intended Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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