Tomb of Jesus -Discuss.

[ImUrOBGYN]

Look, I'm not arguing whether he exist or not. "Faith" or no, there is no way for you or I to know for sure. However, I believe I can honestly comment having once been a person of faith, read the bible, attended various denominations, studied on my own, got the t-shirt, etc. And I say, existing or not, supreme or not, there are too many contradictions within the bible, and not just those that are normally posted, but I mean 'God specific' contradictions. I will list a few if pressed (just too lazy to type them out, lol), but I would have to assume you either aren't as versed in The Verse as you say or are in denial. Unless a proper reply is given, of course.

 

Trowa, don't worry. I take no offense and I hope you take none, as well. I appreciate you sharing your opinions and beliefs. Trust me when I say I'm very accepting of people's choices and beliefs and am the last one to judge somebody.

 

Couple comments, though:

 

It would make me feel more inclined to be a better person. It would force me to try to be better then my grandparents. I take this to heart because replace grandparents in your previous quote with "parents" and that makes a Trowa.

 

I don't need that to be a good person; to make better decisions than those before me or around me. Some people do, I understand that. It gives them drive. However, that means I only view religion as a tool. Like any tool, it can be used for good and evil.

 

God forgives you if you ask him to. You have to really mean it and detest being a sinner. After this there is no problem.

 

There is your logic.

 

God doesn't punish little children. According to my religious teaching if a child dies before they can understand, what God is, and how to accept God into their heart, they go to heaven. After they understand this they have a choice to do it or not. It is free will, something God gave us.

 

Again, so we're guilty until proven innocent?

 

And how do you decide when a child really understands God and religion? And don't the Catholics have a purgatory for the unbaptized? Oh wait, they decided that didn't exist anymore. Must've been a note from god. I'm teasing, of course. But I mean, c'mon.

 

And then attaching "free will" to that. Holy crap. Let me lay it out how I see it. You're born guilty before you perform a single act in your life. You have the choice to accept this being into your heart, etc or you goto hell and burn in a lake of fire for eternity. Do I even need an actual analogy for this? This is your definition of free will? Remind me not to move to your country if you ever start one. Well, depends on what your major crops are.

[87GT]

We are guilty (sinners) until forgiven by God. It is hard to say when a child will or will not understand the concept of God. That is all dependent on how smart the child is. There is no age I can think of. 5, 6, 7 ? I don't know. God does though.

 

And yes I accept the fact of this. I have free will to choose either, God, nobody, or Satan. I choose God. No one forced me to make this decision. It was made by me. Same goes for any other choice I have. I don't have to pay my gas bill in my house for a month if I feel like it. I don't have to go to work every day as I am scheduled. There are consequences for either choice but no one is holding a gun to my head forcing me either way.

 

Lets not talk about catholics because that will turn into its own ugly thread real quick.

[KillJoy]

Dogma was a good movie.

 

KillJoy

[HAOLE]

You guys made me dig up my bible for this. You slackers.

 

God still allows suffering and death because of Adam and Eve choosing the way of Satan. Ever since then we are born sinners. Go read Genesis 3:16-19. God explains to Adam and Eve that they will now experience Death and Sorrow for their actions. Death is not the work of a "unjust" God, it's the consequences of sin.

 

Also Romans 5:12 says "Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:". This means to me everyone is born a sinner.

 

It isn't until Revelation 21:4 that it explains there will be a time when Death and Sorrow is taken away forever.

Good job....

[Scotty2Hotty]

 

Lets not talk about catholics because that will turn into its own ugly thread real quick.

Damn right, watch out for super pope.

http://www.truthdig.com/images/eartothegrounduploads/pope_350.jpg

[thorne]

No my point is that god must be A fucking hypocrit if he helps some nad not others. I think people try to thank god for shit thats there own doing.

[HAOLE]

No my point is that god must be A fucking hypocrit if he helps some nad not others. I think people try to thank god for shit thats there own doing.

And people blame God for problems when it is their own doing.

[smokin5s]

And people blame God for problems when it is their own doing.

touche!

[DOZZER]

Lets not talk about catholics because that will turn into its own ugly thread real quick.

But what about Catholic school girls

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v66/erictragedy/movie%20sets/Hell-o-ween/CatholicSchoolGirlWS.jpg

[Trouble Maker]

What if you are wrong?

 

Is that why you believe?

[87GT]

But what about Catholic school girls

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v66/erictragedy/movie%20sets/Hell-o-ween/CatholicSchoolGirlWS.jpg

 

 

In my experience they are real horny and don't like birth control. Just look and don't touch. Not worth it

[Scotty2Hotty]

I loved going to Watterson because sometimes girls wouldn't wear the panties under the skirt!

[87GT]

I loved going to Watterson because sometimes girls wouldn't wear the panties under the skirt!

 

You are going to hell you heathen !!!one!!1

 

[thorne]

You are going to hell you heathen !!!one!!1

 

 

Shit scott if you get there first get me a chair by the school busses

[Otis Nice]

I haven't posted on here in forever, and had no intentions of posting today. I was just a little intrigued with some of the comments here. Some people claim to be "well versed" in the Bible and take scripture out of context in the same sentence, both on here and in general. I am guilty as I have done in the past also. I'm just gonna throw my .02 out there on some of the comments and PLEASE (I can't emphasize this enough) do NOT take this for me being right, you being wrong, or I'm going to Heaven and you're gonna suffer at the slick hand of Satan if you don't think, believe and feel EXACTLY as I do b/c thats not what this is about...to me anyways.

 

"And how do you decide when a child really understands God and religion?"

 

"You"/we don't. That's not our call to make. If you have a kid that is 3 years old and I have a kid that is 3 years old who am I to tell you what you are doing right and wrong with your kid and what your kid should or shouldn't be doing by this age?

 

And don't the Catholics have a purgatory for the unbaptized? Oh wait, they decided that didn't exist anymore. Must've been a note from god. I'm teasing, of course. But I mean, c'mon.

 

Organized religion is BS. I was born and raised into a denomination and have had 6 ordained ministers in my family. God does not call ANYONE to be Catholic, Lutheran, Pentacostal, or any certain denomination. We are all the body of Christ. Who am I as a member of the C.C.C.U. to tell a Catholic or Lutheran they're wrong? I believe (see intro paragraph and notice I said "I believe", not "YOU have to believe") that organized religion and denominations, which are all man-made, are just a way to justify our actions. If you want to be a Christian but still want to drink you can be this denomination, or if you believe this way you can be a Christian polygamist. Man ALWAYS tries to justify his short comings, religous or not. Sit in a public court for a day. "It's not my fault" is a very popular phrase.

 

"And then attaching "free will" to that. Holy crap. Let me lay it out how I see it. You're born guilty before you perform a single act in your life. You have the choice to accept this being into your heart, etc or you goto hell and burn in a lake of fire for eternity."

 

I find it funny that people across the world claim to have no real idea of what Heaven looks like and can say that streets of gold is absurd and that we don't know if Jesus Christ is black, white, hispanic, male, or female but there is an understood consensus that Hell is a swimming pool of molten lava with a "1 trip down the slide per person" policy.

 

"And I say, existing or not, supreme or not, there are too many contradictions within the bible, and not just those that are normally posted, but I mean 'God specific' contradictions. I will list a few if pressed (just too lazy to type them out, lol), but I would have to assume you either aren't as versed in The Verse as you say or are in denial. Unless a proper reply is given, of course."

 

Of course there is, but why is that? Much of the Bible is written under supressed cirumstances. Such as those that wrote parts of it were in prison at the time. Also any person can find at least 1 verse in the bible to justify ANYTHING they want. I.E. (and this one works for me because it has been tried to be used against me), when God gave laws to the Levites this was included, and I'll quote scripture.

 

"Do not cut your bodies for the dead or put tattoo marks on yourselves. I am the LORD." Leviticus 19:28

 

Hmmmm...so I shouldn't rock my 3 tat's if I'm a "Christian", right? Someone actually quoted this verse in order to down play my tattos, 2 of which are religious and glorify God. Problem is they failed to quote the rest of the laws in the same chapter, including:

 

"Do not cut the hair at the sides of your head or clip off the edges of your beard." Leviticus 19:27

 

(I don't see every Christian rocking the ZZ Top look.)

 

"Don't let cattle graze with other kinds of Cattle." Leviticus 19:19

 

(I don't even own cattle, nor would I know how to 'graze' them.)

 

In return I offered up scripture to defend my stance.

 

"Finally, let no one cause me trouble, for I bear on my body the marks of Jesus." Galatians 6:17

 

This was said to me from someone who had been in church and sudying the word of God for more than 50 years. Problem is, the laws that God gave to the Levites, which is what they used 'against me' as factual scripture relevant to today, were written specifically for the Levites. We are in new testament times.

 

"No my point is that God must be a fucking hypocrit if he helps some and not others. I think people try to thank God for shit that's their own doing."

 

SCENARIO: So if I am dying of cancer and your aunt is dying of cancer and you find a cure that can only be used once. I beg you for mercy, for understanding, for life. Your aunt wants nothing to do with you. She turns her head and closes her eyes as you walk in the room. You explain that you have the power to save her life, to heal her, and to end ALL her suffering, yet she still refuses to listen. My family and I offer you everything we own and beg for your kindness. You use your one opportunity to cure your aunt (understandably). Then are you the epitamy of hipocricy in all you do? You had a chance to save my life and I begged you for it. I offered you everything I had to give and you chose not to. Same is God's love, kindness, and understanding. Part of the "free will" is choosing to ignore him and turn a back to him. I find it amusing also that everyone will resort to praying and begging God for mercy in times of sorrow or in times of pain but no one stops to thank him for what he's done, whether you see it as your doing or his. Everyone wants mercy and forgiveness and offers nothing in return. Again, I believe this applies to spiritual life and worldly life. "Woe is me. Help me in my time of need."

 

"And people blame God for problems when it is their own doing."

 

Exactly!

 

"You mean there is no possible chance they just had poor aim and based on the randomness of the universe they just missed?"

 

Again, not trying to prove or disprove anything so much as offer up my opinion and beliefs and make inquiries so take it for whatever it's worth to you (which I understand may be nothing. ), but you don't believe in God but you believe in "the randomness of the universe"? I'm not trying to use this as a burn, I'm just a bit confused.

 

"If god protected you why does he let innocent children die?

If god fucking protected you why is my aunt dieing of fucking cacner and wasting away in a unhumain fucking way."

 

Again, I don't have all the right answers. I am willing to offer you resources though. Don't just take these as a "Christian trying to make you believe". My Grandma, whom I was VERY close to, died of cancer when I was in high school. I know its not easy and I know the pain and suffering that the family is feeling and your aunt herself. I saw it first hand. Also my cousin who was pregnant with her fist child just lost it a month into the pregnacy. So please, see this as a fellow human being trying to offer up answers for tough questions, but understand that I don't necessarily believe I, or anyone else, can answer all your questions the way you want or need them to be answered.

 

http://www.gotquestions.org/suffering-death.html

 

One last time, I want to make sure that EVERYONE understands that I am not offering this up as a correction to anyone elses thoughts or beliefs. There just seems to be a ton of questions and confusion about Christianity and I'll admit after being in church almost 25 years now I don't understand everything. As a matter of fact, there is a LOT I don't understand. All I can do is try to understand and try to live MY life the way God wants ME to. Each person is called differently and convicted differently. What is right for God's will in MY life may not be the same as God's will in YOUR life. If you REALLY want answers, or at least a little help/insight on a TON of these topics I would recomend using the internet to dive deep into researching them, not just looking at porn and keyboard battles.

 

http://www.gotquestions.org

 

You may not think they're right, but like I said, just a little bit of research and discussion material.

 

EDIT: P.S. ~ I couldn't find the quote to post in here but as far as exdraditing the Cannanits, including women and children?

http://www.gotquestions.org/Canaanites-extermination.html

[thorne]

See the single curse is kinda a odd scenario. Since god is suppoed to be ALL POWERFUL then he can save everyone all at once with the snap of a finger.

 

My aunt is a very religious person and I dunno It just bugs me when epoepl say that. You've made some of the most welthought answers out of anyone in this thread. I apploaud you.

[SpaceGhost]

I must come forward, i have a secret, how does one get off of a Bike at 80 and live:

 

Please allow me to introduce myself

Im a man of wealth and taste

Ive been around for a long, long year

Stole many a mans soul and faith

And I was round when jesus christ

Had his moment of doubt and pain

Made damn sure that pilate

Washed his hands and sealed his fate

Pleased to meet you

Hope you guess my name

But whats puzzling you

Is the nature of my game

I stuck around st. petersburg

When I saw it was a time for a change

Killed the czar and his ministers

Anastasia screamed in vain

I rode a tank

Held a generals rank

When the blitzkrieg raged

And the bodies stank

Pleased to meet you

Hope you guess my name, oh yeah

Ah, whats puzzling you

Is the nature of my game, oh yeah

I watched with glee

While your kings and queens

Fought for ten decades

For the gods they made

I shouted out,

Who killed the kennedys?

When after all

It was you and me

Let me please introduce myself

Im a man of wealth and taste

And I laid traps for troubadours

Who get killed before they reached bombay

Pleased to meet you

Hope you guessed my name, oh yeah

But whats puzzling you

Is the nature of my game, oh yeah, get down, baby

Pleased to meet you

Hope you guessed my name, oh yeah

But whats confusing you

Is just the nature of my game

Just as every cop is a criminal

And all the sinners saints

As heads is tails

Just call me lucifer

cause Im in need of some restraint

So if you meet me

Have some courtesy

Have some sympathy, and some taste

Use all your well-learned politesse

Or Ill lay your soul to waste, um yeah

Pleased to meet you

Hope you guessed my name, um yeah

But whats puzzling you

Is the nature of my game, um mean it, get down

Woo, who

Oh yeah, get on down

Oh yeah

Oh yeah!

Tell me baby, whats my name

Tell me honey, can ya guess my name

Tell me baby, whats my name

I tell you one time, youre to blame

Ooo, who

Ooo, who

Ooo, who

Ooo, who, who

Ooo, who, who

Ooo, who, who

Ooo, who, who

Oh, yeah

Whats me name

Tell me, baby, whats my name

Tell me, sweetie, whats my name

Ooo, who, who

Ooo, who, who

Ooo, who, who

Ooo, who, who

Ooo, who, who

Ooo, who, who

Ooo, who, who

[Otis Nice]

See the single curse is kinda a odd scenario. Since god is suppoed to be ALL POWERFUL then he can save everyone all at once with the snap of a finger.

 

My aunt is a very religious person and I dunno It just bugs me when epoepl say that. You've made some of the most welthought answers out of anyone in this thread. I apploaud you.

 

First off thanks. I was hoping I wouldn't offend. How can anyone who calls themselves a Christian hope to show Gods love through slander?

 

You're right, it is an odd scenario. What I was trying to show is that we expect so much yet give so little. I judt don't really know how else to describe the "free will" everyone is talking about other than that we choose to accept God or turn our back on him. You're right, God is all powerful and could save everyone with the snap of a finger but when was the last time people condemned Bill Gates, Donald Trump, and the Waltons for not feeding a kabillion strarving children who are dying of curable diseases?

 

All in all I hope I gave at least some insight if nothing else, and please know that when I lead my youth group tomorrow night I will say a special prayer for your aunt and family. As said before, I have been there.

 

God Bless.