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Paver Patio Installation Questions


TimTaylor751647545500

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In the next couple of weeks I am taking on a decent project in the installation of a 12'x12' paver patio. I picked up a lot of 16"x16" concrete pavers off CL for a good deal and will be doing the work myself. It's been a long time since I've done anything similar to this type of project and I'm not exactly sure what the best layout will be for the base. From what I've been reading, a good 4" gravel base topped with 1" of sand is preferred, but I'm not really sure I'll end up needing 4" worth of gravel due to the size of the pavers.

 

I'll get some pictures of the area where the patio will be installed as well as the actual pavers I'll be using.

 

Any thoughts on what might work best for this type of install?

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Hey just saw this, you really do not want to a hand tamp over that whole thing. For one you will wear yourself out and two it will not compact very well. You will end up having spots sinking on you. It is better to just rent a compactor, or i can probably help you out.

 

I personally like to do 6 inches of #411 and 1 inch of #9's. Sand will just move on you and will not lock together. you will also need a few things. a set of 1 inch poles and a board to get a nice level one inch for laying the pavers on after the base is set. A four foot level will also be needed to set slope up otherwise you will have watering pooling.

A laser to figure out your depth is also a plus.

 

Ive done this for a long time so if you want some help let me know.

Here is chads patio i helped him with.

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c168/twistedrx7/0627091128.jpg

 

And a couple others

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c168/twistedrx7/0730091805.jpg

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c168/twistedrx7/0730091806.jpg

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c168/twistedrx7/0730091805.jpg

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c168/twistedrx7/0806091617a.jpg

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c168/twistedrx7/0806091616c.jpg

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c168/twistedrx7/0806091617b.jpg

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Although I am certainly no expert like Jake, I did do my own paver patio. I will say that renting the compactor is the way to go. You will kill yourself trying to tamp all that stuff properly with a hand tamper.

 

I did 6" of gravel with 1" of sand on top (Get paver sand not masonry sand like I did). The reason I did 6" of gravel is because I live a bit further north and it really does get colder here (Close to Cleveland) than in Columbus and you can get, what I believe the professionals call, "Heave" (sp?) where the bricks will push out and up and every direction when it gets cold then warm and cycles. Without the proper base you will have more of that (I may be wrong here but that is I thought I remember reading, Jake will probably tell us something different ;)).

 

Edit: Also, try to tamp your gravel every two inches in depth. IE put two inches down, tamp, another two inches tamp, etc etc.

 

I did not tamp the sand, I don't remember seeing anywhere saying you should.

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Yes every two inches is correct, tamp every two. I still would not use sand at all on top for the last inch. #9's are the way to go. It is easier to work with and locks together to provide more strength. You do not tamp the #9s at all by themselves. However, when you are done laying the patio out and cutting it in if needed, you sweep a polymer sand over top and tamp out your pavers. This will compact them nice and tight to the ground while at the same time vibrating the polymer sand into the cracks.

Once done you sweep off the remaining polymer sand wet it down to activate the polymer to harden.

I prefer not to use edging as well for patios. It always tends to rise back up and get pushed out by the dirt. If it is the type of edging that goes under the soldier (outside paver) it will uplift that as well. Mortar works a lot better and will not move.

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Yes every two inches is correct, tamp every two. I still would not use sand at all on top for the last inch. #9's are the way to go. It is easier to work with and locks together to provide more strength. You do not tamp the #9s at all by themselves. However, when you are done laying the patio out and cutting it in if needed, you sweep a polymer sand over top and tamp out your pavers. This will compact them nice and tight to the ground while at the same time vibrating the polymer sand into the cracks.

Once done you sweep off the remaining polymer sand wet it down to activate the polymer to harden.

I prefer not to use edging as well for patios. It always tends to rise back up and get pushed out by the dirt. If it is the type of edging that goes under the soldier (outside paver) it will uplift that as well. Mortar works a lot better and will not move.

 

x2... Agreed, It seems more and more people are using 9's, as they "most" likely drain better, compact a little nicer without the "bigger variables as sand. I see more and more commercial jobs calling for 9's. I would take the time/money to rent a compactor, just because it does a nicer job on the base and tamping the pavers at the end. Jake is also right with the polymeric sand, for Ants and Moss can't work their way in the cracks of your pavers. One thing I have found is to save a buck, sweep your cracks in with concrete sand, then tamp your pavers.... finishing off with re-sweeping using the polymeric (for that stuff can get real pricey). Also make sure before you water/MIST to activate the polymeric to have the pavers completly clean for the glue in the sand can stain your pavers (might use a leaf blower just letting it idle, and being careful).

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I disagree with using concrete sand to sweep in first. The more space for the polymeric sand to fall into cracks the better it will tighten up. If you have polymeric sand on top of the concrete sand it will be lose at the bottom and eventually break the thin polymeric sand layer on top. It is a bad idea. Save the 10 bucks you are going to save and do it right. 1 bag = 80-100sqft of polymeric sand. you would need 2 bags and have half a bag left over. You are looking at 50 bucks for the sand. It is worth the investment.
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I disagree with using concrete sand to sweep in first. The more space for the polymeric sand to fall into cracks the better it will tighten up. If you have polymeric sand on top of the concrete sand it will be lose at the bottom and eventually break the thin polymeric sand layer on top. It is a bad idea. Save the 10 bucks you are going to save and do it right. 1 bag = 80-100sqft of polymeric sand. you would need 2 bags and have half a bag left over. You are looking at 50 bucks for the sand. It is worth the investment.

 

I deffinantly see your point, and agree. I thought the sand was a little more pricey than that. I have done this on "used" patio's to prevent moss and it works fine. Either way I think the sand acts more as a barrier than a bond.

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  • 2 weeks later...

A few pictures.

Got a lot of the work done Friday till I lost daylight, then the rains came Saturday.

Probably going to have to touch up the sand a bit before I get the pavers down.

Feedback welcome.

 

 

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v289/TimTaylor75/Patio/DSC02146.jpg

 

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v289/TimTaylor75/Patio/DSC02147.jpg

 

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v289/TimTaylor75/Patio/DSC02148.jpg

 

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v289/TimTaylor75/Patio/DSC02149.jpg

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You have a few low spots towards the end of the sand. I hope you didnt get sand, and got #9's. Also you want mind to put a little more 9's down where your poles are. It looks like the level goes up and down a little. How many inches of sand/9's did you put down?

 

Ps it is hard to level with PVC pipe. It will flex in every direction on you and throw off your level a little bit.

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Today's progress. Worked on setting the pavers for about 2 & 1/2 hours before the rain started.

 

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v289/TimTaylor75/Patio/DSC02157.jpg

 

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v289/TimTaylor75/Patio/DSC02158.jpg

 

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v289/TimTaylor75/Patio/DSC02159.jpg

 

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v289/TimTaylor75/Patio/DSC02160.jpg

 

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v289/TimTaylor75/Patio/DSC02161.jpg

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looks good. If you want to break up your lines more you can alternate a half piece on that second row at the top and bottom. That way the patio is locking into each other instead of each row.

 

Why did you spend so much time smoothing out your sand if you were going to walk on it???

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