Why does everyone hate Obama, Pelosi, and Reid?

[Scotty2Hotty]

What that fucktard doesn't understand is the Military pushes for further education. Some of the hardest schools and professions are inside the Military. The G.I bill exists for that reason aswell. I got a nice chunk of college credit thanks to some Army schools and training I've done. Bet that kid barely graduated high school to boot.

 

- They stopped the G.E.D program, because retention numbers are through the roof. The Military will start getting cut more and more as we continue the shift out of Iraq and Trashcanistan.

[TTQ B4U]

Obama can only chose from what is presented to him. He does not control what is in the bill. If the conservatives would have offered up reasonable ideas AND voted for them than the bill may have been different.

 

his bill still sucks and that's the basis of what we have to work with.

 

So you agree that this is not a reason to dislike Obama? I do not agree with giving loans to people that can't make the payments. This is common sense but who is to blame for this? The people trying to get the loan I would think.

 

No, it's one of the reason I don't like him. You also can't simply blame just the people who got the loans. The whole deal starts with them being offered the loan and talked into the deals to begin with. If neither of those things happened, the deals would have never been signed. My wife does bankruptcy law and I've seen more than you can imagine. Companies offering credit in less than ethical manners are where it starts. That's not to say people aren't accountable, but it starts with the lenders.

 

Many people assume Socialism raises the rich to the levels of the poor. I simply do not find this to be the case. Doctors in Canada do just fine. They do not make as much money as a DR in the US but this can also be argued because their overhead is significantly less.

 

It's not about making the rich less rich, it's about distributing their wealth to those that haven't earned it. It's not just about a Doc's income either. It's about quality of care and who makes the decisions regarding an individuals health care.

 

If the only thing that encourages people to do anything is money, is that really the best system we can come up with? People did exceptional things well before it was financially rewarding to do so. I like to believe in humanity instead of the dollar. Many people on government programs are there because they CANNOT work. I am not saying that the system is not abused, it certainly is but there are many legitimate people that have been injured or have a condition where they are unable to work. A lack of understanding of Socialism is not a reason to hate Obama but a reason to despise the US media and the connotation it has attached to Socialism.

 

Money makes the world go-round dude. What crack are you smoking. You can believe in humanity all you want, but if you don't understand the role money and the economy play in society, you're not even eligible to play. The sad fact is government involvement, especially socialist bent gov'ts result in a worse situation for all involved, including the unavoidable creation of less ambitious people with no incentive to work harder.

 

You don't create a health care system around the small percentage of folks that can't work. I do question your understanding of Socialism vs mine. Please don't imply I don't understand it from all areas. I've lived and worked in a socialist driven economy. Socialism is bullshit at it's core. Once you peal back the false caring, you have to face the fact that the government owns you. The productive folks are simply a number, and that if you are more productive than most other people you will be regarded as a cash cow to be milked for what some group of statists considers "The Common Good." You can put lipstick on that pig all you want, but it remains un-American and immoral.

 

The flip side of this is why would you not want to help those less fortunate? You use the term "force" but I would rather use the word "expected". It is the right thing to do and it is sad that the government has to "force" people to help the less fortunate.

 

I do help people and I do want to help people, but doing so doesn't mean taking from the rich and giving to the poor. Don't take my words to be that we should not have any social programs, in fact we must have some but the majority of the current social programs seem to engender dependence and a sense of entitlement, vs helping people back to a position of independence and self-sufficiency. That shit has to stop. I do feel at heart, society has an obligation to help those that are not capable from protecting or providing for themselves. However, I do not think that the Federal govt has proven themselves to be a good steward of this responsibility. In fact, they just plain suck at it. This is one of the primary reasons, the Federal govt continues to overreach its Constitutional authority, which leads to more socialistic programs.

 

An interesting quote I found a while back comes from Churchill who once said

 

“the inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of blessings;

the inherent virtue of socialism is the equal sharing of misery.”

 

Are you or are you not against taxes? You can't have it both ways. Your argument for the nice things you have because of taxes is my argument as well. You choose to pay higher taxes for nicer things. I completely agree with this. In this society if we all stop contributing, things break down. I would like to see tax money used more efficiently and for the greater good.

 

I will never vote for a tax. Not unless the tax has a clear reason/goal, time-line and end point all presented up-front. Those that voted for Coleman's bullshit just pissed away 1/2% of their money forever and for nothing but further mismanagement of funding by ill qualified leaders.

 

I don't see that Obama has ever said or has the intention to have "poor people sponge off of the masses". It would seem to me that he is trying to bridge the gap between the haves and the have nots which grows larger every year. This is the road to a revolution.

 

He's playing Robin Hood for the poor without putting any further requirements on them. Gov't shouldn't be involved in bridging gaps. You can't have the beginning of a revolution when the Gov't is involved. What's happening is the move towards Socialism being put in place by Obama and his cronies.

Edited November 28, 2010 by TTQ B4U

[TTQ B4U]

You do not see this as a problem because as you have stated it does not affect you. You are doing fine in this system so why care? It is a terrible thing when a company would rather make more profit than be concerned with your safety or the healthiness of the products it produces. I would recommend seeing the movie "Food Inc" if you have not. This is but one example of how Capitalism causes companies to make huge profits while literally shitting on everyone else. This is not what the US was founded on.

 

I didn't see social status as a problem back when my wife and I barely brought in $24k per year either. I worked my ass off as she worked 10hr days and went to law school at night. We saved money, lived within our means, invested in the market, bought property, and EARNED our way up the social and economic ladders of life. I see nothing wrong with putting that expectation on everyone. We both paid for our own college education and have been completely accountable for our actions. It's called making a good life through sweat equity and hard work. More Americans should try it. Socialism doesn't promote it. In terms of your Food Inc situation, Socialism wouldn't address that either.

 

In reference to my quote above, we will always have an unequal sharing of “blessings” when those blessings are based upon a free market system, but we also always have incredible opportunity to better ourselves. My family and I have taken that road. It's what makes America Great.

Edited November 28, 2010 by TTQ B4U

[TTQ B4U]

We seem to have a very short memory of where we in fact did come from.

 

Ironically, so have you.

http://archives.gov/exhibits/charters/constitution.html

 

 

It used to be that we helped each other out but since Capitalism has taken over its all about my money and screw you. Some do very well with this system, others do not. I have no problem with a portion of my money going to help those that are less fortunate.

 

Take a portion of YOUR money and do what you want with it, but leave MY MONEY THE FUCK ALONE. The gov't we have now has their hands deep enough into my pocketbook. I don't need some fuck-nut named Obama bringing dumb ass socialist ideals to my party too.

 

Our military spending is by far larger than any other country. Maybe if we were not always invading other countries and blowing shit up all the time we wouldn't need to be paying all these highschool drop outs so much. I am not saying that all of the military or maybe even most of the military is not valuable, uneducated, etc just that MANY people with no better options join the military. I pay for this as well as everybody else here.

 

You're right, perhaps the US Should stop being the Police of the World and in most every single case, the largest contributor of foreign aid to any country in need.

 

Your comments about the military leave me speechless. Right up there with your understanding of socialism. IMO you should be forced to serve for a minimum of 2yrs. I'm about 1" away from saying that of everyone in the US really. Graduate high school, serve your country, then move on.

 

What do we have to show for all the people that have died in Iraq and Afghanistan?

 

Next time you wake up, watch 9/11 again and perhaps add up the bodies of the bad guys that have been out to get you and me since. Think about how many more 9/11's would have been on our soil over the past 9 years if it wasn't for our actions. Again, Speechless.....and it takes a lot for ME to be speechless.

[Scotty2Hotty]

Tim hits the nail on the head everytime! :thumbup:

http://www.myconfinedspace.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/10/america-fuck-yeah.jpg

[I Eat Rice]

This is a long thread and I defently do not have the time to post on everything. What I will say is one Obama does suck. My reason is this he promised a vast quanity of people change ,a better life and a better Country. The only problem is this, the people that he made these promises to were extreamly un educated people from the hood that couldnt see through his 90% of bullshit that came out of his mouth. The man is a good speaker I can give him that and he got the vote of the ghetto behind him and thousands upon thousands came out to finaly vote one of "their own" in without any other reasoning behind it besides the fact that they were voting for this so called "change" that will never happen. Now look where we are. We have gotten change yes but change further in the wrong direction. Unemployment is still high as ever and no one is getting jobs. All of these new jobs for the "green projects" in states that could benfit from the windmill labor needed to get these things in the air will never get the jobs because the company assembleing them is from another state and will bring their workers with them thus not giving anymore work to that states people.

If your father is in the top 5% then it would seem to me that he should have no problems purchasing toys for you, or a pool, or a summer, and/or winter home. If I was gay than I would not have a GF or babies.....so I do not quite follow your logic.......Why someone would assume that because I am not conservative I MUST be uneducated, live on welfare and have lots of kids is beyond my understanding.

What is so funny about this is last time I checked the mis informed also think conservatives are a bunch of baby making hillbilly's from southern Ohio, WV, and Kentucky where all the idoits roam. So to make that very close-minded claim about lefties is kinda strange to me because it is far more describing of conservatives and all the dumb ass hill jacks we got screwing their sisters and loving "Merica" and the old south. The number one problem with this country though is we are far to concerned with money and greed and how to get that last penny in our pockets and keep it out of the Johnsons down the street. Untill people start worrying about the shit that matters like the education of our children, the long term betterment of our country and its people, and coming together as a country to solve the problems at hand instead of just bickering and arguing about who is right, the elephants or the donkeys our country is going to continue to fall as a worlds superpower and with that bad things will then happen. Far worse than what we are dealing with now.

[V8 Beast]

This is a long thread and I defently do not have the time to post on everything. What I will say is one Obama does suck. My reason is this he promised a vast quanity of people change, a better life and a better Country. The only problem is this, the people that he made these promises to were extreamly un educated people from the hood that couldnt see through his 90% of bullshit that came out of his mouth.

 

I will keep this simple. There are people all over the nation that voted for him. Yes more people did show up to vote for him just for the color of his skin but not all of them were uneducated like you. I say you are uneducated because it takes a certain kind of ignorance to make a blanket statement like that in a public discussion. Yes he got more votes for being black, thats obvious. However believing in what he is saying does not make you uneducated.. it makes you hopeful. In a way you contradicted yourself. You said they only voted for him because he was black and didnt know anything. Then you said they liked the change he was offering. To like what he is offering in a way means you are educated in what his party is trying to do and trusting in them to deliver... right? Your statement could mean many different things so thats why I'm asking.

 

 

Democrats all across the board voted for him just because he was a democrat and they are true to their party. To me that is just is bad as voting for him because of who he is. The change he promised tricked the rich people that fed him money just as it did the lower class people that believed in him. Ultimately the people voting for him are just as uneducated as the people posting here that think they know whats going on but dont. People please stop coming on here trying to sound smart while implanting feet in your pie holes. This is the reason why cr banned political threads for so long. Please think or do some research before you type.

 

Tim.. can you disect the rest of his post for me please? I spent to much time trying to make my reply pc annd have to go work on my car.

Edited November 28, 2010 by V8 Beast

[TTQ B4U]

Tim.. can you disect the rest of his post for me please? I spent to much time trying to make my reply pc annd have to go work on my car.

 

The only part of his post that I would even remotely agree with is:

 

that until people start worrying about the shit that matters like the education of our children, the long term betterment of our country and its people, and coming together as a country to solve the problems at hand instead of just bickering and arguing about who is right, the elephants or the donkeys our country is going to continue to fall as a worlds superpower and with that bad things will then happen. Far worse than what we are dealing with now.

 

The rest of it is simply foot in pie hole that I won't even comment on.

[I Eat Rice]

I will keep this simple. There are people all over the nation that voted for him. Yes more people did show up to vote for him just for the color of his skin but not all of them were uneducated like you. I say you are uneducated because it takes a certain kind of ignorance to make a blanket statement like that in a public discussion. Yes he got more votes for being black, thats obvious. However believing in what he is saying does not make you uneducated.. it makes you hopeful. Looking at this thread its obvious that even those that think they are educated are not. P.S. not all of "his kind" are from the hoods and ghettos

 

Democrats all across the board voted for him just because he was a democrat and they are true to their party. To me that is just is bad as voting for him because of who he is. The change he promised tricked the rich people that fed him money just as it did the lower class people that believed in him. Ultimately the people voting for him are just as uneducated as the people posting here that think they know whats going on but dont. People please stop coming on here trying to sound smart while implanting feet in your pie holes. This is the reason why cr banned political threads for so long. Please think or do some research before you type.

 

Tim.. can you disect the rest of his post for me please? I spent to much time trying to make my reply pc annd have to go work on my car.

All I am doing is giving slowbalt what he wants an answer based off of opinion. I believe that is what he said he was looking for in the first page. He didn't want the what because anyone can copy and paste links to quotes taken out of context to push their arguement one way or another to make them seem educated but really cant think or muster up an arguement for themselves, he wants they why, which is formed from our very own opinions. Here with a little bit of research for you though V8 Beast.

All major exit polls showed between 96% and 97% of African Americans who voted, voted for Obama. They also show that between 44 and 45% of caucasians voted for Obama and about 55 to 56% voted for McCain. These numbers were quoted over and over again by the major networks and by the Washington Post as well as other national newspapers.

 

Now let's think beyond the silliness and the euphoria created by a media dominated by the Left. Obama has the most Left leaning voting record in the U.S. Senate, as agreed to by leftist organizations. Let's think about the facts as we know them:

 

Obviously, the African American vote was racist. Obviously this does not bode well for the future of democracy in America, regardless of Obama's ideology as evidenced by his voting record.

This quote was complements of yahoo answers and put on the inter web 2 years ago. I will take a step back and will say that I didn't mean all African Americans are from the hood and undereducated but lets look at the facts. What roughly 30% of people living in the inner cities are below the poverity line. And of those people living in the inner cities a vast majority are minorities, ie African Americans. Being that the area is so poor the schools are usually effected because of lack of funding, all the money is going to building the new bigger and better schools in non urban areas. Because of this lack of money teachers with lesser credentials are hired because thats all thay can get into the area thus the education of the child is hindered and will not get the one on one help he would get at a non urban school or private schools where the teachers tend to care a little bit more about their students. All you have to do is look at the test scores. Our inner city students perform the worst year in and year out and many of these students never get the chance to continue their education at a college or secondary learning institute. I will say this too so you cant argue this point I know not all African Americans live in the inner city. I believe in 2000 the cences showed that roughly 40% of all African Americans lived in the suburbs and the number was on the rise due to newer and nicer homes, a safer lifestyle, and better school systems. And to answer a statement you made about me yes I am ignorant very ignorant at times but do not question my level of education I can promise you the education I recieved at The Columbus Academy was far greater than that of a Columbus Public School.

[I Eat Rice]

In a way you contradicted yourself. You said they only voted for him because he was black and didnt know anything. Then you said they liked the change he was offering. To like what he is offering in a way means you are educated in what his party is trying to do and trusting in them to deliver... right? Your statement could mean many different things so thats why I'm asking.

 

To like what he is offering in no way means that you are educated on what his party is trying to do and to offer to the country. All it means is that you watched tv and heard the promise of "change" that he made during every speech, debate, and comerical. I can promise you this many people were voting for a change and had no clue what that change really stood for or ment besides there was gonna be no more Bush in the White House. I wonder what percent of the nation actually watched the debates. I know I did and all you heard come out of his mouth was smooth talking that did a good job and hideing that he was bouncing around the subject and really had no clue what he was doing. The man can talk I will give him that and can woo alot of people just like Clinton did. But just because you can give a good speech and are a good public speeker means nothing to how good of a president you can be...

Edited November 28, 2010 by I Eat Rice

[V8 Beast]

I applaud you for your response. Well done sir.

[Slowbalt]

Plenty more to cover after a day off.

 

Ironically, so have you.

http://archives.gov/exhibits/charters/constitution.html

 

It would seem we also have a misunderstanding of irony.....I guess we can just add that to the list, eh?

 

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/irony

 

Just posting up a link to the constitution and implying that I in some way have forgotten about it says nothing and proves nothing. But in a conversation about why we do not like Obama it is ironic that you mention the constitution as a reason you don't like him since he is a constitutional lawyer.

 

 

 

 

 

Take a portion of YOUR money and do what you want with it, but leave MY MONEY THE FUCK ALONE. The gov't we have now has their hands deep enough into my pocketbook. I don't need some fuck-nut named Obama bringing dumb ass socialist ideals to my party too.

 

Speaking of forgetting things part of that stimulus bill LOWERED taxes for 95% of the US. Socially liberal policies help to not only redistribute wealth but lower the difference between classes. This is important to keep from a rebellion of the lower classes against the upper.

 

You're right, perhaps the US Should stop being the Police of the World and in most every single case, the largest contributor of foreign aid to any country in need.

 

Your comments about the military leave me speechless. Right up there with your understanding of socialism. IMO you should be forced to serve for a minimum of 2yrs. I'm about 1" away from saying that of everyone in the US really. Graduate high school, serve your country, then move on.

 

I'm glad that we agree on this point. There would definitely need to be some issues worked out but some level of mandatory military involvement would not be a bad idea. This would help to create a sense of service as well as discipline. As far as being a contributor to aid for the rest of the world, I am not sure why you are touting redistribution of wealth since that is a socialist idea and therefore must be "un-American". Regarding my comments about the military, I used incorrect verbiage stating that many are high school drop outs. For this, I apologize as the facts do not seem to support this but this does not change the facts that many lowlifes go to the military as a solution to their problems. To clarify to those that did not understand my remarks earlier, I am not saying that EVERYONE goes to the military because they have no better options, just that many do. I will further clarify that I appreciate the military's existence however I do not find that one is "doing something for the greater good" when they join the military for a paycheck and food. I do not feel the US military is doing a "good" thing by being involved in the current wars but I do recognize that not everybody serving believes this war is the "right" thing to do and they are stuck in this situation.

 

Next time you wake up, watch 9/11 again and perhaps add up the bodies of the bad guys that have been out to get you and me since. Think about how many more 9/11's would have been on our soil over the past 9 years if it wasn't for our actions. Again, Speechless.....and it takes a lot for ME to be speechless.

 

Hindsight is 20/20. How you could possibly say that since there have been no successful attacks on the US (most unsuccessful one's were not foiled by the military but by the general lack of planning and execution of the terrorist, I remind you) this somehow proves we have prevented them by the US going into these countries and blowing shit up? Wiki leaks documents showed that because of the way we were handling things, there were increased attacks on us and more people joining extremist organizations. Furthermore our military has been illegally wiretapping and spying on us since at least the Clinton administration and we were STILL unable to prevent 911. This is a perfect example of the simple failures of our powerful and world dominating military and intelligence operation.

 

None of this however speaks to reasons to dislike Obama so back on topic I want to confirm my understanding of why people hate Obama:

 

We have better things to do than discuss it for the thousandth time.

= I don't know but I love to hate.

 

Because I believe in the trickle down theory where obama does the complete opposite. Tax cuts don't do anything once I get laid off because my work couldn't afford to keep me due to tax increases.

= I prefer the rich to get richer and the poor to stay poor.

 

I like pumpkin pie.

= ?

 

how about this----

 

 

obama (gov't) takes half of my hard earned money, and redistributes it to people who don't deserve it.

 

obama pushed a bill through that directly affects what i do for a living---pushing me to work harder for less money

 

i'd say that's just cause to have a strong dislike for someone, wouldn't you??

=I am misinformed but I heard he was a socialist and that is a bad thing.

 

"communities are terrorized by ICE immigration raids"

- Senator Barack Hussein Obama

 

"I ceased to advertise my mother's race at the age of 12 or 13, when I began to suspect that by doing so I was ingratiating myself to whites"

- Senator Barack Hussein Obama

 

"I will stand with them (Muslims) should the political winds shift in an ugly direction."

- Senator Barack Hussein Obama

 

- He took the 2nd largest chunk of money from Fanny and Freddy.

 

- Google "Abongo "Roy" Obama"

 

- Or Google his cousin Odingo.

 

- Why hide his birth certificate?

 

 

= I watch Fox News and do what they tell me.

 

What is poor poor obama going to do without the use of his mouth? It's like he can't do anything at all

 

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20101126/ap_on_go_pr_wh/us_obama

= I don't have anything to contribute but I heard we was hatin on Obamas.

 

And finally of course:

 

• In short, no one has trust in his plan. IMO, it's not thought through.
  
• He's trying to spend his way into curing our issues. Dumb move, ain't gonna happen.
  
• His ideals are more socialist than anything we've seen and IMO, he can go pound salt if he thinks I should play a role in his Robinhood Games. His belief in distributing wealth is bullshit.

 

I could go on, but I leave some for the others.

= I don't trust him because I do not agree with his economic policies and He is a Socialist and I am so in bed with the glory of Capitalism because Socialism is the devil and the issue is black and white.

 

Now with all of that being said I would like to say Tim has been great arguing with and to address the Socialist idea I will provide this:

 

http://http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Politics/2010/0701/Is-Obama-a-socialist-What-does-the-evidence-say

 

After reading this you may find this helpful as to explain WHY Obama feels the way he does about the redistribution of wealth.

http://www.good.is/post/americans-are-horribly-misinformed-about-who-has-money/

 

Now after reading this I would recommend paying attention to the last line....I will repeat it here:

 

"We're becoming a plutocracy"

 

Plutocracy= http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plutocracy

 

 

And of course the wonders of capitalism:

 

http://www.scribd.com/doc/6674234/Citigroup-Oct-16-2005-Plutonomy-Report-Part-1

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticisms_of_Cargill

 

http://government.cce.cornell.edu/doc/html/PrisonsPrivatization.htm

 

Now as I final statement about all of this it would seem that most people are mad about the government intrusion into personal life or policies in general. This is completely understandable but one should direct these feelings accordingly. If you are angry about government polices, be angry with your representatives, lobbyists, and big business/ deregulated Capitalism in general. Just because Obama is the current "Man in the suit" as some have said, does not mean that he is the one behind everything that has gone on in the past 30- 40 years in politics. Thanks for sticking through such a ridiculously long post and hope you found it informative yet controversial.

[oh8sti]

You piss into the wind I bet. Don't you? Lol

[V8 Beast]

You piss into the wind I bet. Don't you? Lol

 

With his mouth open...

[I Eat Rice]

We have been a plutocracy since the early 90's I think. That is around when less than 10% of the U.S. popluation controlled over 90% of the nations wealth. Its been that way ever since. And guess what the rich will do with their money. They pour it into the political campaign funds of the of the officials they want elected or re-elected to insure that their campaign is top of the line and virtually a lock to win the election for whatever position being ran for. They control and get whatever they want in this country and their voice is the one always heard... Honestly, things will not change untill our country comes together as one like I said and actually does something to get the change we want. I call that revolution all over again and as the days go on a coup is starting to become an option that may solve all our problems. Btw I piss into the wind all the time trick is just get a really powerfull steady stream and it blasts its way through the wind and you have nothing to worry about just make sure and turn around with you back to the wind when you shake...

[V8 Beast]

We have been a plutocracy since the early 90's I think. That is around when less than 10% of the U.S. popluation controlled over 90% of the nations wealth. Its been that way ever since. And guess what the rich will do with their money. They pour it into the political campaign funds of the of the officials they want elected or re-elected to insure that their campaign is top of the line and virtually a lock to win the election for whatever position being ran for. They control and get whatever they want in this country and their voice is the one always heard... Honestly, things will not change untill our country comes together as one like I said and actually does something to get the change we want. I call that revolution all over again and as the days go on a coup is starting to become an option that may solve all our problems. Btw I piss into the wind all the time trick is just get a really powerfull steady stream and it blasts its way through the wind and you have nothing to worry about just make sure and turn around with you back to the wind when you shake...

 

 

Its the truth that we are not going to see change until we do it ourselves. Its too bad that we are so divided as a country that it will probably never happen. Its not even like we are divided in half. We have countless sections of people all wanting something different. Finding an equal medium is impossible.

 

I for one dont look to the government for change. They are just another bill collector. The only change I expect is how much they want me to pay them.

Edited November 29, 2010 by V8 Beast
I like to edit

[TTQ B4U]

It would seem we also have a misunderstanding of irony.....I guess we can just add that to the list, eh?

 

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/irony

 

Just posting up a link to the constitution and implying that I in some way have forgotten about it says nothing and proves nothing.

 

No misunderstanding. You implied, well pretty clearly stated really, that we forgot our roots of Jesus and all that jazz. I simply stated that I believe you're incorrect and that you need to fast forward about 1,800 years to the more modern day and review where this country really began. Roots that were not socialists by any means. We escaped that bullshit and I sure as hell am not going to support going back to it.

 

As far as being a contributor to aid for the rest of the world, I am not sure why you are touting redistribution of wealth since that is a socialist idea and therefore must be "un-American". [/Quote]

 

it's un-American as redistribution of wealth in the eyes of Obama and his socialist plans are about as un American as you get. More closely related to Marxism really.

 

Let's analyze your support for Obama and his idiotic plan for health care reform. Again, my insight comes from the Doctors in my family who are more than informed on it's impact.

 

A short list of things he wants to see:

 

• The Gov't is going to come in an audit the books of all employers that self insure.
   
  
• A Gov't committee (lead by a Health Choices Commissioner) will decide what treatments/benefits a person may receive. Can't wait for Kirk and the others in the medical field here to chime in on that one.
   
  
• This Health Choices Commissioner will choose your HC benefits for you. You will have no choice! AGain, the Gov't will OWN YOU.
   
  
• HC will be provided to ALL non-U.S. citizens, illegal or otherwise. Perhaps you like paying for all those illegals, but I DON'T.
   
  
• The Gov't will be issuing a National ID Health Card and have real-time access to your finances and health care spending. WOW! Just when I thought Gov't couldn't come any closer into my life. Again, the gov't just like other socialistic countries is going to ration health care! BULLSHIT!
   
  
• It will be illegal for a company to sue the Gov't for price fixing care. There will also be no judicial review against a gov't monopoly. Don't believe, me, read up on his plan.
   
  
• Employers will HAVE TO Automaticaly enroll employees into the public plan option. Ask me how I know.....I work for a large insurance company and we've had our debrief on how this will impact our clients.
   
  
• Employers will HAVE TO pay for health care for part time employees AND their families! Talk about impacting the small business owner. If said company has a payroll over $400k they wil HAVE TO PAY an 8% tax on their payroll towards this plan. WOW! Can't wait to see what happens to the prices of goods and services when that happens.
   
  
• ANY person not having an acceptable level of coverage determined by the HC Commissioner, will be taxed 2.5% of their income.
   
  
• AMERICANS will pay for all non residents aka illegial aliens as they will be held exempt from individual taxes. Thanks Obama! Thanks for making it better to live here illegally than it is to be a pure citizen of the USA.
   
  
• Here's a Kicker....ALL Doctors — doesn't matter what specialty — will all be paid the same. WOW! Talk about not inspiring a student to attend medical school. Thus is why there are shortages and long lines in Canada and the UK for even basic health care. You wouldn't know that though as unlike me, you've NEVER LIVED IN A SOCIALISTIC SOCIETY.
   
  
• Here's one that impacts my wife......the Gov't will instruct attorney's on living wills and durable power of attorney's. NO EXCEPTIONS. The gov't is going to control you up until the moment you die and even how you die. YES>...the Gov't will decide what level of treatment you can have even a
  

 

Should I have those in the know email you some more?

 

Hindsight is 20/20. How you could possibly say that since there have been no successful attacks on the US (most unsuccessful one's were not foiled by the military but by the general lack of planning and execution of the terrorist, I remind you) this somehow proves we have prevented them by the US going into these countries and blowing shit up?

 

Hindsight....I'm not using hindsight, it's a fact that if it were not for us kicking the ass of the bad guys on their turf that they would be right here in our faces with more 911 style attacks. I'll let the military folks here in the know school you on how they are protecting your ass.

 

Furthermore our military has been illegally wiretapping and spying on us since at least the Clinton administration and we were STILL unable to prevent 911.

 

You're right, we didn't prevent 911. however since then, we sure as hell have and it wasn't through anything other than kicking their asses back into their holes.

 

None of this however speaks to reasons to dislike Obama so back on topic I want to confirm my understanding of why people hate Obama:

 

If I've not given you enough facts on why I absolutely hate Obama and his being POTUS and his shit socialistic ideals, then you're flat out dumb.

 

I don't trust him because I do not agree with his economic policies and He is a Socialist and I am so in bed with the glory of Capitalism because Socialism is the devil and the issue is black and white.

 

Yep.....it's a fact, Capitalism is way better than Socialism. Don't believe me, as any citizens of Socialist China, UK or Canada. You don't see too many working class US Folks packing up and moving over there but you sure as hell see a ton of their people here. You do however, see tons of them flocking to our shores for treatments that they can't get in their "progressive" systems

[I Eat Rice]

Its the truth that we are not going to see change until we do it ourselves. Its to bad that we are so divided as a country that it will probably never happen. Its not even like we are divided in half. As a country we have countless sections of people all wanting something different. Finding an equal medium is impossible.

 

I for one dont look to the government for change. They are just another bill collector. The only change I expect is how much they want me to pay them.

All it takes is one crazy person that wants this fix bad enough then you just build an army of the easily persuaded people in this country,get them to fight for your cause and promise them something in the end. Hitler did it. I am no way saying he is a good person but damn he could pull a country together behind him and with that power of speech he convinced these people to take on the whole world and they WERE winning for a little bit that is the crazy part. There are so many white power people out there that are waiting for change they just need someone to pull them together into an army. I say lets pool all our money together and start a upriseing with our own army... Then the people will finaly get noticed. As my teacher told me in Government class a few years ago at BG it is the job of the people to take over the Government and start it over from scratch if our Government ever gets to much power. We were a country built for the people by the people and it was that way for a reason; because it worked, and now Government has gotten far to powerful and everyday our rights are being stripped away and we are getting closer to total Government control, because they have convinced us that we need them for protection. V for Vendeta (spelling may be off) was a movie about all of this. The author ment it to show where our country was headed in the years to come if we kept letting the Government control us and tell us what to do and control our lives out of fear. As far as the division that is running through our country goes that is simply because our Government was not built to be a 2 party system. It was built to vote in the best candiate for the people period. No Democrat or Republican bullshit that seemed to get invented as our country has grown and has done nothing but cause us problems and weaken our country as a whole.

[Tractor]

I hate Nancy Pelosi for officially killing the Rickroll

http://encyclopediadramatica.com/Nancy_Pelosi

[Tractor]

You don't know how someone would be taxed more than 35%??? Start your own business and count 50-80% as your new tax bracket my friend. Of course the one and really good way of dealing with that tax problem is buying things to write off as expenses, reducing your income.

[Scotty2Hotty]

I'm glad that we agree on this point. There would definitely need to be some issues worked out but some level of mandatory military involvement would not be a bad idea. This would help to create a sense of service as well as discipline. As far as being a contributor to aid for the rest of the world, I am not sure why you are touting redistribution of wealth since that is a socialist idea and therefore must be "un-American". Regarding my comments about the military, I used incorrect verbiage stating that many are high school drop outs. For this, I apologize as the facts do not seem to support this but this does not change the facts that many lowlifes go to the military as a solution to their problems. To clarify to those that did not understand my remarks earlier, I am not saying that EVERYONE goes to the military because they have no better options, just that many do. I will further clarify that I appreciate the military's existence however I do not find that one is "doing something for the greater good" when they join the military for a paycheck and food. I do not feel the US military is doing a "good" thing by being involved in the current wars but I do recognize that not everybody serving believes this war is the "right" thing to do and they are stuck in this situation.

You obviously have no idea, and obviously have never served. As it is a job, there is all walks of life. To define a majority of being lowlifes, is a bit off. Is there dirt bags in the military? Of course, but 90%+ are no where close to that. Since you have not been to either conflict, what you see is what you believe. Open your ears and talk to those that have been there and done that. You have no idea what went on day to day, so honestly your opinion really doesn't matter. You aren't the one fighting them, so there's no need for you to worry.

 

 

 

Hindsight is 20/20. How you could possibly say that since there have been no successful attacks on the US (most unsuccessful one's were not foiled by the military but by the general lack of planning and execution of the terrorist, I remind you) this somehow proves we have prevented them by the US going into these countries and blowing shit up? Wiki leaks documents showed that because of the way we were handling things, there were increased attacks on us and more people joining extremist organizations. Furthermore our military has been illegally wiretapping and spying on us since at least the Clinton administration and we were STILL unable to prevent 911. This is a perfect example of the simple failures of our powerful and world dominating military and intelligence operation.

I remind you during the Clinton time frame, radical Islam was on the rise along with Al-Qaeda. Shall I bring Somalia back into the frame, since you lefties love ragging on Bush 24/7. Talk about a cluster fuck, that administration dropped the Anti-Terrorism ball long ago.

None of this however speaks to reasons to dislike Obama so back on topic I want to confirm my understanding of why people hate Obama:

Guilt by association. He still runs around with the same crowd, and proving to use politics to fight conflicts.

[Scotty2Hotty]

BTW, even if you don't believe in the conflicts doing good, atleast we're giving them bigger targets that shoot back. We're keeping their attention on us as long as we're in their backyard. We could've done the Clinton response and just sent a couple Tomahawks at their door, but we went a little bigger this time and the rest of the world got involved.

[Slowbalt]

Its the truth that we are not going to see change until we do it ourselves. Its too bad that we are so divided as a country that it will probably never happen. Its not even like we are divided in half. We have countless sections of people all wanting something different. Finding an equal medium is impossible.

 

I for one dont look to the government for change. They are just another bill collector. The only change I expect is how much they want me to pay them.

 

I completely agree with this. Obama is not going to be able to fix the real problems in this country because he is within the system that needs to change. We will not see change come from within the system, it must come from the outside. We must provide the change to the point where the government can do nothing but listen to us.

[Slowbalt]

You don't know how someone would be taxed more than 35%??? Start your own business and count 50-80% as your new tax bracket my friend. Of course the one and really good way of dealing with that tax problem is buying things to write off as expenses, reducing your income.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporate_tax_in_the_United_States

 

Business are taxed at a few different levels in the US so it could be more or less than 35% based on the state but also have a few ways around them.

[Slowbalt]

Let's analyze your support for Obama and his idiotic plan for health care reform. Again, my insight comes from the Doctors in my family who are more than informed on it's impact.

 

A short list of things he wants to see:

 

• The Gov't is going to come in an audit the books of all employers that self insure.
   
  
• A Gov't committee (lead by a Health Choices Commissioner) will decide what treatments/benefits a person may receive. Can't wait for Kirk and the others in the medical field here to chime in on that one.
   
  
• This Health Choices Commissioner will choose your HC benefits for you. You will have no choice! AGain, the Gov't will OWN YOU.
   
  
• HC will be provided to ALL non-U.S. citizens, illegal or otherwise. Perhaps you like paying for all those illegals, but I DON'T.
   
  
• The Gov't will be issuing a National ID Health Card and have real-time access to your finances and health care spending. WOW! Just when I thought Gov't couldn't come any closer into my life. Again, the gov't just like other socialistic countries is going to ration health care! BULLSHIT!
   
  
• It will be illegal for a company to sue the Gov't for price fixing care. There will also be no judicial review against a gov't monopoly. Don't believe, me, read up on his plan.
   
  
• Employers will HAVE TO Automaticaly enroll employees into the public plan option. Ask me how I know.....I work for a large insurance company and we've had our debrief on how this will impact our clients.
   
  
• Employers will HAVE TO pay for health care for part time employees AND their families! Talk about impacting the small business owner. If said company has a payroll over $400k they wil HAVE TO PAY an 8% tax on their payroll towards this plan. WOW! Can't wait to see what happens to the prices of goods and services when that happens.
   
  
• ANY person not having an acceptable level of coverage determined by the HC Commissioner, will be taxed 2.5% of their income.
   
  
• AMERICANS will pay for all non residents aka illegial aliens as they will be held exempt from individual taxes. Thanks Obama! Thanks for making it better to live here illegally than it is to be a pure citizen of the USA.
   
  
• Here's a Kicker....ALL Doctors — doesn't matter what specialty — will all be paid the same. WOW! Talk about not inspiring a student to attend medical school. Thus is why there are shortages and long lines in Canada and the UK for even basic health care. You wouldn't know that though as unlike me, you've NEVER LIVED IN A SOCIALISTIC SOCIETY.
   
  
• Here's one that impacts my wife......the Gov't will instruct attorney's on living wills and durable power of attorney's. NO EXCEPTIONS. The gov't is going to control you up until the moment you die and even how you die. YES>...the Gov't will decide what level of treatment you can have even a
  

I certainly can understand their concern if they BELIEVE these things however these are not facts as you and they report them to be. The majority of these concerns were covered quite some time ago as they were a fake email composed to circulate and drum up support to "kill the bill". See the following:

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2009/jul/30/chain-email/health-choices-commissioner-does-not-decide-your-h/

 

 

and a more "point by point" look at the email:

 

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2009/jul/30/e-mail-analysis-health-bill-needs-check-/

 

If all the things you are saying about healthcare were true, I'd be against it too.

 

Should I have those in the know email you some more?

 

I would like SOMEONE in the know to show SOMETHING of fact. Maybe cite something?

 

Hindsight....I'm not using hindsight, it's a fact that if it were not for us kicking the ass of the bad guys on their turf that they would be right here in our faces with more 911 style attacks. I'll let the military folks here in the know school you on how they are protecting your ass.

 

This isn't Obama but again, people HAVE TRIED attacking us within OUR borders and it wasn't the military that stopped them......../point

 

You're right, we didn't prevent 911. however since then, we sure as hell have and it wasn't through anything other than kicking their asses back into their holes.

 

See point above

 

If I've not given you enough facts on why I absolutely hate Obama and his being POTUS and his shit socialistic ideals, then you're flat out dumb.

 

I am waiting for ANY facts really. I understand you have opinions about why he is so awful but it doesn't help your case when your opinions seem formed on things that are NOT TRUE. My point here is that if there are genuine reasons to not like Obama, I want to know because I have not found very many myself.

 

Yep.....it's a fact, Capitalism is way better than Socialism. Don't believe me, as any citizens of Socialist China, UK or Canada. You don't see too many working class US Folks packing up and moving over there but you sure as hell see a ton of their people here. You do however, see tons of them flocking to our shores for treatments that they can't get in their "progressive" systems

 

Again you use the word fact when it is anything but. There are aspects of Capitalism that are good and help us to out-compete other countries. I am not disputing that there are good qualities to Capitalism. What I am saying however is that there are INHERENT problems that have been on paper for quite some time that we are seeing right now. (Corporate greed, lobbying, distribution of wealth) I have friends in Canada and have been there many times. I also like to talk politics with many people of different areas and belief systems. That being said I don't find many Canadians that HATE their system. There are problems with wait times (over exaggerated in many cases) but no system is perfect. Take a look at Canada's life expectancy rates.....80 years vs 78 n the US. Japan even one ups that at 82 years and guess what? Universal healthcare there too. If you would only look at the facts you may begin to see a different story. As I stated before you are basically equating Obama to Socialism and then saying why Socialism is bad. This is misleading X2